720°
Submitted by tordavis 432d ago | article

Tits, Asses And Bare Chested Dwarfs…Give Me More

Torrence Davis of STFUandPlay writes, "As an old school gamer and a huge fan of 2D brawlers, I’ve been eagerly awaiting the release of Dragon’s Crown for PS3 and VITA. Vanillaware fills a void in todays game industry. Not only do they respect the mechanics of retro style video games, but they also have a knack for some very unique and beautiful art design. Recently, an article was posted on Kotaku disrespecting Vanillaware’s president and artist, George Kamitani. This article was posted in response to the over-sexualized character art presented in the game. The tone of the article was harsh, childish and unprofessional. It was written by Jason Schreier, from the upcoming White Knight Chronicles III. " (Dragon's Crown, Industry, PS Vita, PS3)

Snookies12  +   432d ago
"Recently, an article was posted on Kotaku disrespecting Vanillaware’s president and artist, George Kamitani. This article was posted in response to the over-sexualized character art presented in the game. The tone of the article was harsh, childish and unprofessional."

To be fair, the title of this article is a little childish as well... Also, I believe it would be Dwarves, not Dwarfs.

Other than that, I'm really looking forward to this game though. I don't care for over sexualised characters, but the gameplay itself looks really great. Seems like it would be a lot of fun with friends.
#1 (Edited 432d ago ) | Agree(25) | Disagree(10) | Report | Reply
zerocrossing  +   432d ago
I still think that for games to be accepted as a legitimate art form a certain level of creative freedom is vital, the over sexualisation of certain female characters may not be "necessary" but I fail to see how people view it as a detriment, especially when most movies that flaunt sex and violence are held in high regard.
dirigiblebill  +   432d ago
I think the Vanillaware stuff is playful, exaggerated (to the point of being somewhat grotesque) and thus inoffensive, but I also think it exists in a world where female games enthusiasts are at best cooed at and patronised, at worst insulted and threatened by a significant proportion of male enthusiasts - players who appear to have derived their understanding of the female sex from Dead or Alive. I don't think it's damaging, but I'm not sure it helps.

Either way, I think we can all agree that it's a complicated topic, and that knee-jerk assertions/dismissals get us nowhere.
SilentNegotiator  +   431d ago
Video games are a legitimate art form. People whine about anything exaggerated like that. It's just a hot topic right now because morons like Adam Sessler and Kotaku writers have started going after the topic with COMPLETELY the wrong "instances" (seriously, it still floors me how that simpleton made such issue over a trophy name).

Considering that they have other female characters NOT like that, it isn't like the game is saying "women are bags of tits and only 4 teh sex" as some people seem to allow themselves to imagine one character means.

Just ignore the foolish white knights and insecure women when they go after something like this, an absolute and total non-issue.
#1.1.2 (Edited 431d ago ) | Agree(14) | Disagree(1) | Report
NukaCola  +   431d ago
Why is this getting so much attention? This is one of the least offensive of many games that have come out. Game looks fun right out regardless of her look.
sonic989   431d ago | Offensive
WildArmed   431d ago | Not a reply | show
digitaleraser  +   431d ago
No, most movies that flaunt sex are considered trash by critics, with a few exceptions where the sex existed in the movie as a commentary on sex in movies. Movies are considered an artform in spite of trashy movies, not because of.

Also, no one is suggesting taking away anyone's creative freedom, they're simply mocking art that has an extremely immature and adolescent appearance. The ability to mock bad art is also a freedom, and if you say people should stop doing so, you're trying to censor their freedom of speech.
Knushwood Butt  +   431d ago
Agree.

All of the characters are caricatures, including the male characters.

Get over it.
zerocrossing  +   431d ago
@digitaleraser

People can complain if they think they have reason but they shouldn't insult the artist or those who are looking forward to Dragons crown, I would say if you are offended then just don't buy the game, the fact that such a huge issue has been made out of this by feminists and white knights seems very petty IMO, the game is obviously fantasy and art style for "every" character is over the top and exaggerated.

