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Why 60 Frames per Second Won’t Be The Standard Next Generation

60 frames per second (FPS) is something that every console gamer have been asking for since the release of the PS3 and Xbox 360, and very few games have delivered. Many gamers have made up excuses as to why we still haven’t made 60 FPS the standard, the most common one being that current generation hardware simply isn’t capable of a solid 60 FPS. This is far from the truth. Making 60 FPS a standard isn’t a hardware limitation; rather it’s a developer limitation.

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Tacklebait1384d ago

why not make 45 fps a standard? I don't understand the need to double the frames from 30. 45 will seem smoother and when a game dips in frames during intensive graphical moments we won't see the choppy 20-25 fps as seen in some games.

As well there won't be as large of a requirement for hardware to be dedicated to rendering those extra frames as 60fps would need.

Muffins12231384d ago

when you get higher and higher,it takes more fps to see a difference,45 to 30 is not that noticeable unless your a pc gamer who has a native eye to it.

akaakaaka1384d ago

okay super human.. when i grow up i want to have super powers like you mr pc gamer.. lol

Jobesy1384d ago

Your comment is exactly why people don't like pc gamers such as yourself Muffins.

Ot, I would really like if every game would be 60 fps, but 30 fps LOCKED IN would be acceptable. If we get the kind of framerate crashes like in Fallout this coming gen there will be some hell to pay.

Speaking of Fallout, I hope Fallout 4 is announced at this years E3.

Spoon_1384d ago

But that's the main thing we asked for all the pc elitist laughed and joked us about this why is 1080p 60fps not standard if we are going to have this console for another idk 7 years that will help

Dannycr1384d ago

To the guys mocking Muffins, although it sounded "elitist" it is kinda true.

There are a LOT of gamers who does not know about this whole FPS differences. A good example will be Modern Warfare (60fps) Vs Black Ops (30fps), people just say/think it is "slower" but no, the frames made a BIG difference in gameplay.

Don't trash his opinion just yet because he's right. PC gamers have to keep tweaking settings to get the most stable frame rate in a lot of demanding games so they are used to somehow know when a game drops frames. It is not a superhuman ability, they are just accustomed to this, however, anyone can get accustomed to it.

Hydrolex1384d ago

45 would be good, as long as it is SOLID and doesn't drop... Anything over 40 is actually pretty good

Fluke_Skywalker1384d ago

As a PC and Console gamer, I may be able to straighten this argument a little.
30fps is fine, Far Cry 3 on consoles, is not fine.
The only reason PC gamers notice the difference from 60fps to 30 is hecause we've got 60fps. Its like they say, you don't appreciate things until they're gone. Or in the case of console gamers, they've never had 60fps, well very rarely at least, so they don't really appreciate it.
I personally don't mind 30fps games as long as it doesn't go below that like Far Cry 3 which is absolutely horrible to play on consoles.

So, to summarize, no you don't have to be super human, or a PC gamer to see the difference in 30fps to 60fps but you have to have seen the difference first to be able to see the difference, you get me?

And anyway, any PC gamer still playing at 60fps is a noob, we're at 120fps now, do catch up!

ninjahunter1383d ago

I think the concept Muffins was getting at is that PC gamers will generally tweak their settings to get a certain FPS that they are used to, For example, i Cannot stand playing a game at less than 40 FPS. So the idea is that PC gamers would have more experience between smaller differences in FPS, where console gamers generally only experience 30 fps and 60 fps.

At least thats the idea i have in my head. Not saying that Console gamers have inferior eyes or anything, I just think PC gamers are probably more prone to noticing smaller difference in FPS.

Krew_921383d ago (Edited 1383d ago )

As pretentious as it might sound... It's true. It makes sense that people who only game on console be used to the 30 FPS frame rate. PC gamers generally see 40+ FPS, so their brains are used to the higher frame rates.

For example when I got a gaming PC I got used to the 40+ FPS, now most of the console games I see as slow, now this doesn't mean the games suck, your brain just gets used to the 30 FPS again. Until you go back to 40+ FPS, then your brain gets used to that again.

Again though, it would be obvious for this to occur.

SilentNegotiator1383d ago (Edited 1383d ago )

You're full of it.

A 15 frame difference is noticeable, be it from 30 to 45 or 45 to 60. I don't care if you do have SuperElitistMan's eyes and are used to higher rates, you're going to be able to tell the difference. I don't care if you have no idea what a "framerate" is...you're still going to be able to tell that one game runs a lot smoother than the other!

If I had never touched a PC in my life, I would still notice the major difference between the ~45fps of God of War 3 and the typical 30fps of other console games.

