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Always On Xbox 720 is a "Horrible Conceptual Shift Like iTunes" - Creative Director, thechineseroom

GB: "Thechineseroom, developers of Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs, have shared their thoughts on DRM and always online connection for the next Xbox, in a yet to be published interview on GamingBolt.

We asked Dan Pinchbeck, Creative Director of the studio about what he thought about the rumors surrounding Microsoft's next Xbox like no used games and always online internet connection requirement."

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Dlacy13g2072d ago

Read the interview, that title is not at all reflective of the actual interview vibe. Save yourself the read...the important stuff below.

“I’m ambivalent about used games – a used game makes the developers no money, which means you are hurting developers buying them,” he told us.

“Especially given you can pick up older games really quickly and easily on sales, where the developers actually get a cut, I think if you love games as a medium, you should be doing that wherever you can. I think blocking is not so good though, I think it’s better to work on the basis that most people are basically honest and do the right thing than to over-police it.

He also finds the always online requirement really intrusive and says it’s a DRM exercise.

“Always on.. Well, unless its a multi-player game there’s no reason for it, it seems like a pure marketing and DRM exercise, and I think it’s really intrusive. If I buy a game, I want to own it, so I can transfer it to any of my devices, play when I want, where I want, on or offline. It’s part of this horrible conceptual shift like iTunes where although it looks like you are buying media, actually you only really are renting access to it, and I have a pretty big problem with that.”

JeffGUNZ2072d ago

Yeah, he doesn't know how itunes work. when you "buy" the track, you don't rent to access it, you buy the rights to that song. So, if you delete it, you can always redownload it forever. "Rent for access" would fit more clearly on programs like Spotify. "Always on connection" doesn't bother me really at all. My phone is always online and connect through my wifi, unless you're running a child porn operation or other illegal activities, who cares if it is always connected? Also, I highly doubt it HAS to be connected for it to function.

KwietStorm2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

So why did you put "buy" in quotes? And buy the rights to the song? No, you don't own the rights to the song. If you owned the rights, you could remix it and sell it for yourself. And correct me if I'm wrong, but when you "buy" songs on iTunes, isn't it only "transferable" through devices tied to your iTunes account?

KrisButtar2071d ago

i disagree with you because i live 25mins outside the city, and internet is not offered in the area, so "always online" means i cant play, or for another example the ps4 share button means nothing to me as i dont have internet. im lucky my job has me driving a lot or i couldnt even use my phone to get online. please dont alienate people who dont have an internet connection, by saying "running a child porn operation or other illegal activities" when there are far more reasons then those.

Highlife2071d ago

@kwietStorm
Yes when you buy from itunes you can only use it on idevices unless you pay a little more for DRM free. This is why I don't own apple products!

Saigon2071d ago

@KwietStorm,

You can actually transfer the music to other devices from itunes, you just need to know how. This is really the main problem. the average person does not know how to manipulate their devices. I for one, down load music all the time and transfer them tto itunes. Before I had an apple device I had a blackberry and a MP3 player and had to transfer my music over. I beleive there was a converter I used to initially apply the transfer, but I still did it. I also recently just moved some itunes files over from my PC to a cloud service I use with no problem, and the music still works on what ever device I transfer to. I think it is the matter of the know how.

MS is suppose to allow cross game play on any device when the Next Xbox is announced. I don't know how that would fair, but the concept seems interesting. I hope the concept or thought works, because it would give me another reason to buy.

SilentNegotiator2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

"And correct me if I'm wrong, but when you "buy" songs on iTunes, isn't it only "transferable" through devices tied to your iTunes account? "

As a matter of fact, you are wrong there. I can transfer my songs to any device and then from device to device, burn it to CD, etc.

Yeah, yeah, iTunes' ToS says this and that, Bruce Willis can't give his kids his account upon death....but ultimately, it's very nonrestrictive of what you can actually DO with the purchased songs on iTunes.

And what makes you think you would own the rights to SELL a song (remixed or not) because you spent $0.99 to $1.29 on it? lol

Mr_Writer852071d ago

Yes you do rent it that why Bruce Willis is annoyed he can't put his i-tunes collection in a will to his daughters when he dies.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/f...

