Microsoft’s next console will require an Internet connection in order to function, ruling out a second-hand game market for the platform. A new iteration of Xbox Live will be an integral part of Microsoft’s next console, while improved Kinect hardware will also ship alongside the unit.
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You can sell your disk if you want(your right). The software will not work on multiple systems. Same thing that has been done on PC for...a long long time.
However I agree that it is BS
I can't even lend a copy of a game to a friend without them having to jump through hoops to play it, if they can at all?
Lame.
:)
We can bash nintendo all we want but at least they arent trying sh!t like this!
Yup, I'll believe the solid facts when the solid facts are presented to me. If this is true then MS can kiss goodbye to my cash anyway.
They can't continue to sell online games at such extortionate prices and then also rule out the possibility of even selling their consoles in retail stores like Gamestop because they would be destroying Gamestop's second hand trade.
I'm already sick of having to pay to play online with Xbox games, if these rumours are true MS are gonna lose a hell of a lot of ground on Sony.
Another important bit is the one about coding, Edge reports developers say it is easier for them on the PS4, and Sony wants them to code closer to the metal while MS are strict with the libraries
"Bye Bye Microsoft! It's been fun but we've grown apart."
But it's fun to see the meltdown when these hilarious rumors get dropped.
Next gen will be completely the same as this one, with both MS and Sony fixing some of the issues that plagued them this gen.
The Used game market will continue, but digital distro will became more of the norm as movies already have.
Evil
I'm pretty sure this is going to be a reality... doesn't really excite me at all.
I'll Miss Cole and Marcus,
Cortana and Chief,
but I won't buy this if that's what's the future is like.
I don't want to be online all of the time for a single player game, that's just taking away bandwidth from other computers on my network, and I play on my downtime whilst my computers are downloading and stuff.
I really hope this isn't true.
CEO Kaz Hirai CEO Kaz Hirai @KazHiraiCEO
It looks like Microsoft are stealing our ideas again. Our consoles haven't been able to play used XBOX games for years
But yeah, I doubt microsoft is dumb enough to do that, and I reallllyyyyy doubt they are gonna make it so you have to have an internet connection to use the console, so don't worry Xbox fans, that can't possibly happen.
im calling malarkey
"Just for the "can't borrow a game to a friend" reason alone is why I can't see this happening on consoles and if it did, it would be a career suicide to whoever decided it was a good idea."
Considering the amount of really poor/bad decisions Microsoft has been making these last 3-4 years, it wouldn't surprise me if it turns out to be true...
Definitely not buying the next xbox, this leaves Sony wide open with a huge opportunity to allow used games, that alone will be enough to sweep next gen.
1) don't have broadband
2) don't have wifi or internet reaching every room where the console might be played
It will not happen but if it did I would also not be getting it out of principle.
"Slaves" to the most popular method of purchasing games on the pc, thru Steam, say hi. Hehe so much for your PC rant.
But I see what you mean, at least you have a choice. I myself dont like all the clutter of dvd's and used game boxes all over the place is why I prefer digital downloads, but I get it's not for everyone.
"Studios working with the next-gen Xbox are currently being forced to work with only approved development libraries, while Sony is encouraging coders to get closer to the metal of its box"
Just trying to understand what edge meant by this and its about time we get more information on the next XBox.
Maybe. Close to Metal from AMD is a low level programming interface, and as such it could be one of the approved libraries that was mentioned in the article. It basically allows low level access to functions within the GPU through an API layer with less need to write complicated assembly code.
Close to the metal could also refer to Sony allowing developers to directly access the hardware on the system bypassing established libraries or API's, which in theory could improve performance in the hands of a skilled programmer. It's often referred to as assembly language, where a line of code corresponds to a single machine code instruction.
I heard that phrase years ago in PS2 days and my impression was it meant not relying so much on the ready made libraries enabling potentially better performance. Close to the metal means programing more directly to the hardware.