Honestly this whole debacle has come about because some people chose to see offence were none was intended...
SaiyanFury  +   432d ago
Honestly, in my own personal opinion (and ONLY my opinion) Kamitani-san should not only retract his apology about the art in Dragon's Crown offending people, he should tell those in the PC-police to shove off. How sensitive have people become when really large breasts are called "sexist"? Really? It's not like he designed a large breasted woman and relegated her to the kitchen or anything. She's a powerful Sorceress designed to kick major enemy arse. Doesn't seem like such a bad thing to me. I just think society's become too damned sensitive to every little thing. Political correctness = always having to say you're sorry.
TheTwelve  +   431d ago
Remember, even the male characters have exaggerated features.
DarkBlood  +   431d ago
pepperidge farm remembers
cr33ping_death  +   431d ago
@ Darkblood.... "remember when certain folks weren't allowed on on golf courses?" :-) good ol Futurama
joab777  +   431d ago
This entire argument is absurd. Do we live in a communist hemisphere in which every game must be the same? This is his art style and if ppl don't like it, they don't have to buy it. And gearbox's artist responded? Seriously. And I am sure that none of these guys watch porn either...or at least they don't tell their wives or misttesses. Give me a break. So, no one can ever make a game that would appeal to young men ever again because there a girl may be offended. This is the world we live in in which if one person is offended by something, it must be removed. So their beliefs and ideals are protected as free speech and expression but his is intolerant and hateful. Ok?
digitaleraser  +   431d ago
No one is saying the artist is intolerant or hateful, just immature and adolescent.

And no one is suggesting taking away anyone's creative freedom, they're just mocking bad art, which is also a freedom. And if you say people should stop doing so, you're trying to censor their freedom of speech.
GribbleGrunger  +   431d ago
Only a pervert would click on a headline like this ...
#1.5 (Edited 431d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(10) | Report | Reply
DarkBlood  +   431d ago
NO MINI ME NO *squirts water bottle*
cyguration  +   431d ago
So how many times did you click?
raymantalk1  +   431d ago
ROFLMAO @cyguration reply

i bet he clicked it loads gribblegrunger sounds like a pervert judging by his past comment history :)
GribbleGrunger  +   431d ago
Well, essentially, that WAS the joke ...
Panther07  +   431d ago
You can use dwarves or dwarfs.
FamilyGuy  +   431d ago
"Jason Schreier, from the upcoming White Knight Chronicles III"

Whaaaaaat, there is no white knight chronicles 3 in the works. Where did he hear this? o.O
Myst  +   432d ago
First thing I thought of when I saw that title -- http://youtu.be/DQhCEuqze3Q
#2 (Edited 432d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
cleft5  +   432d ago
Good article and I completely agree. It is insane to say that showing a sexy female character in a game encourages sexism in real life. And it is no different than saying violence in games create violence in the real world. The writer makes a lot of great points.
Chapter11  +   432d ago
This article is trash and was obviously written by a 15 year old.
Arai   432d ago | Immature | show
THE TRUTH  +   432d ago
Respect to Tor Davis and STFU I love the site,podcasts and articles keep up the good work. Btw stop eating on the warzone lol. Day one buy, it would be a day two buy without the extreme curves lol
#6 (Edited 432d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(3) | Report | Reply
smashcrashbash  +   431d ago
Kotaku are a bunch of idiots.That is all I have to say.I understand why Vanillaware got pissed at them.I constantly get pissed at Kotaku and I can see why they could get on someone's nerves.The people in Dragon's Crown were never meant to be taken seriously. Also who cares how they look or what they wear. As long as the women take an active role in the game and presented as strong, powerful characters instead of just eye candy I wouldn't care if they were naked.Fun fact, Amazons were completely naked warriors.
Sikct9a  +   431d ago
Any news on cross-buy? Either way I'm buying both.
Odoylerules000  +   431d ago
Sorry, no cross buy. The vita version is 10 dollars less than the ps3 version at least.
DragonKnight  +   431d ago
You all have to read the first comment on that article. It's GOLD!
Romudeth  +   431d ago
That was great! :D
MuhammadJA  +   431d ago
Yes, that's what gamers want. Instead of enjoying the hobby, they go for their sexual needs. Pathetic.
ShaunCameron   431d ago | Offensive
fsfsxii  +   431d ago
Ok, this is getting out of hand. Simply, if you like the characters and how its drawn, thats ok, if not, then stfu.
I will say it again, people who bashed that artist, are holding the industry back. What pisses me off is GB artist, she dares to speak after Aliens?? stupid bitch.
ShiftyLookingCow  +   431d ago
Don't forget the pile of sh~t that was Duke Nukem Forever.

Hypocrisy to the core.
digitaleraser  +   431d ago
"Stupid bitch."

Right, you're not sexist at all.
DragonKnight  +   431d ago
Calling a woman a stupid b*tch is no more sexist than calling a man a stupid dick. Don't start unnecessary B.S.
MeatAbstract  +   431d ago
I'm tired of stupid stuff being made into some kind of moral crusade by white nights and feminists.

