100°
Submitted by -Mezzo- 708d ago | interview

Bioware fan feedback “increasingly toxic” according to Dragon Age lead writer

EDGE - Dragon Age lead writer David Gaider has admitted that Bioware has retreated from using its forums as a source of feedback due to their “increasingly toxic” atmosphere. The comments are part of a blog posted in response to a player who claimed that many Bioware fans now avoid the studio’s social network as a result. (BioWare, Culture, Dragon Age: Origins)

Godmars290  +   709d ago
Hardly find such surprising after Bioware failed so badly with ME3 and DA2, especially with ME3 because they further failed to not only understand what they did wrong, why fans were upset, but then got upset about it themselves.
nukeitall  +   708d ago
People keep saying:

ME1 sucked!
ME2 sucked, because it departed from ME1!
ME# sucked!

To me, all three were fantastic in their own way and I think the way the series progressed was amazing. Bioware started ME1 with somewhat bad game play mechanics, but excellent story. Then they made ME2 excellent game play, but kind of bad story. Then they made the third one which sort of concluded the series.

I don't play Dragon Age, so I can't speak for that.
Godmars290  +   708d ago
Thing is if you look at their stories, from ME1 to ME3, there are fundamental narrative and continuity flaws throughout. Repeatedly things are established only to be broken because Bioware didn't want to, couldn't because of budget and/or production issues, put the effort into doing it right. These flaws build until you get ME3's ending.

ME1 didn't suck, but out of the three it had the least amount of flaws or was given leeway because it was first in the series, but Bioware only took that excuse to do worse.
nukeitall  +   708d ago
@Godmars290:

"ME1 didn't suck"

To many it did suck. Many new that started with ME2 thought it sucked really bad. I don't blame them, as it took some serious will power for me to give it a chance. Once I tried it past the half an hour it started getting amazing.

"Repeatedly things are established only to be broken because Bioware didn't want to, couldn't because of budget and/or production issues, put the effort into doing it right."

I don't know, but to me production or budget issues are common, and ME3 is a huge game with a lot of production put into it. Of course there will be flaws, but it is a game that has one of the richest worlds I have seen on consoles.

I can't say I agree with you nor the notion that developers don't want to put in the effort. Most of the developers seems genuinely wanting to create a good game, because they love the medium. We all know their pay ain't that great.
Root  +   709d ago
They're scared that people are calling BS on their crappy writing and how much EA has b****** them around.

They can't handle the truth so they try and run from it

<sigh>

So next time they say they've listened to fan feedback I can call BS on them now since they don't use the forums.
phantomexe  +   708d ago
lord have mercy do you guys need your sippy cups. I enjoyed the whole series....
rainslacker  +   707d ago
Actually...you are the exact kind of person who he is talking about making their forums toxic. You offer no constructive feedback, and instead resort to name calling, insults, and just general douche baggery.

I know where this guy is coming from, because the same thing happens on here on a daily basis. The informed, intelligent, and constructive posters keep silent, or they get drowned out by the negative, and completely useless posts from people like you.

It really amazes me that you think developers should listen to people such as yourself when you say things like you just did. Read what you wrote...would you want to listen to someone who treated you like that?
#2.2 (Edited 707d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Root  +   707d ago
I don't seen anything wrong with the comment, it's the truth and sometimes the truth hurts. I would of been disagreed to death if that was the case.

You live in a world where people can't speak their opinions or say anything negative about a company...bet you would be the first to defend Activision, Capcom or Square Enix... ¬¬
rainslacker  +   707d ago
From the article

"I imagine that can happen to any online community,” he continues. “Eventually the polite, reasonable folks stop feeling like it’s a group of people they want to hang around. So they leave, and those who remain start to see only those who agree with them — and, because that’s all they see, they think that’s all there is."

Just because people agree with you doesn't make the way you said it right. Yes the truth can hurt, but the truth doesn't have to be dished out cold. You claim the developer is scared....scared of what?

You claim they are running away from it.

From the article

“I’m sure there are folks there who would bristle at that comment, suggesting that all negative feedback is justifiable and that ignoring it is the equivalent of us sticking our heads in the sand. How will we ever improve unless we listen to their scolding and take our lumps like good little developers?