At least thats what I thought at the time. My guess is that the AMD program was named after that phrase.
With the PS2, Sony allowed quite a bit of low level functionality with the emotion engine. In fact the emotion engine was designed to be highly programmable to allow it to be used the way programmers needed to for a particular purpose. That kind of thing can really only be done with assembly, as the very nature of a high level API doesn't do that.
I said it in the past: MS will try to push DirectX and thus make the games easily "ported" to Windows 8 store.
Sony is most likely to use OpenGl for PS4, which in reality allows games to be more easily ported to other platforms as OpenGl is a free, open standard, unlike DirectX which is a MS enforced one. Thus Sony from the sentence is most likely encouraging developers to "hack" the console, by allowing a low level access to hardware resources management. In example allow them to manually assign which blocks from an array to be loaded to specific parts of RAM or which thread each core should process...
When somebody says, "close to the metal" it actually means as close to binary language as possible which is the native language every part of your computer (or your console) speaks. It means it *CAN* be considerably more efficient, but has drawbacks such as hugely more tedious, more error prone and the efficiency is only tied to as good as the programmer is. If you are a poor programmer, then the result might be disastrous. It also means, it's harder to port, emulate or otherwise change as it is considerably harder to read the code.
By using libraries it is generally considerably easier to use, sometimes faster (because some smart dude making gazillion figure it out), and allows for far more flexibility.
If you do something weird close to the metal, you might find out on the next dash update your game doesn't work anymore. However, if you are good you will reap performance benefits. However, this might significantly screw up the potential to update the OS.
There is pro's and con's to each approach, but I would have thought Sony would have learned from MS to make it easy on the programmer. Generally, the performance gap is negligible at this stage and the one with the easiest to harness power from is usually the winner.
@rainslacker:
It doesn't need to be assembly, but is commonly assembly. Binary is the native language, but assembly is one step away from binary.
@Athonline:
Actually, this strategy is both what Sony and MS has been pursuing this entire generation. MS makes ready made libraries for almost anything. That is one of the big reasons Xbox 360 is perceived to be easier to program for.
While on the PS3, you do have to do a lot of the heavy lifting yourself, but has resulted in significant more resources poured into research to obtain those results.
The PS2 did have a couple games that didn't work on newer iterations of the hardware, although I can't remember what they were specifically. I don't think they were big name titles. The heavy use of assembly may have been the reason why.
MS approach to programming in almost everything is to make it easier on the programmer. Visual studio is powerful in it's flexibility and overall simplicity, but it comes at a cost of leaner, sometimes more efficient code. I've found myself often writing my own libraries for simpler things because of the bloat associated with their C libraries.
The only IDE I've used for Sony is their PS Mobile Suite which had less bloat in the interface, but suffered from using Mono thus working on a application layer which added it back in. It was simple enough to use however. PS Mobile is a different beast than their console libraries though so I can't really speak to those.
Perhaps part of the reason the Cell was so hard to program for was lack of pre-defined libraries, but some of it was also due to the architecture of the chip itself. The cell, much like the Emotion Engine, was highly programmable. To take away that "close to metal" approach could have seriously hampered it's capabilities.
I do agree with you on the pros and cons of each side though. It really all comes down to what the developers need to achieve, and what they are targeting for release. Either way, nowadays with so much middle ware for making games it may not even be as important, but still nice to have I suppose.
WTF / is microsoft trying to control masse gamers with this only option leaving out physical disc disbrution?
if this their master plan i will end my gaming after sony stop supporting ps3 i like owning my games,touching my games.
That Wii U is looking mighty tasty round bout now.
50GB Blu-Ray discs and Kinect 2 shipping with every Xbox seems plausible however. So this rumor is like half the info it contains mostly likely won't happen while the other half mostly likely will happen.
I just can't see MS demanding that all their consumers have internet connection in order to use their product. All they are really doing is limiting the amount of people that will buy it. Doesn't make sense to me.
ohh wait f$%# ..
