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Submitted by dirigiblebill 581d ago | news

Dragon Age 3 artist: Xbox 720 tech won't be as "obvious" a leap as Xbox to Xbox 360

"I have to be careful here as there are non-disclosure agreements involved!" says BioWare's Neil Thompson. [OXM UK] (BioWare, Dragon Age 3: Inquisition, Next-Gen, Xbox 360)

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dennett316  +   581d ago
I've been saying this for a while...the leap over last gen and the WiiU will not be as massive as people think it will. It's going to be more about stability of full 1080p at a minimum of 60fps with no screen tearing...possibly with 3D.

Hardware is, of course, important but far more important is the games that are played on it. If it's the same old stuff as last gen with only a slightly nicer coat of paint....how many will be disappointed?
Septic  +   581d ago
Reading that particular comment in its entirety paints a more clearer picture

"For the next generation there will be quite a big leap, but it won't be as obvious," Thompson revealed. "People will do things in a cleverer fashion - and I have to be careful here as there are non-disclosure agreements involved! I think they'll be better prepared, shall we say - but we can't see a ten-fold team increase again as the budgets would just be ridiculous."

Interesting info though....wonder how they are better prepared?
AAACE5  +   581d ago
I still say the 720 will have a quad core cpu and about 2 gigs of ram.
trikster40  +   581d ago
Just from reading the article, it sounds like there will be far more graphics engines developed by middleware than this last generation. You're going to see more games predominantly using middleware engines than ever before. Just think how many games used the Unreal engine this gen? Next gen, these major publishers will not only rely on their software sales but licensing costs from their engines to succeed. Not having to develop your own engine will save you those production costs.
DeadlyFire  +   581d ago
Well Square Enix, Crytek, EA, Epic. All have no need for a new game engine. They are building their own next-gen engine.

If its really not that big of a leap WiiU might have a leg to stand on in the new generation against the two bigger consoles.

@AAACE5
Definitely possible. Possibly with 4 core ARM CPU on the side for Windows 8 RT/ARM edition.
TheGamerDood  +   581d ago
posted this in another thread but relevant to discussion here.

"If the rumors are true and it's looking like they are then the PS4 will have a higher clocked CPU, beefier GPU and faster RAM, than the next Xbox. Yikes! I hate to say but it looks like those whispers of MS abandoning the core and focusing mainly on the casual market may have been true. D:"

http://www.ign.com/articles...
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kickerz  +   581d ago
Day 1 purchase for me :) I gotta stop reading these next gen articles, getting to pumped up...Still got ages to wait, dang it lol.
AAACE5  +   580d ago
In reality all that will be needed is a setup that allows for data to be read on the disc quicker. For this gen ram was the problem on ps3 and 360 had disc space issues.
lfclee  +   580d ago
it won't be enough of a huge leap for me to give up my PS3 no way !
SynGamer  +   581d ago
The simple fact is that this current generation has seen numerous games running at or BELOW 720p @ 30fps. While it may not be as large of a leap graphically, I am still eagerly awaiting the next generation and solid 1080p @ 60fps. The different will be noticeable and welcomed.

What I'm REALLY looking forward to are the improved physics. The current hardware can already do 1080p at "roughly" 30fps. I believe WipeOut runs at 1080p on the PS3. So if we can get games to look a bit better (more RAM) on the new systems, we should be in for a treat when it comes to physics and AI.
dktxx2  +   581d ago
Consoles today could do 60fps at 720p, or even 1080p if they really wanted to. They choose better graphics over better framerates. I don't see why developers would all of the sudden change that philosophy.

I'm not saying they won't, who knows. But just because they can achieve 60fps, doesn't mean they will.
Kingofwiiu  +   581d ago
OK , let me just get something straight here . Why is everyone so bothered about Resoloution and framerate ? Resoloution and framerate are important for sure.

But the actual fidelity of the graphics is what is important. For example - If you had graphics that litteraly almost resembled real life running at 720p 30FPS , it would be a MASSIVE MASSIVE MASSIVE leap over curent xbox 360 graphical fidelity.

Sure Resoloution and FR is important but it's a bonus really and not as important as making the graphics displayed as impressive as they possibly can be. This is why Native 4K gaming is about 10 years away , Do you think Devs want to sacrifice all of their graphic fidelity to render the game in 4K which let's face it , is hard to tell the difference between Native 1080p with full AA.

