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Submitted by -Mezzo- 1135d ago | opinion piece

Sony's Next Console Won't Block Used Games

Forbes - The great used game debate is back on the table. This time, a user on NeoGAF has discovered a patent that would theoretically allow Sony to prevent hardware. (Next-Gen, PS3)

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-Mezzo-  +   1135d ago
I sure hope so, if they do end up going forward with this ridiculous idea. I'm moving to PC Gaming for good.
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TheStorm  +   1135d ago
Uhhh why? PC games you can't buy used copies, never have been able to.

Steam dominates most sales of PC games, so you will never buy a "used game" there.
-Mezzo-  +   1135d ago
Ofcourse, but you do get Games extremely cheap, $20 to $25 cheaper compared to the console versions.
TheStorm  +   1135d ago

However, the library of PC games (especially new) have dwindled ,and may continue to do so.

Unless Valve's new console really takes off. Which could be.
ronin4life  +   1135d ago
In europe, resale of digital content has beem ruled legal and steam can't stop you from doing so.

Furthermore, steam has a laundry list of positives that eclipse the negative aspects of its native platform, and if consoles just become little pcs without those steam like benefits it makes sense that many may just do away with consoles and stick with pcs, something they are bound to have/need regardless.
SPAM-FRITTER-123  +   1135d ago
why would you buy used PC games when they are as cheap if not cheaper and you get all the trimmings with it.
kevnb  +   1135d ago
the library of pc games has dwindled? What are you talking about? There are so many pc games too choose from I don't even know where to begin. And valve isnt making a console, just an htpc type thing that we have seen other companies introduce.
Truth is for pc gaming retail has already pretty much been replaced, thats why we see so many free to play games and digital stores. Dont worry consoles will catch up next gen.
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pixelsword  +   1135d ago
Nowadays, the average teen's free time is spent either playing Video Games or masturbation...

...You're putting a lot of teens in a sticky situation, Sony.
kreate  +   1135d ago

Wouldn't they increase the prices of pc games due to the changing gaming eco-system affected by this patent assuming it will be affected?
bozebo  +   1135d ago
"However, the library of PC games (especially new) have dwindled"

.... What. Total complete and utter bull. That's exactly what's happened on consoles.
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FriedGoat  +   1134d ago
PC is nothing like it used to be, it used to be ALOT better in the exclusive area. Still better than consoles currently.
SilentNegotiator  +   1134d ago
"but you do get Games extremely cheap"

Not always, and not when you want to buy at launch.
Kingofwiiu  +   1134d ago
@the storm. Owned!!!
Megaton  +   1134d ago
"However, the library of PC games (especially new) have dwindled ,and may continue to do so."

You should inform my Steam library of that...
STONEY4  +   1134d ago
"Not always, and not when you want to buy at launch."

GreenManGaming basically has pre-order prices for Steamworks games covered. Got Sleeping Dogs for $36 and Borderlands 2 for $40, both pre-orders.

Also, Steam and Amazon sales are always going to be better than what you can find used on consoles, which is why the lack of used games doesn't really matter on PC.

There is honestly no reason PC would ever need used games, or benefit from it.
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BrianC6234  +   1134d ago
" Ofcourse, but you do get Games extremely cheap, $20 to $25 cheaper compared to the console versions."

Then go ahead and switch. Big deal. It's so funny to see people running around screaming about how bad this is. Maybe developers will all throw their support to the console that does this and no other systems. They'll make more money if the used game business ends. Just wait for sales if you don't like game prices. There's plenty of great deals.
TekoIie  +   1134d ago
On PC you dont need to buy gets pre-owned because there's something called "Steam Sales"...

*wink wink* :3
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T3MPL3TON  +   1134d ago
"However, the library of PC games (especially new) have dwindled and may continue to do so."

That's so incorrect it's hilarious. The only people who actually believe that the PC gaming market is shrinking are people who don't play PC games. Simply turning on steam will greet you with tons of games new and old.
Bigpappy  +   1134d ago
If they are going to get rid of use games, then they need to make better demo's, and have a return policy which allows the gamers to recoup some of that upfront cost if the game ends up being crap. Something like (90%) back in the first week of the purchase date. I have been mislead and ripped off to much in the pass, when developers conspire with some in the game media to mislead gamers. They get your $60 and you get a shinny disk with egg on your face.
Toolster  +   1134d ago
You can buy used PC disk based games, several retailers in Norwich take then in, even Gamestation took them when I worked for them, the only reason we did not take them was if the key was missing or it was a game like half life 2
AngelicIceDiamond  +   1135d ago
The patent was done 6 years ago. And Sony probably re-new the patent just re-new it, to keep it relevant for whatever purpose.