JeffGUNZ2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

@ KwietStorm

I should have worded it better, I apologize. I am trying to say when you purchase a song to itunes you own the rights of a consumer purchase to the song. I read my post and it came across like I said you actually OWN the song, my bad lol. I mean when you buy it you own the rights you would as if you bought the CD. Also, I take music off itunes regularly to other devices. It's actually very easy to do and also, you can just burn it on a CD, then rip it off the CD into whatever program you want. If you google it, you can see other simple ways to move it to other non-itunes devices.

gunnerforlife2071d ago

http://www.macrumors.com/20...

Read that! that was first time i found out that i dont own all my itunes songs, and thats when i stopped buying music from Itunes.

+ Show (5) more repliesLast reply 2071d ago
Jek_Porkins2072d ago

Thanks for saving me the time, the main thing is that nothing is confirmed by Microsoft. We do know games like Destiny is going to be always online, and right now my Xbox 360 is technically always online, it boots to online everytime I start it.

That doesn't mean you cant play offline, and I highly doubt Microsoft becomes the only company to block used games. Some people buy a new game, beat it, trade it in and buy the next. Doubt Microsoft wants people to go into a Gamestop and see only Sony and Nintendo items for sale.

Anyway, I'm going to wait until an official reveal before I cast judgement.

Godmars2902072d ago

As it stands MS is the only console maker next cycle who's likely to do it. Which is going to be a contradiction if they allow for backwards compatibility. Of physical games.

It just occurred to me that if they cut used games, BC for them might mean allowing you to re-buy Xbox 360 titles digitally to play on Xbox3.

kabala2072d ago

The only problem I have with the 360 is when you buy an arcade game like Castle Crashers. When my kids try to play it & the 360 isn't online they have to play the trail version. Once they go online they can now play the full version. I bought it so why I have to be online to play it?

KwietStorm2071d ago

I would assume you know the difference, but you make it sound like you don't. Just because your 360 is hooked up to a broadband connection, it has nothing to do with Microsoft requiring an internet connection for it to operate, *if* this is the case. If for whatever reason your connection at home went out, your games wouldn't work, because they would never get to the authentication process.

darthv722071d ago

it sounds more like you had/have more than one 360 in your home. Generally what happens (if you have only 1) is the purchases you make are tied to that system and the content can be used by all people who have access to that system. they can have their own gamertags and even silver accounts but the content itself is tied to the system and playable both on and offline.

In your case, it sounds like you made the purchase through one system and then have downloaded it to another. What happens there is the gamertage that made the purchase can play the game only if connected to xbox live. All other accounts will get the trial version of the same content.

This is why they created the license transfer option. When you do a license transfer, it basically transfers the purchased license from one system to another but you will then need to redownload your purchased content for the license transfer to take effect. I had the same issue with my 360 (I have 3). I have one that i do all my purchases through and it happens to be the one with my kids gamertags on it as well.

I can then go to another system, sign in as myself, download the same content and play as myself while the kids can play the game on the originating console using their own gamertags.

I tend to keep arcade games on a flash drive along with MY profile so i can freely move about the different systems in the house.

shutUpAndTakeMyMoney2071d ago

They won't be the only to charge for multi player!

oh wait...

Kurt Russell2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

Do they fail to realise that when I trade games in, it is to buy a new one I would otherwise not afford? I traded a bunch of old ones in this past weekend to get my hands on Tomb Raider, I wouldn't have bought/afforded it without doing so.

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 2071d ago
Godmars2902072d ago

Always on is going to be the biggest issue if it happens.

Used games are one thing, but by requiring an online connection rather than building around it will actively alienate consumers. And its really not going to help when people w/o a connection buy a system, find out the hardway it wont work for them, then have to argue with the store who likely wont give a straight-up refund.

Gildarts2072d ago Show
KrisButtar2071d ago

you know im one of those people, i live 25mins outside the city and internet is not offered here, i drive a lot because of my job which gives me a chance to be online threw my vita/cell/laptop, the online connection was the single reason i didnt buy simcity after buying diablo 3 and it not working, i learned my lesson. also going a little off topic, the share button on the ps4, while its cool, its not a selling point for me because of no internet along with their gaikai services

Godmars2902071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

Yeah. Always online is/has happened. If you bought a PS3 or Xbox 360 and you don't have an online connection, you didn't get what you paid for because a good portion of promised features aren't actually on the consoles.

