Premier Gaming Network - If history is to repeat itself, then Sony may go with a different format next generation. However, given the advancement and investment in Blu-ray technology, should Sony just stick with the format? And what will Microsoft opt for next generation?
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MS need to swallow their peride and just adopt bluray.
Microsoft will likely stick to DVD, but their main selling point this time around will be a combination of Kinect and that projection tech they recently unveiled...which will be a disaster because they would COMPLETELY lose touch with their hardcore audience by focusing on expensive gimmicks as opposed to quality titles.
in addition haven't you ever seen a VAIO laptop running Windows? So yeah it's Ok to pay royalties to your rival in order to provide your customers with best tech available, Blu-ray in this case.
Blu-Ray on the other hand is NOT a necessity for a next-gen console to succeed. The 360/Wii proved that this gen.
Last generation sure (takes a while for a physical media to really catch on) but this next generation the xbox needs to be Blu Ray if Microsoft really wants to be this "box in every living room" idea. For just gaming terms they could go down the road of what Nintendo did but a disadvantage is they cannot play Blu Ray DVDs which are becoming more important and more sought after.
It isn't ideal for Microsoft but I feel it is a necessity. It is a small royalty bump which doesn't fully go to Sony but goes to the Blu Ray group
It will be a big mistake if they stick to DVD and I think they no that. For Microsoft the options are stick to DVD (extremely bad idea), go the Nintendo route (slightly bad idea if they want the next xbox to be the main device in households) or go Blu Ray (which has more positives that to the negative of paying royalties)
You are comparing this gen to next gen.
It needs a high capacity disc to succeed next gen.
We already get games spanning multiple discs causing gamers to have to get out of their chair to go change a disc.
That would increase dramatically if they stuck with DVD.
This isn't 2001. The technology exists, use it.
Even if MS decides to use blue laser which is the same as blu-ray technology, as long as they don't claim compatibility and play blu-ray movies they don't have to pay the license fee. In effect, they would have the exact same storage capacity or more without the fee.
Nobody has a patent on use of blu-laser.
BR unfortunately is a format that to most consumers are quickly diminishing in value. Too many people are moving over to streaming now like Netflix. On top of that, brand name standalone players cost $60.
If consumers wanted BR, they likely already own a player. Besides, why would you wear out your optical drive in your $400 console when there is a far cheaper and likely quieter option?
"BR unfortunately is a format that to most consumers are quickly diminishing in value. Too many people are moving over to streaming now like Netflix."
EXACTLY! Most people would rather pay $80-$90 a year to stream an unlimited amount of movies and tv shows as opposed to spending $10-$25 on individual Blu-Rays.
Subscription services offer WAAAY more value than buying individual Blu-Ray discs.
I hope you're wrong because I hate swapping out discs on the 360 it's an annoyance. Anything other than DVD would be nice. ;)
On top of that, there won't be a way to play my Blu-Ray movies, so that's another strike against the Next Box.
Microsoft is in a corner and the only way out is to go the Blu route.
I wish I could find it, but there was a thread on an old forum where someone was arguing that DVDs would never be necessary for gaming because CDs would provide enough space. He argued that developers would find better means of compression. Could you imagine using CDs still?
While DVDs worked, I dont see them lasting much longer. So I do see MS using Blu Rays for games, until streaming becomes the norm.
Would be best for them, Sony as well, to allow for HD titles less than 8GB to be on DVD as well.
These big companies are always paying royalties.
Blu ray is awesome and if you don't think so then your TV sucks.
That being said, Microsoft may believe that everyone who wants Blu-Ray already has it - and go for a cheaper bespoke option like Nintendo did.
If Microsoft can negotiate a low enough Blu-Ray royalty rate, they might just go with Blu-Ray. This could make the next Xbox become the centre of the living room experience, which is something they've tried to do this generation.
In the case of Sony, it is very easy for them to drop in another bluray drive. It is well established, 50GB is still a lot of space and 99 percent of devs would be perfectly happy with that. A reasonable speed BD drive is now cheap as well. 8x would be plenty. Incredibly you can actually buy external usb 6x BD ROM drives on ebay for less than 22 pounds. I think it is obvious Sony will go this route again.