6 years ago they patent it, nothing happen, and 6 years later they updated it and I'm sure nothing will happen again with the PS4.
Ranma1  +   1135d ago
I am actually kind of for this, so long as new game prices are halved.
kma2k  +   1135d ago
A lot of people are saying this or saying just wait a month for prices to go down but without the used market there is no reason for prices to drop...ever! The reason prices fall as quickly as they do is to combat used game prices there is comptetition if you remove competition there is no reason to compete price wise! If they truley removed used game i would expect games to go up & they would say its because of how expensive next gen is.
BrianC6234  +   1134d ago
"A lot of people are saying this or saying just wait a month for prices to go down but without the used market there is no reason for prices to drop...ever!"

That's not true at all. If old games don't drop in price stores will have to send them back. They drop the price to clear stock. Used games don't have anything to do with that.
InMyOpinion  +   1134d ago
They want to remove used games to make more money. Halving the prices on new games wouldn't make sense from a business perspective. By keeping the same prices they will make up for what they lost on used game sales.

That's how I think they argue, although I'm in no way for it.
HappyGaming  +   1134d ago
kma2k has a point but its not so black and white. The used game market creates competition of publishers but publishers still have to compote against each other in the store shelfs.

None the less if second hand games are ever banned be sure that it will not favour our pockets even if you never buy second hand games yourselves.
Sony360  +   1134d ago
Only they won't be. They'll increase if anything.
GribbleGrunger  +   1135d ago
Ok, putting this whole overblown patent issue to one side, have you ever bought a game you can't sell or share? Think carefully about that before answering. Your HDD has the answer...

... ok, so you have.

Same here. A few years back, I would never entertain the idea of owning a game without having the right to sell it or lend it out, but here I am and the concept is no longer an issue. Would this patent be any different, if indeed it was implemented? No. The only difference is the delivery point.
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tiffac008  +   1134d ago
I still don't like the idea bro, I mean I would never have known how great Uncharted, InFamous or Assassin's Creed if my friends did not let me borrow their copies first, that led me to buying the games and I could never have purchased a copy of Folklore if it was not for 2nd hand sellers because no one is selling the game brand new locally anymore (and ordering online is too costly for us over here).

So yes, your right we cannot resell or lend our games on our HDD but we are talking about physical copies here (disc or whatever media it will be)

I doubt Sony or MS would implement this because it seems like suicide.

I'm just against it through and through.
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InMyOpinion  +   1134d ago
@GribbleGrunger - So, you'd be ok with Sony going download only/streaming for games with the PS4?
GribbleGrunger  +   1134d ago
To be honest, I don't know. I always swore I'd never buy digital games for the very same reason, but I currently have sixteen on my HDD
bigfish  +   1134d ago
Who cares,, I buy all my games brand new anyway... stop over reacting guys (or should i say girls)
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LOOK_AT_THIS_I  +   1134d ago
Who cares if all you buy is new games. Get over yourself, the used game market is huge.

If 10% of the people who own consoles that purchase a random new game and several used copies were to suddenly leave the console market your game makers would see a huge decline in sales and would then start laying off more staff creating more sub par products. This would lead to less game companies and even shittier games as only those mega franchises and heavily marketed games would succeed.

Borrowing games, renting and used games I've purchased online have led me to enjoy several games I wouldn't have touched otherwise and I'm sure that many others around here are the same.
insomnium2  +   1134d ago
@ look at this

But what if games cost only 30 dollars brand new at launch. Would you be pro-used-games still?

Seriously if they get the price for games cut in half and shut down used game markets entirely I doubt there will be a backlash. I mean the games cost 69.95€ here in stores. That's why I shop online from the UK. New games for sub 50€ easily.