Bottom line is , Xbox 360 graphics with 1080p 60FPS or xbox 720 graphics at 720p/1080p 30FPS with massive worlds and NOTICEABLY better graphics with crysis 3 looking games being the minimum...
zebramocha  +   581d ago
Resolution allows small detail on characters to be scene and frame rate makes the game smooth or choppy.
SynGamer  +   581d ago
Rumors are that Sony will REQUIRE 1080p @ 60fps (and 3D) for PS4 games. That would require developers to make sure they meet those requirements before being released. I fully support this type of requirement so that developers immediately know what they must produce as a minimum. I have a 1080p HDTV at home, I want my games to at least support this resolution properly, none of this upscale BS.
dirthurts  +   581d ago
Resolution+Framerate >>>>> Fidelity in my opinion.
When I game on pc, I always set the graphics to the absolute max detail I can get and still retail a solid 1080p(my resolution)/60fps.
I don't crank up the graphics and watch my frame rate tank into the 40's or worse.
I have a pretty decent computer, so I rarely have to do this thankfully, but when I must I must.
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starchild  +   581d ago
I agree that resolution and framerate are very important, but good anti-aliasing and v-sync are just as important.

Nothing ruins a gaming experience more for me than having the image quality seriously degraded by jaggies and screen tearing.

I hope devs will make these things a priority in the coming generation.
nukeitall  +   581d ago
@SynGamer:

"Rumors are that Sony will REQUIRE 1080p @ 60fps (and 3D) for PS4 games."

That would likely put an unreasonable condition on game design. What if the developer was creating this groundbreaking game with lots and lots of physics, which would tax the graphics so it had to be reduced to 1080p at 30fps?

That's just an example, but you see where I'm heading with this.
Maybe it would be better to release cheaper consoles every 5 years? I wouldn't mind.

I expect the same from sony but since they have great devs I am not worried if they can make uncharted on 512mb of memory seriously I am not worried if they have 4gb ram.

I am sure the next halo will look great though.

Also this will be perfect for a steam box that can upgrade & I see pc gaming getting even bigger is the new console are no big change.
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Gildarts  +   581d ago
Black tusk, turn 10, rare, twisted pixel, MS Victoria, Lift London, lionhead and numerous others who are working on secret projects.

Nice stealth edit btw, You said something like "who's going to develop games for Xbox 720?, 343i and?.."
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The_Infected  +   581d ago
Well whats true this or the leaked specs? If the leaked specs are true it should be a huge leap. If the developer is right I don't trust the leaked specs then.
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extermin8or  +   581d ago
tbf dragon age games were never known for their graphics...
3-4-5  +   581d ago
IF you are correct, then games will never be as important to a generation then they will be for the next.

The counter the Non shock and awe the people will experience in terms of hardware and graphics, there will have to be one of the best gaming libraries in the history of any console.
ziggurcat  +   581d ago
"I've been saying this for a while...the leap over last gen and the WiiU will not be as massive as people think it will. It's going to be more about stability of full 1080p at a minimum of 60fps with no screen tearing...possibly with 3D."

it may not seem like it right away, but i'm pretty sure that games will look leaps and bounds better than the games out on the current systems... especially later on in the new systems' life cycles.
CalvinKlein  +   580d ago
comming form someone who is working on dragon age it doesnt mean much. I rented dragon age 1 on ps3 because I heard it was the better of the console versions....And it looked like a ps2 game and ran at like 10-15 FPS. I can only imagine how bad the 360 version was if it was worse than that.
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FlyingFoxy  +   580d ago
John Carmack said Doom 4 will run only 30FPS on consoles, 60 on PC.

So it already looks like PC is ahead.. but that's nothing new.
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lfclee  +   580d ago
I don't think it will be worth upgrading to the next gen consoles , i don't think i will be now after reading a lot of talk on various websites no way !
Blackdeath_663  +   580d ago
"stability of full 1080p at a minimum of 60fps with no screen tearing...possibly with 3D" PC's have been doing that for years, if that really is the case then there is no point getting a console next gen
tubers  +   580d ago
Nope.