The question is what will Microsoft do? I think they will probably end up shoving in a bluray drive too. The fight over the format is long past and mostly forgotten history now. If they want to be an ultimate home media hub they would be wise to include bluray, although they might decide that they want to exclude it IF it means people move to their streaming service instead. It is very possible that they would view bluray as not a significant marketing feature in 2013, and not having it wouldn't hinder sales of the hardware or games but further drive streaming which they can make money from and have total control over on the platform.
Even in this scenario the drive will surely be a high capacity disc drive derived from bluray like tech much as Wii U is. It's just too cheap and fast to not have a high capacity disc drive in 2013. It's a total no Brainer. Even Wii U has one and that isn't exactly aiming to be cutting edge.
Blu-Ray adoption rate is rising year over year since it's introduction to the market. Last year it saw a 16% increase in number of players sold, and increase from 9% the year before. It's adoption rate is actually much quicker than DVD ever was.
You made this same streaming argument the other day, so I will say to you again, is it hard to see the added value of having it all in one machine? Why do you keep insisting that streaming is going to take over? Physical media is still wanted and will always be. Digital is of course quickly gaining acceptance, and depending on how you look at it, has surpassed physical media sold. Just because people are streaming doesn't mean that they don't also want physical media. They both present advantages, and quite frankly, most of the world, or even the US, isn't equipped for an entirely digital future. Did you know that only 68% of US homes have broadband internet as of 2012(this isn't even broken down into high speed broadband, but over 112Kb speeds)...it seems there's more than one market to look at given those numbers. Stop pulling assumptions out of your ass and do some real research to see that what you like isn't necessarily everyone else likes.
Perhaps your logic requires some facts. I guess you aren't aware that the main backers for CD and DVD were Sony and Philips, so Microsoft has been paying them all along via their royalties for those formats. A couple of dollars in royalties isn't going to stop them using bluray.
You should know that every time I read one of your posts, I become so stupefied and pessimistic towards the human race that I usually find a baby to punch in the face afterwards.
Blu-ray is supported by MANY companies meaning royalties will go everywhere.
DVD has royalties also... why you think the wii and game cube used dvd medium but did no allow to play movies.
Sometimes you have to work together to make your product better.
Plus to ppl who think Streaming vide like netflix will remove Blu-ray.... they are completly closed minded.
Sorry netflix is mainly strong in only USA.. Most ppl have limited bandwidth around the world and it aint fast enough to pump out the SAME quality picture and sound and blu-ray.
Ive messed around with Netflix and it is no way inhell close to the quality of a Real blu-ray disc with uncompressed sound.
Sony makes money on every DVD drive and disc, too. I'm sure you thought Sony only had part in creating the betamax.
"Blu-Ray on the other hand is NOT a necessity for a next-gen console to succeed. The 360/Wii proved that this gen"
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LOL!! You're using the 7th gen to prove that Blu-ray isn't needed in the 8th? If the neXtbox wants to keep being called a multimedia system, it needs blu-ray. Plain and simple.
I'm betting Microsoft will bite the bullet and put Blu-ray in the next Xbox. Actual Blu-ray, not the gimped Wii U version.
"And pay Sony royalties? Thats lunacy. Thats like saying the PS4 should adopt a Windows 8 OS. Y"
have you seen sony laptops? They don't use sony OS's. But in this case this makes MS look bad. I like it! Wow sony is really ahead of the curve by 7 years.
If xbox 720 is to stand a chance they need ps3 tech inside it.
".which will be a disaster because they would COMPLETELY lose touch with their hardcore audience by focusing on expensive gimmicks as opposed to quality titles."
lol sounds like 2010 - 2013.
"Blu-Ray on the other hand is NOT a necessity for a next-gen console to succeed. The 360/Wii proved that this gen."
So seeing how LA NOIRE, FF13, Rage And other games has 3 disks on 360 bigger next gen games
will just use 5 - 7 disks? Awsome!
Even Nintendo couldn't figure this out they are going for the hardcore.
Good job sony. Wonder what they will bring in ps4.
Only fanboys fight. As for Microsoft and Sony, they probably get along quite well.
a) Use Blu-ray like most of the industry.
b) Drop the disc drive all-together and focus on digital downloads.
All other options are just silly.
But the reality is that digital is the future. And even if MS included Blu-ray, it will only be so beneficial for royalties for Sony and it's partners. If this generation is going to last as long as the current one, digital will outstrip disc long before it's over. The 360 already downloads content after you've turned it off and Steam already allows you to download a game before the release date. Put the two together and you eliminate the need for a physical format. So while physical will be there, it won't last.