“That is, of course, ignoring the idea that we haven’t already digested a mountain of feedback- both positive and negative- and there’s really only so much of it you can take. Eventually you make decisions (informed by that feedback, though only in part- it can only ever be in part) and move on.”

At what point have the negative people given new criticism in a constructive manner. You certainly didn't. It's the same crap they've been listening to for months now. This whole thing steamrolled for them from a logical, well thought out criticism in among the community, to an entire internet bashing everything they've done.

You don't see anything wrong with what you said? How about I rephrase it to apply to you.

You are a sad individual with no thoughts of your own. You only parrot what you've heard, because you can't think for yourself. You live in a world where people agreeing with you means that you are morally just, and because of that you continue to spew your venomous hyperbole as gospel. At no time have I ever seen you provide any kind of constructive criticism on any topic on N4G, and instead resort to attacks on individuals and developers because you apparently have no concept of logical thinking or compassion.

The truth hurts doesn't it.

People can speak their opinions all they want. But if they're going to act like you they should be prepared for the response, and not resort to discrediting other peoples opinions.
#2.2.2 (Edited 707d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(2) | Report
BanBrother  +   708d ago
Normally I'm not in support of slamming developers, but I think gamers have got it right. Developers can't forget their fans and turn their backs for money (in this case from EA).

I'd like to think that Bioware learned from their mistakes, but I doubt it.
Seafort  +   708d ago
Well you reap what you sow. Bioware wanted their games to appeal to a larger, more casual market and they got that.

Don't be running away now as you got what you wanted, warts and all.
Megaton  +   708d ago
Slop article. Summary: "Poor BioWare, entitled fans are entitled."

I do agree about negativity over there, but what do you expect? They've screwed up their last two fan favorites, increasingly showing signs of full EA assimilation. To follow up with that, they deliver bad DLC at raised prices. If you poke someone in the eye, don't act shocked when they're none too happy about it.

I don't even visit BSN anymore. I just get annoyed when I think about BioWare, so I don't bother. I get my negativity fill here, at N4G. Hanging around BSN would be too much.
redDevil87  +   708d ago
I bet Eiffel is supplying you with all the negativity you need ;)
Megaton  +   708d ago
He is a pretty good source, but pales in comparison to dchalfont.
pandehz  +   708d ago
DA2= Same textures in the entire game everywhere with some decent voice acting and sorta fun combat which gets a bit boring due to the same combat routine fight after fight.

ME3=Decent plot, some good emotional moments, good soundtrack, very fun gameplay, most undeserved ending for such a good game. Not a terrible ending as I'm still quite touched by the end but I admit it was not the ending the game/trilogy deserved.

SWTOR=World of Warcraft with voice acting. Same quest structure, even the classes feel sameish, jedi's are tanks or melee dps'es, there is a jedi sorcerer too omg of all the names they actually went sorc and it even feels like a magic sorc with a lightsaber tacked on.

The animations are quite bad, some look ok but mostly its very outdated. The artstyle is good. Graphics are decent and work with the artstyle. Terrible game performance from day one on good computers. Voice acted massive storyline is pretty good with numerous cutscenes and 6 class stories. Literally the story thing is the only good aspect of the game. Rest feel tacked on. There's no motivation to explore. Quest system is worse than WOW.

F2P system in this game is a good example of how to kill a game quick. Anyone who doubts what I'm saying about its horrid f2p system should download it and have a good laugh at the number of things locked off. Need to pay to show certain nameplates, need to pay to turn off helmet/headgear, need to pay to play dungeons if its more than 3 times a week which it will for sure. Pay to play pvp wz if its more than 5 a week and loads more. Literally everywhere theres a limitation. Also the deals are such that if you actually want to get them all separately without subscribing then its way more expensive than subbing by a huge margin.

So yea overall SWTOR is a no no

Well from all BIO has done only ME3 was good. DA2 was a clear cashgrab. SWTOR will fade away.

So I guess extreme FAN reactions are kinda expected. I repeat FAN reaction. Regular gamers will get by and move on. Fans who stuck by deserve the right to speak their mind.