I don't usually buy games brand new but the last time I really had to have a game day 1 and even payed 69.95€ for it was MGS4. I buy games when they hit sub 20 pounds mostly. 25€ is the limit. I'll be able to buy Borderlands 2 and Far cry 3 soon. I'm patient and my backlog is loooooong. Might have to buy a new game with Ni no kuni soon though....
BrianC6234  +   1134d ago
There must be a lot of girlies on here since you have 12 disagrees. It seems like a lot of worry warts. So scared of not being able to buy an old used game. Well you people are helping to hurt the gaming industry. Better to buy a game on sale than used. At least that way the right people get paid.
PooEgg  +   1134d ago

I buy my games new too, but I still don't like the idea of basic consumer rights being taken away from us.

Also your little insult makes you sound like a 5 year old, so perhaps your mom is still buying all your games for you and that would explain why you have no concept of gaming budget that many gamers live with.
otherZinc  +   1134d ago
1. The PS3 isn't SONY's strongest brand.

2. The Vita "isn't exactly soaring", please, the Vita is doing nothing.

3. SONY once touted PS3 as being completely compatible with PS1 & PS2 games on the PS3...Now, you cant play 1 damn PS1 or PS2 game on the PS3, period. Unless, you buy a collectors edition of a PS1 or PS2 game you've already purchased once. Like SONY did in fall of 2012 with all the retro classics.

Also, that was a marketing ploy of SONY, as M$'s 360 wasn't going to be backwards compatible but with only its top 10 games. Then got the pressure from the public & SONY, NOW, the 360 still has more than 500 backwards compatible games to this day & SONY's PS3 has None.

So yeah, anything is possible with SONY, as they've promised many things & fell way short on delivery. Its really anyone's guess.
Ingram  +   1134d ago
Yeah, no.

All PS3s are compatible with 99% of PS1 library.

I remember they taking out retro and linux, but I have a PS2 and a PC anyway.
I like being able to download PS2 games that otherwise I would have to buy on ebay, like Godhand.

PS Store has to step up the game though, EU content is taking ages to be worthwhile, we just got hold of Castlevania SOTN some weeks ago, can you believe this s***?
miDnIghtEr20C_SfF  +   1134d ago
Oh... So Mezzo is SDF? Would explain the many bubbles. I know you contribute like it's your job here, so that might be why so many as well.

But you wouldn't get an Xbox next gen if not a PS4? You'd go straight to PC gaming? Why not an Xbox?

Guess you're not a true console gamer. Your post explains a lot for me.
MostJadedGamer  +   1134d ago
They didn't finsh the statement. The full statement is; Sony will not block used games unless Microsoft also blocks used games.

Either both will do it or neither will do it. One would never do it without the other other because it would kill sales of there console.
solar  +   1134d ago
MS and Sony wont ban, but make it a pain in the ass for gamers to play their used games. kinda like how an auto company makes you jump tho hoops to..oh who am i kidding. the video game industry needs to accept the medium they are. and stop playing this victim game. from day 1 the industry has had used game sales. if you dont like it, join a different industry to make your money
TAURUS-555  +   1134d ago
the pass code thing would be a huge mistake cuz look at some EA games like friday night fight, somehow i deleted my old account and now ive to buy that stupid pass code to play it online, BS ¡¡¡
Optical_Matrix  +   1135d ago
I remember the same rumour was going around when PS3 was announced. About how Sony were implementing a system whereby you could would buy a game, and the blu-ray disc would be locked to that one PS3 system, meaning no rentals, no pre-owned games and no taking your game to a friends house...and look at how that turned out?
SAE  +   1135d ago
Dont forget the pass code , they are half the way to make this true ...

i really dont want it but this could happen ..

i dont trust sony any more after the vita , wont judge until i see the ps4 ..
DA_SHREDDER  +   1135d ago
agreed. The R&D department has their heads halfway up their butts at all times it seems
pixelsword  +   1135d ago
I don't own a Vita; what's wrong with it?
SAE  +   1134d ago
Vita is really complicating because of the limitation sony did to protect it from having the fate of the psp , that cost me the fun , limitation such as one account per vita , locked features such as remote for ps3 and pc ..etc , the sad part is that these things aint helping the pirates , it's just an excuse to do these limitation , ps3 proved this ..

that's what's wrong with it , more thinking then playing and using the vita for what it's made for , you wouldnt notice until you buy one , if you are a fanboy you will accept it , if you are smart you would demand it , evolving in gaming is not limiting and locking , it's doing and offering new things ...

i love the vita , sony made it right but they are not using it right , that's my problem with it ..
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SAE  +   1134d ago
I guess pass code is a good idea for you guys and it have nothing to do with this ..

