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Submitted by MikeBarrett 718d ago | opinion piece

Can We Save Judging Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII Until We Actually See It?

Pixels or Death's Mike Barrett reasons that we should swallow our nostalgia and let Square Enix make the kind of games they want with Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII

"Square Enix is not content with stagnation. They want to be the trendsetters they’ve always been. These new ideas might suck, but that’s okay. There’s value in the attempt." (Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII, PS3, Square Enix, Xbox 360)

Haha123  +   718d ago
Because your precious 6 years developed game hasnt been shown?
Carl_Shocker  +   718d ago
Erm...no

FF13 was crap

FF13-2 was just as crap despite seeming as an improvment but then again FF13 was so crap as a FF game that anything after it is going to seem like an improvment

FF13-3 "Lightning Returns" will be exactly the same...come on man this is Square. Why do people keep falling for this
#2 (Edited 718d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(16) | Report | Reply
Snookies12  +   718d ago
Slight correction, "This is (Enix)". Square was amazing before they added Enix lol.
LiViNgLeGaCY  +   718d ago
Funny thing is, Enix was also amazing before the merge with Square. I don't get it.
Kyosuke_Sanada  +   718d ago
True, Living Legacy. They made R.A.D (Robot Alchemic Drive), a mecha that controlled like the Big O! Enough said!
Snookies12  +   718d ago
I never said Enix was bad before the merge. o_o I loved RAD as well, just saying THAT'S when stuff started going downhill.
wishingW3L  +   718d ago
if it weren't a direct sequel I would agree but....
#3 (Edited 718d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(13) | Report | Reply
Godmars290  +   718d ago
Given its connection to a story I lost interest in, can I simply not care?

For all my "complaining" All I've been asking is that they move on. That they acknowledge mistakes made and move on.

Sadly they haven't done either to any degree, except with FF14 and there the mistakes were damned obvious.
#4 (Edited 718d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
helghast102  +   718d ago
You can not care, and that's fine, but there is zero point in shitposting about the game everywhere.

If you don't do that, then fine, but it's a general statement, I'm really sick of people who allegedly "don't care" yet make an effort to shit all over the game.
Lucretia  +   718d ago
exactly, People hate the game/ series so much yet they are always the first to post their hate about it.

i dont get it. isn't there "Better" games they should be playing instead of hating and judging a game that isn't out, or bashing a game that was good but not perfect.

seriously, i feel like a child around most of the idiots on this site. Bickering and whining
N4GDgAPc  +   718d ago
@helghast02
Exactly. I'm getting tired of people posting like its fact no one wants this game. There blinded by there hate that they don't realize there is ALOT of people that want this game and loved final fantasy 13. If you don't want it then don't buy it. I'll enjoy Lightning Returns and also enjoy VS13 when it comes out. More games to play better for me.
Capt-FuzzyPants  +   718d ago
You're right. They all say they don't care, but they obviously care enough to bitch about these games on these articles.

They're all so selfish too. There were people who liked the first two games and we weren't given an ending. If they didn't make this third game then they would piss off everyone that liked the first two games. I click on the articles to learn about the games and get hyped. They click on the articles to bitch about how linear FF13 was and then they want to move all of the FF13 team over to Versus to make it go quicker. Even though that many people on one team would probably do more harm then good.

If I went to every The Last of Us article and complained about how they're making that instead of UC4 I would essentially be doing the same thing Godmars and Ranma do.
Carl_Shocker  +   718d ago
@Lucretia

So were only supposed to write possitive comments...why is it so hard for FF13 fans to accept that it's not a well liked game by the majority of people.

If you can write possitive comments then whats wrong with the ones full of criticism

Oh and calling people idiots...come on man, thats low.
Godmars290  +   718d ago
Thing is if the game doesn't do well, in comparison to prior entries in the series or not, in relation to honest numbers or not, there will be twice as many articles like this blaming the complainers - when I for one have already given my reason for not wanting to buy it.

It will be Square's fault for not listening but pretending like they did, and it will be the defenders for refusing to recognize the issues with the direction the series took with the entry.

Toriyama had this whole "trilogy" planned out from the beginning but was too pig headed to see the train wreck its become. The loss of respect its costs Sqaure, and the division its created among the fandom.