+ Show (8) more repliesLast reply 1383d ago
kenoh1384d ago ShowReplies(1)
Eyesoftheraven1384d ago (Edited 1384d ago )

Because most monitors native refresh rate is 60Hz. It just looks "right" and so much smoother. The image also appears clearer/sharper as well since there is more information being shown from 30fps to 60fps. Even a low latency render time between frames at a steady 45fps will have a slight judder to it, because it is out of sync with the monitor's exact refresh rate. Movies' suspension of disbelief benefit from this effect, games do not--especially when it comes to mouse control. I have yet to see what 60fps looks like on a 120Hz monitor though.

nirwanda1383d ago

Sorry i didnt read your reply first before i typed mine

Kaiou1384d ago (Edited 1384d ago )

omg you read my mind, i came here to say the EXACT same thing. for example my pc couldn't run the witcher 2 at 60 FPS so i capped my frame rate to 45 , and it's a lot smoother than 30 so much that it's actually hard to tell the difference between it and 60FPS as long as it doesn't dip down.

Stability > FPS number ( a stable 30 is better than a 60 that keeps dipping down to 40s)

brich2331384d ago

Found this at wikipedia:

"Thomas Edison said that 46 frames per second was the minimum: "anything less will strain the eye."

Grap1383d ago (Edited 1383d ago )

well he was wrong so does his 110V crap.

nirwanda1383d ago

Its more to do with the way tvs handle the signal, lcd's for instance have generally change depending on what signal its fed thats why modern tvs now have a 24hz mode to match the film frame rate so it updates without having to invent frames and keeps it smooth.
Lcds usally have a 24hz 50hz 60hz and some have 100hz and 120hz.
Plasmas work at much higher refresh rates so its not just as simple as play it at 45 frames as tvs dont like it and it will judder more

DeadlyFire1383d ago (Edited 1383d ago )

I could see 720 resolution at 60 fps, but 1080 is only going to be 30 fps this generation. I guess we know which resolution CoD is going to be. As 2 Tflops is not nearly enough juice to push 60 fps Unreal Engine 4, CryEngine 3, and so on at 1080. I suspect WiiU is aiming at 720 with 30 frames per second.

Epic games clearly stated that their UE3.9/4 Samaritan demo could run at 1080p with 2.5 Tflops around with around 30fps. Now take into consideration that PS4 is likely pushing 1.9-2.0 Tflops altogether. So take that into consideration. Some optimization here and there likely got us to 1080p at 30 fps. Now the older game engines could work out with 1080 and 60+ fps, but all the new special graphical effects wont exist in most cases.

If PS4 and X720 were somewhere close to 3+ Tflops then yeah 1080 would be possible at nearly 60 fps.

asbuwango1383d ago

Because most TVs are 60Hz
45fps will be more inconsistence than a rock solid 30fps

at least thats what i understood

Psn8001383d ago

Why have 45fps when you got a console capable of 65fps ? It's the devs not the console .

ATi_Elite1383d ago

1080p 60 fps is the GOLD STANDARD!

if u say it's not then your a fanboy making up excuses for your platform.

1080p = Full HD

60fps = gets you butter smooth picture and gameplay

The Hardware limited Devs from delivering AAA 1080p 60 fps on consoles last Gen. This Gen seems more capable!

jmc88881381d ago

That's not how it is. TV's are made to display certain standards.

1080i is 30 frames
1080p is 60 frames

Then you have hdtv's with 120hz
240hz
Plasma's with 600hz

Thus the idea is to have the games/media displaying what the HDTV has the ability to show.

The reason why you don't have 240p media is that it would blow up your cable provider and make blu-ray discs obsolete.

It's slowly going to rise, as you have both resolution AND frame rate that takes up bandwidth or storage.

Actually the thing that is more important is not having dips at all. Even if you have dips from 60 to 55 it is noticeable, just like 30 to 25 is. It's just overall it'll remain smoother.

Once they go up to say 240hz a drop to 235 would be harder to notice, but even at 60fps the eye can still notice the change.

The human eye can easily see and recognize something flashed in less than 1/200th of a second. The navy did tests and in that short of a timeframe the people taking the test could tell it was an airplane and even identify what model it was. If you go from being able to identify concretely the model of airplane to just noticing a difference you could be multiples higher. So really the plasma 600hz is probably what we'll eventually reach with 16kTV, etc, etc.

But it's going to take a while for the bandwidth, processing power, and storage to be able to handle all of this.

...and just when you thought it was easy here comes holographic tv and virtual reality.

+ Show (8) more repliesLast reply 1381d ago
PopRocks3591384d ago (Edited 1384d ago )

Devs will always struggle to optimize their games at the highest possible settings at which point the console will struggle to run said games smoothly. Unlike PC tech which can be upgraded, dedicated consoles have their limits and don't usually offer ways around them (RAM upgrade for the N64 and storage upgrades for HD consoles are exceptions to that).

If you have a graphically intensive game that's pushing the console to its limits then it is more difficult to run the game at a higher framerate. It also depends on how sufficient the developer is; Gears of War 3's framerate was fairly solid from what I remember. Sonic Generations' framerate is pretty low and dips when there is a lot of action on the screen. Same with Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed.

There is a ton of different factors as to why a game may run the way it does. It really just depends on how a game is made and how capable its creators are.

shutUpAndTakeMyMoney1384d ago (Edited 1384d ago )

Don't mention pc this week ps3 and soon to be ps4 only players are hot heads follow my lead k?

ps4 >>>>>>>pc .

console games may or may not be all in 60fps. I don't think they will be. Devs will want to squeeze out all the juice and won't want to waste resources. I imagine all ps4 games at 1080p, 60fps then as ps4 gets old(and some don't think it can get old)devs would have to start lowering the FPS?? This would be a huge lowering of quality over time.