A new kinect is to be expected, but if MS talks about it for a long time during their conferences than show bunch of kinect games than I will not buy the system. Support your core gamers but MS sees the casual wii crowd and they see kinect games selling so as usual they will forget about us. I hope I am wrong but over the last 3 years ms have proved that they only care about selling kinect and going after casual
Always online will means no buy for a lot of people including myself
If MS execs are dumb enough to push no used games TNA. Bye bye MS it was nice seeing you In gaming
I don't think any company is so dumb to block used games and always online for this gen
Was going to get both, but if this is true this sucks, I play a lot offline (single player campaign)... epic fail Microsoft.. you can keep your Next Xbox
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So are you going to ditch the PS4 as well?
I don't like either one, but if I were to pick I'd rather be able to play new games offline. Than to be forced to play online all the time.
Requiring a always online internet connection is really terible. If your having internet problems or Xbox Live is down you cann't even play a single player game. So you will be totally locked out of your own system.
What happens if I get disconnected when playing a single player(will I be able to pickup where I left off or will I have to restart from my last save point)?
Well the ball is in Sony's court now. If the PS4 doesn't require a always online internet connection the PS4 will be a automatic buy for me while I won't even consider the 720. M$ had better hope Sony goes the same route otherwise the PS4 will have a insurmountable advantage.
One good thing though is the 50GB BluRay discs. That is absolutely massive, and its nice to see them not get rid of disks, but this will only matter if the PS4 also requires always online internet connection. if not I won't even consider a 720. The ball is your court Sony.
Anyway I plan to stick with last gen as long as possible before moving on to either a PS4 or 720.
If my internet screws up...I should still be able to play all 10 of my games that I payed $60 each for on my $450 xbox.
Does Charmin tell me how much toilet paper I can use after #2 ? I think not.
I really, really, really hope there is a way around it. I strongly prefer the Xbox product over the Playstation product and I have ever intention of owning both again, but I also have a $2300 PC with dual 24 inch monitors and a third port I can throw to my TV that I will switch to in a heart beat.
They already saw the backlash of gamers when it was rumored that PS will have no 2nd hand game protection so why want the want to screw it for themselves.
Probably some idiot wants to create negative feedback for MS's next console.
Ignoring the use games, which seems to be more and more a reality these days for both Ps4/720, the online thing is severely limiting your userbase.
I just can't see it happening. It would be suicide.
Posted already, this is a duplicate.
well in that case I could see it happening if Microsoft (and Sony if they decide on this) brought out an app/website where you could activate the game without physically doing it through the console.
not everybody has internet connected to their computers but I'm pretty sure most people who buy consoles have mobile internet on their phones.
I still don't see it happening though.
The only thing I like about this is theyve finally grown out of DVD.
I love my xbox 360 but Microsoft better not get it twisted, I will drop their behinds like a hot sack of potatoes if they go through with any of these things bar the blu ray discs.
Same goes for SONY
If MS does this my money goes another way. Same goes to Sony. damn that means Ill have to get the WIIU
o the irony!
Its a rumor so I will not get too upset for now. But Gamestop stock just went down 10%...so a few shareholders must be furious with this rumor. ouch
...And they can kiss mine too :(
What's really concerning about all these rumours is that there is no mention to dedicated servers, imho I won't be able to take Sony nor Microsoft talking about console gaming evolving seriously without dedicated server support for all games.
Will you be able to? that is the issue..
explains why gamestop is closing over 500 stores in 2013 , no used game market / sales
its not all doom and gloom , hackers will make your online only games work with a hack .
When I RROD, I re-purchase system from futureshop, remove innards from new unit, replace with RROD innards, re-flash new unit, return RROD next day for money back.
I only buy collectors editions of games that I deem deserving of my hard earned caps.
Keep in mind that Sharing is Caring.
Also I don't see MS having an issue using Bluray anyway as it is part owned by sony but believe it or not out side of the console market Sony and Microsoft work as partners on different technology and with Windows.