I'm willing to bet that a lot of graphics taxing games (ala UC series) developed and exclusives on the next gens still won't run 1080p at 60 FPS.

Devs like to put a lot of effects, better geometry, more objects and better physics and probably show wider "scope" of the game..

The next gen games with "flagship" graphics (like the PS3's GoW/Heavy Rain/UC) will still run a sub 1080p and around 30 FPS.

Im not saying that's a bad thing. It's just the trend of things.

1080p@60FPS will be reserved for your "PS3 Classics".
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LAWSON72  +   581d ago
That was obvious, i just hope they have a nice built in solid state for the os maybe it would improve the speed of loading times, beacuse the 360 is just slow as hell. Maybe support bluray to eliminate multiple discs, and maybe try to have a minimum of 500gb hdd to push digital. I honestly can say i will not being buying a new xbox 720 until halo 5 and no matter what it offers it will not be better than my pc, which is cheaper to support and manage.
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madjedi  +   580d ago
The os is one of the few advantages ms has over sony, being slow to load isn't a complaint against the 360, i have ever had. Trying to rip a cd to a 360 on the other hand, is scary stuff.
Ezz2013  +   581d ago
i said it all the time
you guys think there will be HUGE gap(like ps2 to ps3) between ps3/360 and next gen consoles ?!

you are in for a rude awakening
ILive  +   581d ago
You sound like you want to be right.
Ezz2013  +   581d ago
no i don't want to be right
but
games now cost us 60$
next gen it will cost what for us to buy ???

Dev's to make games this gen needed from 20m to 100M
next gen what will it cost to make a game ???

consoles it self cost 200$ to 300$ till today
next gen consoles will cost us what ???

and all of that aside
the gap won't be huge or big as they think
it will be like going from normal to high setting
and even then most of ps3 exclusives will still look amazing even when we are 5 years into next gen consoles
you get my point ?!
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Saigon  +   581d ago
Ezz,

I get your point but the items you question above is one reason why next-gen won't be that much of a leap.

The price of games...I hope they do not cost 60$ upfront. Maybe they can initially but then reduce the cost after a while once the systems have spread their wings.

The development cost will be a big reason to why the gigantic leap will not occur. Just looking at the 20M mark itself is astounding to me. Hopefully next gen that will be the max but for some reason I have a feeling we will see a game over 100M.

With off the shelf tech I expect these next gen systems to cost around 300$ to 400$. At max we could see a high end model (all the bells and whistles, meaning bundles) over 500$ - 600$.

I unlike some is fine with the small leap. I want developers to focus on developing better AI and better aesthetics for games than just graphics.

A game can't function on graphics alone it needs the mechanics behind it to also function properly.
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BitbyDeath  +   581d ago
"games now cost us 60$
next gen it will cost what for us to buy ???"

If that were the case then wouldn't PC games cost at minimum $100 already?
Saigon  +   581d ago
Bit,

Not certain if you remember but games use to cost a lot less. I remember a time where I could buy a brand new game for 35$-40$ on release day. With this generation that has changed dramatically. 60$ makes me think twice about buying games unless I really want it and I am sure most others think the same.

Next Gen, i expect the same price, if not higher. I hope it is not either. I hope the price of game decrease just a little. I will be fine with 50$ but 40$ will be even better.

Its hard to imply PC games to console games because the PC games range in variable prices. PC games can cost 30$ depending on the title while some would cost extremely more.
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sandman224  +   581d ago
1080p at 60 fps with a Shiny cost of paint will be just fine.
ajax17  +   581d ago
Lol wut??
dirthurts  +   581d ago
He's saying better frame rate and resolution with a new box would suit him just fine.
I agree.
ajax17  +   581d ago
I meant the shiny cost of paint
kickerz  +   581d ago
"Problem Solvered"
Pillville  +   580d ago
I think you meant "shiny COAT of paint"
Dno  +   581d ago
then the price better reflect that. console no more then 400 bucks. 450 with a huge HDD and a game.
WildStyles  +   581d ago
Makes sense. We'll see a leap but not as big of one between the first Xbox and the 360.

Both consoles will still be more powerful than the Wii U. That's a given.
madjedi  +   580d ago
Thats really not a true statement in a way, since the original xbox was killed off about 2-3 yrs before it actually needed to be retired. It was running at 720p before hdtvs were really even out there.