Still, if MS comes right out and says you have to have online to play the physical copy of a game you bought its going to be utterly ridiculous.

JeffGUNZ2071d ago

Again, we know nothing about the next xbox, but I can't see how they would do this. It just doesn't make sense. I could see that you get MORE cool features and different types of service if you're always connected, but I highly doubt they will require an internet connection to ALWAYS play. I also can't see them blocking used games, like another poster above stated, you really think MS wants people to go to gamestop and only see used Nintendo and Sony products? I doubt that.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 2071d ago
nosferatuzodd2070d ago

Oh yes they will do it , everybody forget that right at this moment in time if you bought any downloadable games off Xbox life you can only play the demo if you're not online when you sign in then you get the to play the full game .

AngelicIceDiamond2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

I believe MS will have the option of Always Online console. Kind of like they can enable or disable at anytime.

You see if MS had it for the Users and consumers that would be great to have an the option to download as many DLC, game Updates, installs, system updates etc as you want with out waiting or having to physical sign on like have it done in the background that would be tite.

I hope MS doesn't use it for corporate reasons and block used games. Again it wouldn't be a problem if it was optional and used for the gamer and not devs.

Simon_Brezhnev2071d ago

well there is some new leak on gaf
http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

- Always on, Always connected
- Low powered mode
- Kinect sold with every console, wider FOV, no motors, better tracking
- Kinect is required to be plugged in
- Low latency controller with "improved ergonomics", simplified interaction with console OS
- Bluray drive
- All games must be installed on HDD [you can start playing few secs after installation starts], game data streaming from optical disc not supported
- Only digital audio out

I hope its not true if not i dont know what to say.

ceedubya92071d ago

Maybe I'm not looking into this as hard as I should, but this doesn't seem like it is that big of a deal to me. We really just need more details on what some of this will actually mean.

-Always on, Always connected: Unless this is saying that the console has to be online in order to play games, then I don't see the problem. My consoles now are always connected when I start them up. perhaps the always on is more so of a function of hands-free startup?

-Kinect required to be plugged in: Sounds like it is more so a part of console package as opposed to a standalone accessory. It may be required for the console to function, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it is required to use Kinect in every game.

The installed games thing is fine as long as HDD is large enough or provides easier options for upgrading.

I don't know. Like I said, perhaps I'm just not looking at this right and there really is reason to be worried. But, other than rumors, we don't have much to go on right now, and a lot of the negative stuff about the console just seem a little too far fetched to true.

jetlian2071d ago

sounds like big brother to me! MS even thinks of doing it im done with them. It will be the first time l ever straight up not buy a console with games l want

ZombieKiller2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

The no used games part kinda bothers me. Yeah I love to support the games industry, don't get me wrong, but this is headed down the path of complete control over us. Think about it this way....yeah we discounts for buying used, but developers have come up with other ways to make money with microtransactions, online pass, season pass, etc....SO WHAT NOW? Does this mean that because they're in full control of us buying new, that prices are going to rise? Look at freaking COD, $60 for the game, $50 for the 'other half' of the game via DLC, now these Microtransactions... without used games, I feel like shit is going to get REAL expensive. Not to mention, the game THROWS you into a lobby where the other team is STOMPING, and you get banned, on something you bought btw, for leaving? I like having freedom in my games, but we keep being stripped of those freedoms. On top of that glitches, bugs, and stuff that's not even fixed before the first DLC pack releases....I'm sorry but no thanks. Just the other day they allowed you to BUY xp for Gears. This is turning into whoever has the most money and best connection wins....not whoever has the most skill/love for the game....Im not buying. If they don't get ya with the price of the games, yet all are DLC, think about how much the HDD will be. Or and other perefrials ou're going to NEED to successfully play games. Black Flops 1 took almost 8gb, which is HALF my HDD space on my 20gb, and that game is obsolete as of 2 years ago. I'm not falling for this crap anymore.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 2070d ago
mr_kubrick2072d ago

So where does he actually talks in his Interview about the XBOX 720??? Right, nowhere.

Oh right, i forgot...Articles sell better with the Xbox in title, even the guy doesnt refer to it in his interview.