I don't see this always online being true though as not everyone has internet yet so it will limit there market.
Personally , its what I would expect the new box to be able to do.
Its ultra convenient, excellent playback quality and means there is one less box I need...
But yes, I would still buy it for those exclusive games, Blu support or not.
Not sure why they don't just use an install method, as this is also quieter than having to read a DVD/Bluray all the time.
Nintendo does not pay Bluray royalties to Sony becuase the Wii does not allow Blu Rey movie playback.
This is all MS needs to do to avoid royalties...sure having a BluRay play is a plus but TBH I do not know many people who buy Bluray mvoies.
Don't do it Microsoft...
I've been a xbox fan this gen but I now see a PS4 in my future.
I suppose I'll just have to watch a playthrough of Halo 5 on youtube.
I was an xbox fan this gen but the last two years of so, I have lost respect for MS.
This will be the end of my xbox love life.
http://www.computerandvideo...
They've invested money and resources in researching this idea, it's not unreasonable to think Sony will do this as well.
Time will tell
JK...this whole theory of online only is BS.
I can't even fathom how Sony or MS could currently employ somebody short-sighted and , well, plain dumb enough, to not see the absolute commercial and corporate disaster to go that route.
On the other hand, if MS alone goes that route as the article suggests, Sony will get rid of one out of two of their competitor without even having to take their hands out of their pocket.
Needless to say, it will be the same if it's the other way around.
And if it's both MS and Sony that pull out a move like that, Ninty will be the undisputed winner of next gen, even if they release only shovelware on the Wii U.
As for me, I'll keep playing my PS1, PS2, and PS3 games and my NG AES, but apart from that, it'll be "Farewell videogames!
No 2nd hand games: that would be disastrous for any company that implements that. I don't see either company even trying this. It's marketing suicide. Plus MS & Sony have nothing to gain from doing this.
50gb Blu-Ray discs: Microsoft is going to have to eat their pride and cave. There is no way they can survive on pain DVDs.
New Kinect: this is a definite.
I'm not sure how I would feel about an always on connection...I don't see a need for it on a console except for the purpose of restricting used games. For single player games it's worthless, and multi-player games you would be online anyways, so why force it?
I could definitely see both companies leaving anti-used game tech up to the publisher, much like Sony did with region locking. Maybe if they did they would finally get a dose of reality when it comes to what people think of ownership rights.
But i get your point
Is it the same way in the US and Europe?
Microsoft's VC-1 Codec was adopted by blu ray, most major companies helped with the growth of Blu ray. If I recall HD-DVD used the codec(about the only thing people favored HD-DVD over Blu ray for) and Blu-ray got onboard just before or after the death of HD-DVD.(MPEG-4 AVC *vs* VC-1 now. Mpeg-2 is out-e)
This rumor about 2nd hand games keeps popping up for both consoles to garner hits mosly from Sony fans defending PS4 if the rumor is about PS4 and hating the 720 if the rumor is about 720.
There are millions of gamers that never buy new games I doubt any company would do that in the end. it would kill the industry unless the industry agreed to lower the price of games to 1990's prices.
Million would sell movie players if told they could no longer buy used movies, same with game players and games.
I dare you!
MS just keeps pushing me away
There are 40 million+ XBL users right now. As impressive as it sounds, there are another 30 million users who did not even connect their consoles to the internet. SO, I doubt MS would gladly lose 30 million+ customers.
*edit* oh yeah, what happens if my console dies? Do the games die with it or is it connected to my gamertag? If the second option: That means I have to decide which of my GTs I use for the game I bought?
to all you gullible clowns ,nothing is official so please stop crying like children ..
Either english isn't your first language or your full of it, because your post reads like a typical reply by teenagers who are used to having the computer do the thinking for them.
Old farts like me, did it the hard way we learned to spell and have at least halfway decent spelling and grammar.
If your post is a horrible mess, why should people bother to read it.