The ps2 was definitely due to be replaced, because it was old and the big games had pretty much stop releasing on the system.
torchic  +   581d ago
there's nothing more I love than when actual people in the know with actual names, instead of "annonymous sources" acknowledge the existence of new hardware. can't wait!
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Walker  +   581d ago
And what about Playstation 4 ? i think PS4 is gonna be beast and a truly big leap forward!
#8 (Edited 581d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(28) | Report | Reply
JANF  +   581d ago
I disagree, IMO, i think the PS4 will be comparable to the other two, Sony cant afford to launch an expensive console this time around, they need to be competitive in price land if they want to make it through next generation.
zebramocha  +   581d ago
We don't know what Sony could afford,as oct 2012,there are some amd gpu that are under $200,hd 7850 2Gb.hd 7850 1Gb,hd7770 1Gb,hd7750 1Gb,prices are $189,$169,$119,$99,prices would have to adjusted because Sony are just buying the gpu it self.
stefan771  +   581d ago
Sony said there will be a significant leap

http://www.gamespot.com/new...
Ingram  +   580d ago
No company is gonna come out and flat out declare "Sorry, we are going to underdeliver".

Nintendo should've done that, though.
Yangus  +   581d ago
1080p at 60 fps 3D this visuals.
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

The Witcher 2-3. Enough.
dirthurts  +   581d ago
Good luck. My 1,2004 rig can't push those graphics at 60fps (I've tried). I can get around 30-45 roughly.
ExCest  +   581d ago
Current PCs have trouble running that game. We can only hope that the "next-gen" consoles will run the likes of BF3 on high.
yourfather  +   581d ago
No surprised,720P->1080P is big jump,but for many peoples they won't "feel" it's big different,at least not as big as 3 640x480->720P
tdogchristy90  +   581d ago
I want to know if these will be the last physical consoles or not. Or how long they'll last on the market.
cleft5  +   581d ago
Development cost are mentioned a few times here and that is going to be a very big deal with the leap in technology to come from the 720/ps4. The reality is that if a company invests to heavily on one game and they don't see a sizable return it could bankrupt the company. With what is happening to THQ I imagine a lot of game developers are going to be playing it safe.
Dlacy13g  +   581d ago
I get what this interview is trying to say, and I tend to agree. The leap from PS2/xbox to PS3/Xbox360 was a huge graphical leap. Games were catapulted into the HD generation in full force. We aren't able to make that kind of jump this next generation. The bigger upgrades will be more on the back end ...physics, AI, interaction with environments, faster loading...it will be more subtle on the surface but huge in reality.

I mean look at a game like Witcher 2 ...on the Highest end PCs (which I assume the new consoles will compare to) that game looks off the charts great. On the Xbox 360 Witcher 2 looks really, really good. Not as good as PC for sure but good enough that its not obvious at first glance. Now look at the original Halo game compared to just what they did with the anniversary edition. Its insanely upgraded visually to the point you almost don't believe they are the same game. We aren't going to see that kind of difference this time around.
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N0S3LFESTEEM  +   581d ago
By no means is a console going to compare with a highend PC... Unless your going to spends upwards of $900 on it. I would say the max you'll see from it is something comparable to a 560-660gtx or a amd equivalent. These consoles are NOT going to be pushing anything close to what a 680gtx or 6970 can dish out. Irregardless PC gaming will be seeing a boost when the specs from the 360 and Ps3 stop being the lowest denominator in the game engines these developers are using right now. I'm personally rocking a single 680gtx myself with a 6 core processor and 8gbs of ram so I'm already in "Next Gen" but I'm getting tired of these games designed to run on the console then be "up ported" with gpu heavy effects that knock down the fps but don't actually do anything noticeable to the graphics...
Dlacy13g  +   581d ago
@N0S3LFESTEEM You do realize I am talking about the leap in consoles don't you? This isn't a discussion about your 3LIT3 PC. Its about the expectation of a graphical leap forward from current gen consoles to the next gen and how we need to temper those expectations as it won't be a similar giant leap as we saw in last generation.