And sadly, these sites call themselves journalists....

wishingW3L2072d ago

that's true. He's only talking about DRM from a general perspective.

gameseveryday2072d ago (Edited 2072d ago )

The article clearly states:

"We asked Dan Pinchbeck, Creative Director of the studio about what he thought about the rumors surrounding Microsoft’s next Xbox like no used games and always online internet connection requirement."

Dlacy13g2071d ago

@Rashid, yes the interviewer was steering in the direction of the Next Xbox rumors, but you can clearly see Dan Pinchbeck was talking very generally about DRM and always online.

And a side note...why are not more people all "Up in arms" over his comments about used games. LOL...we always try to pin the used game issue on the console makers but I think its pretty clear devs and publishers are the real ones with the axe to grind.

Gildarts2072d ago

How did this get approved in the first place?

Knight_Crawler2071d ago

Its N4G...an article about MS Kinect helping in Brain Suregery and finding a cure for cancer would probably never get approved or get as much attention but an article about a negative rumor or false article would reach the front page in matter of minutes.

I am conviced that the mods are bias on this site and dont really care about anything as long as it generates hits.

Gamer-402072d ago

No problem, i buy ps4 and wiiu.

Gamer-402071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

@ALLWRONG @Hicken

I not Sony, Nintendo, MS fanboy. I'm simply video gamer, and i like all AAA games all platform. Yet Ps3/X360 owner, and retro consoles: ps1, ps2, GC, Xbox.

But this rumor is true next xbox: always on, always connected and so focusing Kinect, i not buy.

One problem this site -N4G-, so many only PS fanboy, ALWAYS ONLY PS. This people say, everything else it is a shit, and doomed. Wrong thinking!

Gamer-402071d ago

Ps4 not out yet? Man, this sad:(
Thanks, but i know.

ALLWRONG2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

That same kind of comment would be removed in minutes if this was about the PS4. 5 hours later and your comment is still here. Just shows the priority of N4G and it's MODS. Just look up and down with all the PS4 related comments.

Of course if you tell the truth and make a good comment, this happens. http://n4g.com/news/1213150...

Hicken2071d ago

Convenient how you're telling that tale now that you're down to one bubble. When all the Sony "fanboys" were saying it, though, it was somehow invalid.

Tell me: if the site's mods have the preference you say, why is someone like me- who you and many others will swear up and down is a Sony fanboy- sitting here with one bubble, instead of the 50 that a troll like LOGICWINS has?

Funny that when you or any of the other pro-360 people say it's a Sony-run site, you conveniently forget how many pro-Sony people have the least possible number of bubbles, and don't seem to notice how comparatively difficult it is for people with your own preference to reach that low.

maniacmayhem2071d ago

@Hicken

I can answer that..

Maybe because someone like you is incapable of having a solid opinion or discussion without bashing, criticizing, or turning the subject into a console bash fest.

You throw the term troll around but you have no clear definition. Something I still have too by the way. You see in your head a troll is someone who doesn't like Sony. So any comment for example made by Logicwins that doesn't favor your Sony you think is he's trolling.

Everyone sees what they only want to. I see one bubbles on all sides.

Hanso2072d ago

wow next gen xbox sounds like a nightmare with always online

GribbleGrunger2072d ago (Edited 2072d ago )

Can I point out that it doesn't say and never has said 'always online'. It HAS said and always has said that it will be 'always on'. This could be and probably IS to do with the fact that the 720 has a low energy setting that enables the console to download patches in the background, similar to the standby mode on the PS4.

My only worry would be the fact that you may well (according to the latest leaks) HAVE to use Kinect for everything in some way.

Dlacy13g2071d ago

Good point regarding always on. As for the Kinect part, I was under the impression its not that Kinect will always be used in some way for everything but rather Kinect was going to be a required plug in component. That was the rumor via the leak on VGLeaks atleast... but who knows what reality will be.

HmongAmerican2071d ago (Edited 2071d ago )

I wouldn't want that thing to spy on me while I gaming.

ceedubya92071d ago

Good point. This was my thinking as well. I'm thinking that Kinect won't be as big of a problem that most people think. I think it will mostly be for voice commands and hands-free menu navigation, but as far as game are concerned, as far as how it is used will still primarily be up to the developers.