If they pull something like this again, become inflexible while being overly focused on graphics and marketing over story and gameplay then stretching it into a watery trilogy, you wont have to worry about "complainers" showing up in pro-FF articles - because Square will likely stop the series or close its doors.
N4GDgAPc  +   718d ago
@Godmars290

Your right to have your opinion why you hate it, but all the others that complain why they are making another and scrap it are Ignorant. This game wasn't made for them. It was made for others that enjoyed it and want to continue FF13 story line. Whats difference about Final Fantaasy franchise compared to anyother game is that FF fans are more out spoken. They got this idea on what a ff game should be which is funny because thats what square-enix decides on what is final fantasy for there next game.
N4GDgAPc  +   718d ago
@Godmars290
"and it will be the defenders for refusing to recognize the issues with the direction the series took with the entry."
That’s the exact comment I'm talking about. That’s not an opinion. That’s you trying to tell others what is fact. I’ll tell you something that will surprise you “I like the direction they took.”
I’ll tell you why I think a lot of people hate FF13 so much. This game is not as bad as ff fans think this game is. It’s called hype. They got so much expectations for this game when it’s not met the game becomes a major let down which could cause the game to suck. Now that may not be the case for everyone but I bet majority of them.
There has been times were I watched a movie I was so over hyped for. The first time I watched it I hated it. Second time I watched it I can’t understand why I hate the movie so much.
If this game was called something else it I bet it wouldn’t have been hated on as much. So yes a lot of fans are going to hate something when they put something high on a pedestal.
Godmars290  +   718d ago
@N4GDgAPc
Where you willfully blind of the "ifs" I used, or just don't comprehend their meaning?

Nevermind that defenders will sometimes throw up the "fact" that sequels often don't sell as well as the 1st title to justify 13-2 sales. So that's people who like the game pretty much saying they expect this next title not to sell all that well.
LiViNgLeGaCY  +   718d ago
If the first two horrible entries are anything to go by, then no.
jghvhv  +   718d ago
This is how the media works:Example 1-Gamers:Aw,we don't want this!
Media:Can't we wait until we play it to judge it?
Example 2-Gamers:Wow,A new game with Lightning! EPIC!
Media:Why the new game with Lightning will FAIL!
You media guys are so full of crap.
Capt-FuzzyPants  +   718d ago
No that would be completely reasonable and logical. That's not how the gaming community and gaming journalism works.
Kureno_Nakamura  +   718d ago
Sure, because it's not trying to be anything more than "spinoff" material now and SE is no longer shoving these awful characters down our throats anymore.

Even Wada is starting to talk about Versus.

Wrap your story up and move on.
ash_divine  +   718d ago
Ugh, I hate when people try to play the "at least it's different" card.

Because products shouldn't ever be rewarded for just being different. They still have to be GOOD as well.

Also, the author is acting as if we don't already know a lot about the game.

It'd bw different if all they showed was a logo or something. But in actuality, we already know almost as much about this game as we do about Versus.
#9 (Edited 718d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Hicken  +   718d ago
It's different, this is true. But it's EXTREMELY different from XIII and XIII-2. In fact, the only thing it seems to have in common is Lightning, and MAYBE the settings of Cocoon and Gran Pulse.

Do people hate Lightning THAT much?

Not only do we already know about as much about this game as we know about Versus, but the battle system sounds comparable; if not, it doesn't sound too far removed from the likes of Crisis Core, which I believe MOST FF fans enjoyed(I know I did). If this system is receiving preemptive criticism in LR, why isn't Vs getting the same treatment? Why didn't CC?

Honestly, much like with XIII-2, which directly addressed the problems people had with its predecessor, this game is receiving hatred simply because it's related to XIII.

XIII, by the way, WAS a "GOOD" game. You can say it failed as an FF- sometimes I agree, sometimes I don't- but it's not like it was barely playable, or it was full of mechanical and graphical flaws.

Being a disappointment is different from being bad; seems like FF fans either don't know or have somehow forgotten that.
amaguli  +   718d ago
I will give Square Enix this, they are persistent. They will be damned if they don't see Lightning and the gang enter the upper echelon of Final Fantasy lore.

Anyways, it's the 3rd entry into a saga that many Final Fantasy fans have been disappointed by. I'm not surprised by the initial reaction. It is up to Square Enix to prove why this game is worth getting, and I think they will try that at TGS.
no_more_heroes  +   718d ago
That's gonna be impossible for most people. They f*cked up on the first and only chance they had to impress, so everything that follows it will be seen as the same no matter what.