So you think this is sexist? The games industry is pretty big now. Go play something that isn't like this and stop complaining. Because by saying it's sexist and complaining, you're essentially saying it should be changed and shouldn't exist in it's currently form. You're standing in the way of someones vision and creativity because you're mildly offended by a fun, cartoonish game.

It really annoys me when there are hundreds of games that please these PC, stuck up leeches that stifle creativity and turn their nose up at anything remotely over the top, can play and attack the few games that offend them.

I don't know about you guys, but I play games often to escape real world issues. I play games for enjoyment and escapism. I want to play Dragons Crown because it's fantasy and I know it's fantasy and I'm certainly not going to play it then think 'Wow, why aren't all women like this?'.

Please, stop being offended. It makes you a really unlikable person. The type of person that, when you go to a bar to have a fun night out, they'll be there looking annoyed, complaining about everything all night. Don't be that person, just try and enjoy things.
ShiftyLookingCow  +   431d ago
Feminism is a great idea. But prudish feminists(esp. men) who spew bs about sex in games are closer to the old joy hating Puritans.

Sexy media targeted at males should in the interest of equality spur discussion about how to make media sexy for women. But instead they act like anchors on Fox news about video game violence. They just want to shame and ban the art.
MeatAbstract  +   431d ago
I disagree that feminism is a great idea. That sounds terrible. It is a great idea and it worked wonders. No longer is it seen that a man has to be the 'head of a household' nor head authority figure. Look around and you see men and women in the western world are on such an even keel that you can only be amazed by how far we've come.

That's why I think modern day feminism is so horrible. A lot of what I see are feminists that attack gender rights groups, attack men like Warren Farrel (who has done more for feminist movement then any of these pseudo-intellects students) and generally look for a battle that isn't there.

Yeah there are some kinks we need to work out but I think modern feminism and even masculism or whatever the mens movement is called should be put aside as well. If people truly were for equal rights, you wouldn't focus solely on one gender, which is what groups like CAFE do and yet get attacked feminists groups for being a 'hate group' against women.
#12.1.1 (Edited 431d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(3) | Report
glopez  +   431d ago
Feminists want to be treated equal to men until they're treat equal to men. Then its "I can't believe he did/said that, doesn't he know I'm a girl!??"

O/T
The characters look OK for the type of game it is.
BuffMordecai  +   431d ago
You can have a game with extreme violence and gore and no one will bat an eye, yet if you throw in something suggestive, suddenly its an outrage. I swear, people are becoming more stupid by the day.
sonic989  +   431d ago
Couldnt agree more with you bro
b_one  +   431d ago
most of the time its not about tits or nudity, its kotaku...
DivineAssault  +   431d ago
DOA has more bouncing titties than this game so whats the big deal? Big tits exist so whats wrong with making a character with a pair? smh Game journalists are just hating on a great looking game..
b_one  +   431d ago
i have a suggestion, lets stop calling them journalists, just ranters
Romudeth  +   431d ago
The gaming industry is becoming more "pussified" each day. EVERYTHING is a fucking controversy now. Do these journalists just want E rated games that don't offend anyone? These white knights are trying to ruin it for the rest of us.

To paraphrase Suicidal Tendencies: "If you're offended maybe you needed to be offended".
Aghashie  +   431d ago
Come on... You talk about this like you have never read a comic, manga or seen an action movie. In all examples females characters are mostly sexualized toward male attraction or presented in a way that exploits sexuality as a medium for achieving more sales. Deal with it. Video games is not the only entertaining medium doing it. But of course, no one will complain about Wonder Woman wearing a 60s designed bikini to save the world or Cat Woman all covered really tight in imitation leather, and don't make talk about Poison Ivy... that 's a bush no man will dare to resist.

So, it happening on video games? Bah! Nothing new. Audience always like it.
Agrim  +   431d ago
How is the design of women in Dragon's Crown sexist, when only the sorceress and the amazon have exaggerated features and the other women don't?(Elf and the princess are proportioned and covered up).
If sorceress and amazon were the only females in the game, maybe I could agree but with so many other exaggerated characters in the game? No way.
#16 (Edited 431d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
ThreshStar  +   431d ago
I keep seeing this argument about how "Video games are totally art" but let's be honest for a second...

Movies, television shows, music, books/novels, and even paintings are all considered "art" and just like video games, they are also something else: A product.

If you are making something that is yours & yours alone for the soul purpose of showing it to other people without any monetary value, then it is completely "art". If you are selling something for the purpose of gaining revenue, it is now a "product".