As for you being tired of games designed to run on console then "up ported" my response is get used to being tired. That has pretty much been the way the industry has been for the past 7yrs easy. You probably could have spent half the money you did on that "next gen" pc and got about the same performance from todays games given game devs are still making games in "this" gen.
ALLWRONG  +   581d ago
Dragon Age is a pretty good series and all but it really isn't known for it's great graphics.
LAWSON72  +   581d ago
Well it runs on frostbite 2 so da3 will have great graphics.
WitWolfy  +   580d ago
Not on consoles it wont
Belking  +   581d ago
xbox 720 will have plenty of power.
hivycox  +   581d ago
for what???

Xbox 720 got to be innovative and not just have "plenty of power"..people won't recognize the diffenrence between 720p and 1080p that much...Microsoft as well as Sony needs to develop new ways of playing games...
Belking  +   581d ago
I'm not worried. Xbox360 is a great console so I know the next will be even better. The hardware will be there, the rest is up to the devs. MS is always developing new ways to play games. They are on top of their game.
madjedi  +   580d ago
Stop using useless buzzwords like innovative
"Microsoft as well as Sony needs to develop new ways of playing games..." You have standard controllers, waggle- move/wii mote, camera controllers- kinect and eyetoy and also a tablet gamepad.

Pick one and play the fucking games already.

Lets see playing games moving sticks, pressing buttons and now touching a screen, short of substituting a button or a analog stick every now and then.

This is exactly the same way we have been playing games since pong, the controller is a tool to play the games.

The 720 only needs kickass games to get 360 gamers excited about upgrading to the next gen.

Funny because mario games still play like mario games, zelda like zelda ect. So why should sony or ms change.
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KrisButtar  +   581d ago
I'm not to sure I understand what buddy is say "costs are going to be higher" cause the way I am looking at it is ok games like far cry 3 this gen, then basically far cry 3 in 1080p at 60fps for next gen, I don't really see the cost increase as this gen games are ported over to the pc and upscaled to 1080p 60fps for little effort, so the little effort should be little cost? I might be missing something but I don't see how upscaling for next gen should be so much when pcs now do it for little cost
N0S3LFESTEEM  +   581d ago
Upscaled and Native resolutions are completely different things... Upscaling takes an image and stretches it to get it to fit. Your not actually seeing any improvement your just blowing up the picture. Native means that the image is being rendered using every pixel on your screen... so all the detail is there and you won't have the muddied effect that upscalling has.
KrisButtar  +   581d ago
Ok yes that makes a lot of sense, but why do people say games "look better on PC" when with what you said would disagree with that fact.
N0S3LFESTEEM  +   581d ago
Computers display at a native 1080p resolution along with better effects that the Consoles can't do right now... Ambient occlusion/ Tesselation/ Higher quality shaders. Those are a few examples... Consoles are sub 720p at the moment which equates to a picture that is half the size of 1080p. I don't know what I said before that gave you that impression?
Adropacrich2  +   581d ago
Those expecting standard 1080 60 fps would do well to lower expectations. Extra power simply means you have more still when you half the framerate to 30. All games can run at 60 and 1080 even now on current consoles but they would look half as pretty with this sacrifice. It'll be no different next gen either because devs have no real choice they feel competing to make their games as beautiful as possible. Sacrificing in this sense will always make for prettier graphics and as a result the only real option

Personally I'd like to see 60 standard but then again I'd also like to have the best possible graphics on screen. Always going to be a trade off
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Jek_Porkins  +   581d ago
It'll probably take a couple of years to see significant change. I mean if you go and play Saints Row on the Xbox 360 and then Saints Row 3, you'll know exactly what I mean.

I think devs have been preparing us all for this for a while now. I'd be more than happy with 60fps, native 1080 and none of that pop-in, draw-in ect.... I don't think it would take too much tech to accomplish that.