"Drop the disc drive all-together and focus on digital downloads."
This option would also be silly.
Because they aren't really cheap even now, not compared to disc based technology.
25GB blank bluray disc costs how much? $2 each at most if bought on a cake at retail? 50GB discs cost maybe $5 each at retail at most?
16Gb flash memory costs at least $10 at retail. 32GB is at least again $15. Actually I have been extremely conservative and priced the BD discs high, and the flash memory low!
But the point is obvious. When you want to make millions of copies of the game for retail, flash memory is STILL vastly more expensive than using a disc based format. Potentially $30+ million dollars more expensive in fact, for big selling games that might require over 25GB.
It is cheaper for everyone concerned to stick with discs right now, despite the fact flash memory is seemingly cheap. Everything is relative.
However, MS is looking to make the 720 be the primary media hub in the living room. I think MS will go with Blu-Ray because they want to tap into those households that have a PS3 as their blu-ray movie playback machine. MS won't be able to achieve their goal if they don't cater the the #1 HD physical media format. Sony will just come back and take market share away once again this next gen like they did this gen simply because Sony offered HD blu-ray.
MS will need to release blu-ray for their system in order to keep Sony from taking market share.
I very well expect MS to use blu-ray and MS don't give a rats butt if they have to pay royalties....they have billions and the payoff to have blu-ray on the 720 would be a much greater asset to them then to not too.
Sony obviously knows it will result in a better experience overall, Microsoft needs to swallow their pride and go Blu too.
It would be embarrassing for Assassin's Creed 5 or GTA 6 to be 3 or 4 discs.
Next gen bluray will be faster and could be larger. For MS to even consider shipping a console without a bluray drive is maddness.
Actually it was Sony and Philips who once again collaborated to pioneer what would become bluray. Sure they have to pay their royalties like everyone else but they also get a good chunk back from what others pay.
MS either needs to add bluray or come up with a solution for disks that can hold more than 6-8GB of date.
whether people like it or not but DVD held a lot of stuff back this gen 3rd party wise. and i hope MS doesn't make the same arrogant choice again.
MS could do the same.
THe most likely scenario is they will have blu ray
I see know reason why the PS4 wouldn't still use Blu-Ray though. It's in Sony's interests to support the format, and given the lengths they went to include it in the PS3, there's simply no way they wouldn't include it in the PS4.
This time around Microsoft will definitely be adding in Blu Ray without a doubt. How else can you make games for the next 6 years that will continually grow in the tech and graphics department like this gen did with the limited space of standard DVD...
It's just ms that needs to adopt it. Either that or a really good alternative but I figure that a good amount of customers are looking for blu-ray players nowadays so it's be smart of ms to include it in the next xbox.
That's just my take on the situation.
so now its ok to install.? Maybe
This is the first gen Sony is coming out with a system that isn't matched to a emerging technology (CD/DVD/BR), so they won't have that advantage like they did on their previous systems. I believe their Gakai acquisition will have some part to play in that, as it's the only real emerging technology when it comes to entertainment right now.
Blu-ray is a given for Sony though, doubt it even needs to be discussed. As for MS, since they want to be the center of people's living room, it's hard to imagine they would shut out those buyers, despite stand alone players being cheaper.
only ps3 exclusives can go to 40+gb
as for MS if they didn't have something close to the size of blue-ray ,they will be in deep trouble when next gen come out
Sony should definitely have 100GB support but, like with the PS2 allowing games on CD or DVD or the PS3 allowing 25 ir 50GB discs, allow developers to choose the best option for them and make sure they aren't penalised for using larger capacity discs. Basically, make the publishing aspect as developer friendly as possible.
Theres a reason why GT5 has over 1,000 cars and Killzone 2 has huge detailed 2gig levels.
Games get bigger not smaller. One would be just stupid to think using DVD again would be wise. (I don't think it was wise THIS gen)
Games will only continue to get bigger. Max Payne is 35 gigs, LA Noire is almost 40 I mean, you either want Next Gen or not. Having DVD is not going to give you proper sequels to Max Payne and LA Noire (just examples) ....they didn't for GTAIV.