BUT, if the responses and posts are too extreme I believe Bio should shut down the forums and get on with their work peacefully. It does hurt to get bashed by ppl everywhere for every minor thing. Lol just today I read some random hatred for very stupid things.
#6 (Edited 708d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
tigertron  +   708d ago
I'm not surprised we're toxic, especially after the treatment Mass Effect 3 received.
IIJOSEPHXII  +   708d ago
I have't been on BSN for a year or so. Not because of the toxic atmosphere, but because their sequels aren't worth chatting about.
ame22  +   708d ago
Jesus people get over it. Yeah the ending was bad, but everyone deserves a second shot. Look at GTAIV for example, weak sauce yet everyone (including fans) geeks out when they here "GTAV", so who are you to judge?
#9 (Edited 708d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
Quadraxis  +   708d ago
Oh yes I agree, Bioware totally deserves a second opportunity. I mean, DA2 and TOR weren't THAT bad, right?

They deserve their newfound reputation.
MilkMan  +   708d ago
No what they are saying is, now its time to turn a page and look forward. It was a mistake to cater to some fans that didn't like the ending. I said when it was happening. You don't change your artistic view.
Would I have liked to be able to use the armada I amassed in ME3, sure. But it is what it is.
I don't start a campaign on every single thing I don't like. The Hobbit could have been better, should I start a campaign to change that also?
What about Dredd 3D? The eagle on his right shoulder wasn't as pronounced. I want to start a campaign to make it huge, just like the comic.
We are not entitled to anything. This was not out god-given birth right. Its a game. That's all a silly game.
Blacklash93  +   708d ago
If he's looking at the Bioware Social Network it's no wonder he thinks this. That place has always been a cesspit and it's only gotten worse.
#11 (Edited 708d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
dennett316  +   708d ago
Gamers don't help themselves at times. It's all very well to give constructive feedback and do so in a polite manner, but frankly, a lot of gamers it seems lack the capacity to do that and instead lash out like angry children.

And they will nitpick every little detail and turn it into some sort of major flaw that completely ruins a game...same as a lot of snarky film "fans" are doing by screaming "PLOTHOLE!!" at every little inconsistency they see in a film.
They claim to want smarter movies and games, but then whine and cry when things aren't explained in explicit enough detail for their little pea-brains to comprehend. They then vent their frustrations on forums by throwing tantrums and being disrespectful, and then wonder why people don't take their "opinions" seriously.
phantomexe  +   708d ago
Really lets be honest here me3 ending was pure dog crap but not the whole game. ME3 is epic to the very end buts it fails to end the series on a high note. ME was a great series to the end but we all wanted it to explain stuff better and not take away choices. Everones got there own opinion but the last 10 min didn't kill the whole experience so lets not pretend it did.
CoreGamerzInc  +   708d ago
Fans are dumb. Mass effect 3 ended perfectly. Sometimes there isn't a happy ending morons! Just play the game n shut up! Nothing is never good enough for most fans. If you can do better then go make your own game. Bioware makes great games. It's the fans who suck! I've played ME since day 1 n Dragon Age so save your nonsense!
MaleManSam  +   708d ago
I just want Star wars: KOTOR III :(
#15 (Edited 708d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply

Add comment

You need to be registered to add comments. Register here or login
Remember
New stories
30°

Slap-dot-dash

10m ago - Matt at Codec Moments writes: "‘Twas the night before Christmas, and all through the house, n... | PC
20°

New Video and Screenshots of One Piece: Pirate Warriors 3

15m ago - The video shows Luffy’s beginnings receiving the Straw Hat from Shanks to flashes of members join... | PS3
20°

Was Removing Hatred from Greenlight Censorship?

16m ago - "Censorship is a white-hot issue in the gaming world right now. Games have been pulled from sa... | Culture
10°

Axe to Compete at Forte 2

17m ago - Jeffrey 'Axe' Williamson will be headed to the University of Texas in Austin, Texas this weekend... | GameCube
Ad

Win a PS4!!

Now - Join us on Filmwatch to find out how you can win a free PS4 this holiday season! | Promoted post
40°

Latest Halo: The Master Chief Collection Update Released

21m ago - If you are a huge Halo fan and have been playing The Master Chief Collection since it launched th... | PC