Now, most entertainment mediums listed above fall into the gray area of being "art" and "product". For video games, if a game is made to be both "art" and "product", 2 things become apparent:

1.) It is not made by soul-less machines just trying to make as much money as possible
2.) It is NOT a complete art piece free of critique and value.

If you are making a video game, yes, it is your "art" so-to-speak, however you cannot then be annoyed that people are critiquing your "art"...that you're going to sell for a product.

Yes he has the artistic freedom to make his women look borderline offensive to some people. If it's an art piece, enjoy. If it's not, then prepare to defend your work. If you can't then either you don't believe in your creation...

or like everyone else, you hate criticism.
DragonKnight  +   431d ago
First, criticizing a product should strictly be about the products quality and not some imaginary themes that the critic wants to insert into the work. It also should stop BEFORE criticizing the artists maturity and integrity. Once it moves into that realm, it's not a critique, it's an assault.

Second, offense is a choice. Most people with any degree of intelligence steer clear of things that offend them and not purposely look for things they are offended by to then blow out of proportion. No one has the right to make everyone else offended with them because offense is strictly a personal choice based on personal experiences and sensibilities. What happened here wasn't limited to one person's offense. It was one person trying to make everyone offended and attacking a designer's very integrity and maturity. What part of that is "legitimate critique?"
ThreshStar  +   430d ago
...the fact that he's making a product to sell to the public leaves him open to most critiques within reason.

Comparing the game to Nazism or torturing children - not a good critique. Addressing possible issues of sexism (which the video game culture has ALWAYS had a problem with) - an average / legitimate critique.

Personally, I don't care what the artistry is and I think this game's design if fine. I do, however, have a capability to UNDERSTAND why this question would be asked. Just because you or I don't agree with it doesn't mean the question can't be asked.

What matters is the game developer keep a cool head and comes up with a professional, respectable response. Coming up with a "What are you, GAY?!?!" initial response - not the best way.
DragonKnight  +   430d ago
"Addressing possible issues of sexism (which the video game culture has ALWAYS had a problem with) - an average / legitimate critique."

Disagree. Sexism is prejudice or discrimination based on gender, it's attitudes or behaviour based on traditional gender roles, so a woman with large breasts is not sexist. It's fantasy. It isn't wrong to have a fantasy because it's not real. Therefore, it's not a judgement on the game's quality as art or a product, it's prejudice against the designer falsely claiming sexism where none exists and has its root cause internally and individually. That's the problem with the issue of sexism especially in games. Sexism in the workplace is a lot easier to see and has more real impact, in games it has to be clearly defined or else it's just people transferring their own issues to the game.

"I do, however, have a capability to UNDERSTAND why this question would be asked. Just because you or I don't agree with it doesn't mean the question can't be asked."

One should ask the right questions, and at the right times for the right reasons. Claiming that this game is sexist and that a 14 year old boy designed the characters simply due to large breasts is not the right question, for the right reason, at the right time. That's people trying to stir up B.S. reading into things that aren't there. It's linking an alleged desire for a woman with large breasts as being a devaluing moment against women, forcing men to see them only as sexual objects and nothing more. In reality it is nothing of the sort, and if it were something it would be a fantasy which all people are capable of having. Women are just as capable of drooling over the six pack muscled men in the game yet that "sexism" isn't even considered. Why? Again, because sexism in this case is merely internal, individual transference.

"What matters is the game developer keep a cool head and comes up with a professional, respectable response. Coming up with a "What are you, GAY?!?!" initial response - not the best way."

His response was equal to the attack against him. It may have been childish, but then so was the assault on his design and maturity. The author of this article raised the valid point that it shouldn't come as a surprise that when a man doesn't like "hot women" people will ask if he's into men. But, people are inferring that the designer was saying that by showing the pictures of those men. In actuality, he could have been showing that the men are just as over the top and unrealistic as the women and that there is a double standard ever present in the industry.

No one is addressing actual sexism/misogyny, they are addressing their own hurt feelings about society and calling it sexism/misogyny.
#17.1.2 (Edited 430d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(1) | Report
Run_bare  +   431d ago
If Japan can have it, why can't the rest of the world? are the west so arrogant that we are better than Japanese people or we (the west) are so fragile in our thinking and our mind eyes need to be protected from this sort of graphics.

I don't like censorship in any form "that excludes certain demographics/geographics" . If they can have it, why shouldn't we?
Agrim  +   430d ago
lol 720º

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