GTAV (quote me and MARK MY WORDS) IS ONLY AS BIG, AND HAS SOOOOO MANY OLD FEATURES RETURNED BECAUSE ITS NOT USING JUST ONE DVD ie THE REASON GTAIV WAS GIMPED. i'M SORRY BUY I DON'T WANT GTAVI ON 720 IF MS WANTS TO USE DVD NO REAL GTA FAN WOULD.
but dual layer Blu-ray discs will go a long way... I have not seen many PC games go beyond 50 gbs;) after install
They don't need to go with Blu-ray, just something that can hold a lot of information on one disc.
Sony will stick with the Blu-ray tech, I don't see a reason for them to go away with it, unless they have something better. But for now, to keep the console cost low, there shouldn't be a reason to go with a higher price tech.
I imagine I'll get some disagrees for saying so, but Microsoft stands to make more money from using DVDs, on both ends.
On the developer end, they can charge more- as they do now- if the number of discs goes over a certain limit, and that's definitely gonna be happening next gen.
On the consumer end- for some games, anyway- multiple discs in a console that had a reputation for scratching discs means that even if just one disc is scratched, the consumer has to buy another copy of the game to continue. I wonder how much that has contributed to the supposed higher attach rate on 360?
LMAO, stretch much?
It would be silly to go with an entirely new format, they would end up paying at least $30-50 more per console if they used a proprietary disk format, plus the disk manufacturing costs would be much higher.
So you take off the shelf bluray hardware with maybe some custom firmware and that's all you need.
Also, I can stream the majority of the movies/tv shows on the PS Store for FREE via the Internet Browser. Do I care that they aren't in HD? Nope.
As for Tv shows I agree, but having a 50" Panasonic Plasma (a high end mode) and a 5.1 surround system to watch any quality Blu-Ray release, makes streaming look no better than 720p.. In most cases , worse.
So Im responding to your comment.. I care, as do many others.
But for games I live in Mexico, to download a game that's above 10 takes a couple of days, now imagine a 30+ Gb game and God knows how big next Gen games are gonna be, your crazy Logic if you think MS is going digital only.
The 360 is very popular in Mexico but not everyone had high-speed internet or even internet at all.
Valid point re: alternative disc tech (feasible)
But MS has made it clear they want to own the living room, providing entertainment any way they can. Since Blu ray is so widespread now, it seems like BR inclusion in the next MS console would be consistent with that.
That said, MS will still push video streaming, of course.
But I don't expect they will go that fast on the PS4, it would be pretty loud. Probably more like 8x.
Sony=Blu-ray
Nintendo=Blu-ray.
In all seriousness I do miss those days you could record you TV shows on to VHS with no problem. No it is sky boxes and on demand services which from time to time are not ideal. VHS also had that crap but homely look about it
It's awesome because if you have basic cable, it turns it into digital so you can browse the channels and know whats on. But beyond that, you are able to record ANYTHING. The thing I hate about DVR is they still control it. We recorded a movie on TV through DVR since we were out, came home, it has a little money symbol next to it.... wtf... it was on TV, yet we still have to buy the movie? dumb. And who knows when they pass a gadget that blocks you from fast forwarding through commercials....
But Let all not forget that Blu ray's data transfer speed is very slow. They could use a fast HDD like Sony did with their PS3; loading part of the data content on disc to increase the loading time.
I would think Microsoft would be smart enough to go with blu ray drive since there is no other optical medium drive thats better suited than blu rays 100gd capacity.
So Please Microsoft add a blu ray drive. Don't give Sony the advantage again.
This is true if you compare a 1X Blu Ray Drive to a 12X DVD Drive. But if you compare a 1X Blu Ray Drive to a 1X DVD Drive then Blu Ray transfers data at an approx. of 3.27X faster than DVD (BD = 36 mbps; DVD = 11 mbps). Not to mention that BD uses CLV, which transfers data at a linear constant, whereas DVD uses CAV, which transfers data at a variable constant (Faster on the inside, slower on the outside).
For comparison purposes, the highest speed of a BD drive at the moment is 18x which transfers data at 648 mbps and DVD is 52x which transfers data at 572 mbps.
You're correct in some sense. But the real problem is cost.
Blu ray is a wonderful feature to have but Have you ever asked yourself why Blu ray disc cost so much? I'll explain why:First off, When using a blue light spectrum you get more storage space but lose on the pick up speed. When using laser red light spectrum you gain lots of read speed but lose on the storage space. There is a complete trade off when changing the color light spectrum and intensity(cold/hot) when reading an optical disc. So being that Blu ray uses a Blue ultra violet light which is projected thinly on a optical disc,it drive the cost of each disc manufactured. The faster the optical drive the more the blu ray disc will cost.
each blu ray disc would have to be made stronger to compensate for the Blue light spectrum intensity being so weak. In addition, anti-skipping technology would have to be incorporated to every blu ray disc to insure its accuracy or it won't work. This is the main reason for the heavy price tag for each blu ray disc being manufactured.