Oh well , im trying to accept your thinking , it's just hard sometimes to understand you ..

i dont see a reason to disagree unless you dont like me not trusting sony any more and think the vita is perfect ..
rainslacker  +   1134d ago
I disagreed with you because in one sentence you said why Sony is doing what they're doing, then suggested they need to make it easier for them to allow the things they're trying to prevent, yet also admit that the things they did are actually preventing the things they're meant to.
Karum  +   1134d ago
I've really no idea what you're complaining about tbh, maybe it's how you've written it as I'm not sure what you mean by locked features like remote for PS3 and pc etc.

As for one account per Vita, not sure why that's a big deal unless you're wanting to be buying content from other regions which is a slight annoyance.

Personally my Vita does everything I want it to which is letting me play Vita games.
lonix  +   1135d ago
They could still use the system, but only to prevent piracy. How can you burn a disk with a RFID stamped into it.
Ryo-Hazuki  +   1135d ago
Already knew this
-Alpha  +   1135d ago
Doesn't make sense to me that Sony would waste money researching such a method, that may be able to get hacked soon after. Online passes are enough.

Easier to lock out trophies or better yet, award new-copy purchasers similar to how Nintendo does it with Club Nintendo-- register new games, get credit towards something like 3 months of PS+ or something like that,

Reward those who buy new games instead of punishing everyone
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LOOK_AT_THIS_I  +   1134d ago
The rewards system was similar to the Nintendo deal. It's a shame that it didn't come to everyone. If I had to guess this is either patent squatting or that hopefully the system will just read the disc as authentic and not a burned copy. I don't really see them doing this due to the huge backlash unless they were to drop brand new games to less than 30 bucks.
For marketing purposes I would rather release a game brand new as a pre-order for 30 bucks and then jump the price up after it is released to create more market penetration upon initial release. If I can pre order 2 games brand new for the price of what one is now I would accept this but this type of promotion will never happen widespread on consoles.
rainslacker  +   1134d ago
It probably wouldn't even have to be half-price to drive pre-order sales. $10 may be enough, and I'm sure retailers would love such a thing, since they basically just sit on your money and have it collect interest. I don't believe they can legally spend it, as it's kind of an escrow thing, and they have to be able to give it all back at any moment if necessary.
doogiebear  +   1134d ago
Locking out trophies is not a big enough deterrent. Nobody cares, especially since nobody gains from checking their friends trophies anyway.
Root  +   1135d ago
"Sony wants the hardcore gamers. As Xbox moves more aggressively towards TV, Sony appears to be moving after the traditional gamers and a more mature audience partial to games like The Unfinished Swan"

and that my friends is why I love Sony.

They could of went after the casual crowd years ago with the situation there is but they havent.
-MD-  +   1135d ago
And they're bleeding money because of it.
ExCest  +   1134d ago
I wish I could bleed money. Then I'd be rich after cutting myself a few dozen times.
InMyOpinion  +   1134d ago
"As Xbox moves more aggressively towards TV"

Halo 4, Mark of the Ninja, Forza Horizon and Trials Evolution seem more aimed at the hardcore audience than Playstation All Stars Battle Royal, Wonderbook and LittleBigPlanet Karting imo.

I think both consoles have great exclusives but lets keep it factual.
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Hicken  +   1135d ago
Of course it won't. Just wishful thinking by certain people.
Kyosuke_Sanada  +   1135d ago
"Sony's next console blocks new games now."

Articles inbound....
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Enemy  +   1135d ago
Did anyone honestly believe it would happen? Patents are registered all the time, doesn't mean anything.
Pintheshadows  +   1135d ago
According to the Sony patent 'if you attempt to insert a used game into the PS4 system it will be ejected out of the disc drive and violently decapitate you, as opposed to peacefully decapitating you. We wanted to make that distinction as we at Sony feel a strong hatred toward people who buy used games, so expect your disc based decapitation to be as gory and brutal as you can imagine. If you have any queries please check the handy FAQ on our website.'

Although I definately made that up.
Walker  +   1135d ago
I hope so ...
The_Klank  +   1135d ago
Its stunning to me how much coverage this story is getting.
As of writing this the top 5 articles are about this patent.