Really looking forward to seeing what they have up their sleeve.
kevnb  +   581d ago
Im thinking they will catch up with pc, anything beyond that is simply too expensive right now. Not the hardware, but to develop for.
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EffectO  +   581d ago
Hmm,this is what X-ray says about the title

"Lets see how many people actually read articles"
AlphaTauri  +   581d ago
He seems to be suggesting that the technical leap has more to do with the cost and size of employing teams than actual hardware - "I think they'll be better prepared, shall we say - but we can't see a ten-fold team increase again as the budgets would just be ridiculous."
Tyre  +   581d ago
He just says that it is a big leap, but not in the conventional way. I think he means cheaper development costs by using new engines that better utilize the new hardware. It is a big leap in graphics, but not such a change in development. Like Square Enix is showing with their new Engine. It's 1:1 exchange with 3D modelling and rendering software Maya, so less work in scaling things down. High polygon count models stay high polygon count models. No bigger teams needed, in fact it will be cheaper & faster for developers.
hivycox  +   581d ago
Nex Gen won't be defined by power!
That pretty much confirmed that the winner of the next gen won't be a biest but rather again something innovative...
I'm curious what Sony and Microsoft are planning.. If they release only more powerful systems it will hurt them
kma2k  +   581d ago
This is a gross generazation but the way i look at the jump is ps2 gameplay was pretty much the equavlent of good looking cut scenes from ps1. PS3 gameplay was pretty much equvalent of good looking cut scenes from ps2. So continuing the trend make gameplay of ps4 look like the cutscense from ps3 & you should be good graphically!
akaakaaka  +   581d ago
said by the devs that make Dragon Age, a game that look and specially most important plays like a old PS2 hd remake game.. lol
animegamingnerd  +   581d ago
but dragon age 3 is running on the frostbite engine
akaakaaka  +   581d ago
a monkey is still a monkey even if is wearing a suit..
dmonee  +   581d ago
Woh! Hold on a sec... bio ware has had their hands on these preliminary dev tools for only a little while. while I don't disagree completely with the point in this article. however, over time, some really smart, clever people will figure out ways to enhance the next gen gaming experience by doing things that other developers will question as to whether or not it can be done. it's happened every console cycle since the ps1. I remember when people doubted the ps1 being able to do FPS's. Then came medal of honor. After that it was cyphen filter. I have no doubt in my mind that 2 years from now we will be exploding in our pants at some of the stuff these developers will pull off on the next gen hardware.
360ICE  +   581d ago
Even if this generation is the longest one yet, this is to be expected. The leaps do tend to get smaller in time. The leap between PS1 and PS2, for instance, was massive. They're worlds apart in terms of gameplay and content. PS2 - PS3 was big, but not that big.
BitbyDeath  +   581d ago
As long as it looks better than current PC then that'll be enough.
Bladesfist  +   580d ago
I doubt consoles will be playing any games at 1600p + like PC can do.
BitbyDeath  +   580d ago
Larger resolution only allows for more pixels which does not necessarily mean it will look better.

Lower res games can look better than higher res games.

eg. heres a game running at 1600p
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

Many games on consoles already look better than this title.
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_LarZen_  +   580d ago
Sorry to have to disappoint you, but the next gen consoles will not be better then a gaming PC.

Most dedicated gamers have a graphics card that is more expensive then the console itself.

For casual gamers that just want to have some fun sometimes a console is more then enough, and the new gen consoles will make games look even better.

But if games is a hobby you invest in a computer that can give you the best graphical experience in the world. No other gaming plattform can do this.
linkenski  +   581d ago
Sad things about next-gen is that we are likely going to see more developers quitting because they don't have the budget to make proper titles for the system, and will therefore "die" from incompetence. It happened for a lot of japanese devs in this gen... well they didn't all quit but they definatly were noticably far behind the curve.

And usually better tech means bigger game design in terms of scale and geomitry, and sometimes during this gen, i thought games felt too linear and scripted from start to finish, and it was to avoid players from seeing the bad parts of the game maps, because the maps were so big that a standard dev team couldn't polish all corners.

There were unpolished games back in the PS2 days as well, and even all the way back to the NES but to me it seemed more obvious in this gen, because now that games are more life-like it stands out in contrast to it when there are severe glitches and bugs.

I simply fear that smaller developers won't be able to keep up once sony's big boys and MS' hired guns start firing their bullets.
#29 (Edited 581d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
younghavok  +   581d ago
Not surprising. I think if a next gen console really wants to strike a cord with gamers in a new way, they should allow modding on their software. Thats the main draw with pc gaming for most, implimenting that on consoles would be great. As it stands trying to do this whole dick measuring thing with specs can only go so far.
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