So I don't blame Nintendo for going with a propitiatory drive if there main goal is to keep the cost down of each disc(25gb) manufactured for the Wii U console. Perhaps this is, the reason Nintendo went with a mid range laser optical drive to keep cost down, a mid range laser intensity not only give the wii U a faster drive but also give a decent storage space.
Every 1x speed on DVD is 1Mb/s maximum transfer rate but it randomly drops to nearly half that at times.
Every 1x speed on Blu-ray is 4.5Mb/s constant with no variation.
The 12x DVD drive in the 360 alternates between 6.5Mb/s & 12Mb/s
The PS3's 2x Blu-ray runs a constant 9Mb/s
All they have to do is use a higher bit rate drive in the PS4 and Nextbox.
A 14x Blu-ray drive operates at a constant 63Mb/s which is far better than any DVD drive.
Going full digital would be suicide, not everyone wants to download games. Go on the stores now, see how digital titles are still full prices, while at retail they are dirt cheap.
Let alone people have libraries of Blu-ray movies now, and I'm not tossing that out.
It's a better,cheaper and faster way to get the product out to the consumers.
they should do what they did in 2005 and bet on a loosing format.
Or create their own bastardized one like Nintendo did with the gamecube.
I even have a name for it...Bill-ray.
um, what? lolz you can get the entire new batman trilogy on blu-ray for, like, $20 lolz as for the rest of your post, there's just as much fail there~
Blu ray is a wonderful feature to have but Have you ever asked yourself why Blu ray disc cost so much? I'll explain why:First off, When using a blue light spectrum you get more storage space but lose on the pick up speed. When using laser red light spectrum you gain lots of read speed but lose on the storage space. There is a complete trade off when changing the color light spectrum and intensity(cold/hot) when reading an optical disc. So being that Blu ray uses a Blue ultra violet light which is projected thinly on a optical disc,it drive the cost of disc manufactured. The faster the optical drive the more the blu ray disc will cost.
each blu ray disc would have to be made stronger to compensate for the Blue light spectrum intensity being so weak. In addition, anti-skipping technology would have to be incorporated to every blu ray disc to insure its accuracy or it won't work. This of main reason for the heavy price tag for each blu ray disc being manufactured.
So I don't blame Nintendo for going with a propitiatory drive if there main goal is to keep the cost down of each disc(25gb) manufactured for the Wii U console. Perhaps this is, the reason Nintendo went with a mid range laser optical drive to keep cost down, a mid range laser intensity not only give the wii U a faster drive but also give a decent storage space.
The only part I care about is the bigger storage space on the disc. I don't care about disc swapping. It's not that big of a deal to me. I don't see a downside to having everything on one disc, though. I could care less if my video game console can play Blu Rays. It's not very hard or expensive to get a stand alone player.
With Sony... it's really not even a question. Of course they'll do it. They have no reason not to.
stop handing out blogs to just anyone. Its pointless.
Sony has a movie studio with plenty of content to put on blu ray and you want them to remove a blu ray player from a device that can be marketed as a blu ray player as well as a game console.
Someone call this kids parents and tell them to turn their sons computer off.
And blu ray's transfer rate is not slow. THe blu ray player in the ps3 was only 2x, early dvd and cd players were just as slow.
For the record:
Blu-ray has a higher data transfer rate -- 36 Mbps (megabits per second) -- than today's DVDs, which transfer at 10 Mbps. A Blu-ray disc can record 25 GB of material in just over an hour and a half.
That info was also posted back around 2009 I think.
Just hoping on the new Blu-ray discs the disc speed and disc size continues to improve.
Microsoft already tried supporting HD DVD and that ended up badly for them.
Quite frankly since Blu-ray is now the main HD Disc Format of choice Sony/Microsoft will continue to use it though next gen I feel digital distribution/cloud gaming will have a huge presence on PS4/Xbox 720/Steam Box/Ouya.
Wii U might try to capitalize on digital distribution if it starts of catch on more.
They need to remember and everybody else out there that Sony first and foremost is a proprietor of all things media related especially in the field of electronics/hardware.