I think the whole thing has gotten completely blown out of proportion.
Knight_Crawler  +   1135d ago
But at the same time this is good because if Sony was really thinking about doing this on the PS4 then they would have to rethink that decision because of all the negative backlash that this is creating.

Edit: I remember when the PSP Go was leaked and people found out that it would only do digital games, the response was negative but Sony still went ahead with it but ended up paying for it.
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pixelsword  +   1135d ago
Remember this when people try to pass an non-sony bad news article and you get the "it's too similar to such and such article".

The Irony that you taste will be the steel-boot of bias.

BanBrother  +   1134d ago

Blown out of proportion? This is probably the most ideal time to be throwing our arms around and asking what the f*** is going on.
It is like having a law that states the red cross can kick you in the nuts for not donating money.

I doubt it will be implemented, but if we didn't say anything, we only have ourselves to blame when our kids are asking why the game they took over their friends house wouldn't work on their console.
rainslacker  +   1134d ago
I think saying it will happen is blowing it out of proportion.

I also believe saying "Sony is doomed" because of a patent filing is blowing it out of proportion, and just sensationalism.

The discussion of it's effects or what people think about the technology, regardless of system, IS NOT blown out of proportion. As consumers we have a right, and in my opinion, duty to make our voices heard. The time to do that is before, not after, something like this is actually implemented.
hardcorehippiez  +   1134d ago
you have got to realize that this is a crucial time for the console giants , while this could be something completely unrelated to the ps4 the competition are going to use whatever dirt they can to discredit the competitors . this is all part of the on going fud campaign against sony .
smashcrashbash  +   1135d ago
If people had any common sense left they would see how stupid this is. But common sense is not so common these days. I know a lot of you hate Sony A LOT but I think you over estimate how stupid you think they really are.Do you really think they would completely block used games if no one else is doing it? I instead would be concerned how many others will be doing it too. If Sony does this that means that the whole industry will be contemplating it too.I doubt very much they will be standing in a corner blocking used games by themselves hoping that there will be no backlash or outrage against them.So just stop and move on. If it happens then we can bite and scratch and complain. Until then don't blow blood vessels over this.
Pillsbury1  +   1135d ago
Patents manifest all the time, does not mean they will come true.
vork77  +   1135d ago
if it wont block im sold
ginsunuva  +   1135d ago
Didn't microsoft also patent something similar a while ago, and everyone went apeshit?
tubers  +   1134d ago
Modern PC shts on any single console in terms of library.

@topic: It would suck.. but I can see it happening and people accepting it.

DRM getting worse and worse on every platform :(
ufo8mycat  +   1134d ago
The last game I played on my PC was The Witcher 2. The rest were already available on PS3 or 360.

The Witcher 2 is old now - Shows how lack luster the PC library really is.

My PC is gathering dust
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360ICE  +   1134d ago
Notice how Forbes is a little more reflected than your average gaming media.
r21  +   1134d ago
If Sony is paying attention to how gamers are reacting to this, they probably arent gonna implement this feature into the PS4 anyways. Im hoping thats the case.
b_one  +   1134d ago
they wont, they could do those things years ago, this "patent news" was only damage control due to news about nelsons timer
MadMen  +   1134d ago
yes it will, thats what Johnny said, yea Johnny said that, yea Jonny

Who the hell is Johnny.....exactly
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Adolph Fitler  +   1134d ago
Anyone else notice that for every negative bit of press any oter console gets, Sony gets 20 times more & always more damaging type stuff.
Like Nintendo may get a story or 2 shed in negative light about Wii-U & it's power & such, but at least Nintendo's machine has released, it is out there for people to see & judge for themselves, & at least Wii-U's power debate is steeped in realism & facts......whereas Sony cops grief for stuff they haven't even done yet & obviously are not going to do, as people with half a brain have figured out.