I expect most ps4 games to be 1080p 30-40fps. I don't all console games will be 1080p 60fps until power is not really a problem. So ps5- ps6 it is.

PopRocks3591384d ago (Edited 1384d ago )

A game console can't be better than a PC specs wise. PCs are consistently upgradeable. And either way, they will probably come out with new cards and processors that beat out the PS4's specs within a year. That's just the way the PC parts market work.

CouldHaveYelledUiiW1383d ago

@shutUpAnd

"Don't mention pc this week ps3 and soon to be ps4 only players are hot heads follow my lead k?

ps4 >>>>>>>pc ."

I am certain that was a joke.
And Hilarious. "FUNNY" bubble-up vote.

I am a Nintendo Fanman (still sounds lame) BUT everyone should knows that a Max Specs PC is always going to beat the performance of a console.

A console can only be better because every build is the same. Unlike a PC game that has to cater to a wide array of builds and chips.

A Consoles uniformity may allow for certainty in developers- but even with that there is only so much you can do with any architecture.

That is why consoles have GOT to be about Game-play and Interface; less about power (They can be powerful but after 7 years they will be quickly surpassed).

Towelie-20001383d ago

Ey man, i might be wrong, but was the PS3 not the first ever console to use blu-ray? Also ps4 has the intention of doubling the screen resolution to 2160 x whatever the hell it is p:) all microsoft and wii can do is reverse engineer the PS console genius (except that new 12gig super slim thing). is the PS4 not named the Orbis? Anyone read about the "Orbis le Vita" concept? that is one point i think playstation can and should exclude..

jon12341384d ago

funny how every pc gamer always resorts to graphics... graphics doesnt make a game...

Bordel_19001384d ago

Frames per second isn't a graphics thing. It's about game-play. Once you get used to playing games at 60+ frames per second, 30 fps seems like a lag-fest. Call me elitist or whatever tickles your fancy. 60 fps is so much better than 30 fps, and no it does not make the graphics better, it makes the game-play so much better.

Example? Yeah, Gran Turismo 5 would be a different beast at 30 fps, a lot less responsive and not as smooth as it is at 60 fps (yes, I know it does not manage to maintain a steady 60 fps, but anyway almost no console game does. Console games struggle to even keep a steady 30 fps.)

Bordel_19001384d ago

Want to add/correct to the above post.

Frames per second isn't mainly a graphics thing, though at 60 fps graphics are much smother and kind pop out of the screen at you, it's about how much better the game-play feels. I would rather have 720p 60 fps than 1080p 30 fps.

papashango1384d ago (Edited 1384d ago )

Fps has nothing to do with graphics. 30 And 60 fps are two completely different experiences. I game at over 100fps btw. 30 Fps is a massive headache for me now.

if valve shoots for 60fps gaming they have a serious shot to run away with the crown.

Irishguy951383d ago

Funny how Ps4 fanboys BS about graphics..then when PC gamers correct them Ps4 fanboys move onto games like the PC gamer was trying to attack them

So defensive over their weak *** console.

jon12341383d ago

Fanboy? Haha who ever said I was taking sides with Sony, although I do love their products, I don't like pc people who gloat about having better games or higher fps, and although I know fps don't have to do with how graphically intense any game looks, it still doesn't make any game, anymore better than games on a console I can enjoy playing games like bf or gta on a console with out having to worry about updating my drivers... So annoying

SpinalRemains1381383d ago

They only need to rely on graphics until they get their metal legs.

jmc88881381d ago

What's funny is the following.

When a PS4 guy is having words with people that own PC's....they moan to PC's guys how it isn't about graphics or power, it's about gameplay.

When a PS4 guy is having words with people that own Wii U's....they brag about how powerful the PS4 is and how the graphics are so much better they might as well stop selling the Wii U.

Then there's reality when you realize that the Wii U is only 1/3 as powerful as the PS4 (so not a ton of difference) and that a PS4 is 1/3 the power of a 2013 midrange PC with say an as yet unlaunched GTX 770 or ATI equivalent.

That throughout this huge range of literally 900 percent, the games are capable of scaling up and down that line. Then for this range if someone wants at crazy resolutions above 1080p like 1600p or 5760x1080p then they can build their uber rigs with 3xGTX Titans or 2x GTX 690's or whatever and do it.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 1381d ago
DaThreats1384d ago

Has to be, or we be using PS2 and Xbox tech.

Smashbro291384d ago

60fps NEEDS to be the standard. I can't stand these sluggish games.

Link0791384d ago

NFS isnt sluggish ? its the refresh rate that matters as well you can do 30fps at 60 frames refresh rate makes the game seem smoother DOA 3DS did it.

DeadlyFire1383d ago

Well they can be if built at the right resolution. They can keep the good looks and everything and go with 720p at 60fps.

If they went for 3+ Tflops then 1080 at 60 fps would have been possible for every game even without optimization for the platform.