Gee wiz, I can't wait till Sony actually show something & announce the PS4/Orbis is going to be 2005/6 & 7 all over again. Hate, hate, hate, death to Sony, hate, hate, hate.......
Let it go fangirls, release the hate, Sony are a great console manufacturing & gaming company, they have got a helluva lot more right than wrong, as proven by sales numbers of there 1st console on the market that catapulted gaming to mainstream masses by selling over 100 million units (SNES was the best at 60 million until Sony came along), they took games like Wipeout & such to nightclubs across the UK & Europe as a marketing tool & it paid off dividends.
They gave developers a way out of paying massive proprietry format fees that Nintendo were ripping them off for, & in turn gave the developers a fairer playing field to make the games they desired (Nintendo were complete Nazi b%$tards because they would make these developers pay huge money for development kits, not show them anything on how to use it or tricks or give them any help, then these struggling developers would make a great little game, show it to Nintendo, as they HAD to green light it, & they would knock many games back because they may have been in the same genre as one of there 1st party titles.

So, Sony will not be stopping used games,nyou dreamers, so get over it & be angry at the fact that I, & millions like me will be buying PS4/Orbis on the 1st day it launches & we will do everything we can to ensure Sony stays here in the business, as there games are awesome, there controller (DS3) is the best, & there console is also great (PS3), & PS4/Orbis will be also.
DJ  +   1134d ago
It's an old patent that they renewed. If anything it's just technology they can license to other parties. The easiest method though is going to be blocking used game sales by having every game come with a 12 digit unlock code.

Play the game as much as you want for an hour. But after that, it's time to buy.
taijutsu363  +   1134d ago
Wonder what the new games will cost? When the ps3 came out it went from $49.99 to $59.99 so will they jump it another ten to $69.99???! Id love it if they kept it $59.99 or lowered it back down! lol But thats a dream price!
isarai  +   1134d ago
Every one of the 3 bigs has these kinds of patents. it's more a proof of concept and portfolio thing than anything else. Sony has tons of patents they NEVER used, or never will use(including one for cross game on PS3)
Jimneous  +   1134d ago
I'll probably get a million+ disagrees just for speculating, but maybe Sony has the patent, not to use it but to prevent others from using it. Very unlikely I know but it's nice to believe that there could be some goodness behind it.
ExCest  +   1134d ago
Well, that's certainly a possibility and I hope that's the case. If they haven't used it, then they have a reason for not using it: to save the world!
blackblades  +   1134d ago
They need to stay with the online passes.
ExCest  +   1134d ago
They need to get rid of the online passes. Also, Sony isn't an online pass offender (or a bad one. All Stars has one but they gave me a vita version of the game so all's good). That'd be EA, Ubisoft, and [insert whatever other company does it].
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andron666  +   1134d ago
People have real short memories, this is just part of the usual fud Sony doom and gloom blog wave, and you just got suckered into giving them the hits, again...

Sony had similar patents that could have blocked used games before PS3 and said they wouldn't use it then.

I won't buy any console that blocks used games, but I don't think Sony are dumb enough to use it either...
strigoi814  +   1134d ago
if sony do this developers will be making more will be a win win for sony and developers.

Gaming is a expensive hobby so if you cant live with it..then i think it would be nice to quit, and i guess stop complaining
Dfooster  +   1134d ago
Sonys profits won't increase if they bring this in because all they are doing is shifting the equilibrium but the money pot remains the same size. Let me explain.

Someone buys a game full price for say £40 they play it and trade it in for £20 which they then put that cash towards a new title which is also £40 so you have to put another £20 towards that upgrade. Once you are on the conveyor belt of trading and buying it means Sony are getting £20 off each punter far more often than if you have to outlay £40 for a game which is dead money once you leave the shop.

They will get more money per title if they bring this in but they will sell far less copies and seeing as the cost of a game is mainly the development costs rather than the cost of burning a disk and putting it into a box it won't provide the revenue increase they are hoping for. In fact quite the reverse because my second point is used games encourage gamers to try franchises they might not otherwise try at £40 a go.

Once you get a gamer hooked on a franchise by them picking up the first game in the series as a cheap used copy they are more likely to be queuing up for a midnight release of the sequel at full retail price.

The money people spend on their games won't fluctuate it just means they will be playing less games for their outlay. Nobody wins, sony sells less games and gamers play less games and developers take less risks with new IPs.

The used games market is vital for the games industry.
#29 (Edited 1134d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
talisker  +   1134d ago
I don't buy many PC games mainly for the reason I can't sell them back after finishing, which makes them expensive.

Steam sales don't impress me either. Many of those games on sale are the same I got from PS+ or I could buy them for similar price used and still be able to sell them back. Steam may seem cheap to people who only go to shopping mall chains for their games.
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