It makes sense though. Given that the sequels in a trilogy/series VERY rarely surpass the quality of the first, and given that the first FFXIII was seen by many as so demonically BAD that it failed as a videogame and had absolutely NO redeeming qualities WHATSOEVER, any sequels are GOING to be seen as the exact same at best.

When people become fans of a series, it's because it has certain mix of features. If you change that mix in ANY way, you have committed an unforgivable sin. FF's mix was changed. People reacted, and rightfully so. Of course they grossly overreacted, but most people don't know how to deal with disappointment appropriately anyway (myself included, though not for FF since I never used to be a series fan). The reaction is emotional and OTT, but most of the complaints themselves ARE NOT WRONG.

Change is good to keep a series fresh, but Square changed the wrong things. That's what the issue is.

They probably thought that the storyline didn't allow for typical JRPG features such as roamable towns and sidequests. I don't think that's a good enough excuse though. What they could have done using this same publicly-feared-fugitives-on-t he-run story to still facilitate towns and sidequests is make it so that a minority of people in any given town on Cocoon doesn't (at least fully) buy into the l'cie-are-horrible-monster s-avoid-or-kill-at-all-costs propaganda. Doing quests/tasks for these somewhat willing citizens would help spread a more positive public opinion in that town. Possible rewards for this could be special weapons, items, etc. from these newly converted people who are now more willing to support you on your journey. To make it even more interesting, make it so that "befriending" the citizens of one town makes it either harder or easier to befriend those from another as word spreads throughout Cocoon, giving/denying access to possible weapon, item, etc. rewards.

Hindsight's a b!tch, ain't it?

I digress; enough of my terrible ideas. I'm just baffled by the making of XIII-2 and Lightning Returns as business decisions. Square either really believed they could change people's minds (if that were possible the world would be a MUCH happier place), or their trying to get as much mileage out of their Crystal Tools engine as they can. The latter doesn't make any sense because they could have used it to make other games.

For me personally though, it will be nice to see the story wrapped up with a nice little bow. I'm just saying I think I get WHY most people are upset given what I've learned.
#11 (Edited 718d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(3) | Report | Reply
izumo_lee  +   718d ago
Being the sucker i am, i will probably buy this game cause there is a part of me that believes that one day Squarenix will be back to what they were before the greed got to them.

My problem with this game is for one reason actually. The premise that Lightning IS the only character you control throughout the game. From what i read there is no party members, no recruiting other members so basically a longer version of the Lightning DLC. I may be wrong but that was the impression i was getting reading what the game will be like.

Remember the last FF game that you only controlled one character? Yeah it was the poor attempt at that called Dirge of Cerberus.

Final Fantasy games to me are about a group of friends banding together to stop a common enemy. The bonds they create with one another during their journey will shape what kind of people they will become & how it can change their views on life in general. So to remove that aspect in a Final Fantasy game is upsetting to me.

The Final Fantasy 13 games feel like a incomplete & poor use of development time. These sequels to me are cash grabs & Squarenix inability to admit their own failings by churning out these games hoping we fans will succumb to their will.
VsAssassin  +   718d ago
The article is missing the main argument why fans dislike these FFXIII sequels to begin with. FFXIII characters, most especially Lightning, weren't really very interesting. And if a set of characters isn't interesting, it is only logical not to make more stories, in this case, games about them.

In XIII-2's case, I know SE were trying to redeem the title before it. Yes, I know that FFXIII sold well, but this doesn't remove the fact that the game wasn't very well received when it comes to the failing aspects of the game. So making XIII-2 could be likened to a 'sorry' letter to fans, and that's fine. Creating a third part in a series that many fans want concluded in XIII-2 is kind of pushing it.

No matter what SE thinks, Lightning simply just needs to call it a day and allow a new protagonist, in a whole new setting and world to shine.

I could, like many of you here, count many previous FF titles and interesting characters that deserve spin-offs and sequels better than XIII.
Kratoscar2008  +   718d ago
"Two in harmony surpass one in perfection" wich could be the reason why SE dont get any decent tittle since the merger (Save FFXII), maybe they dont get along well since they were kind of rivals before so maybe they cant really cooperate.
LAWSON72  +   718d ago
I don't think a game should be called shitty when there is hardly any details and before it comes out. And those of you who say no one wants this game you are wrong. Me and many others like xiii so deal with.
darkpower  +   714d ago
Probably not because we underestimate how much people love to whine, bitch, and troll on the internet anymore. ANY subject (and I do mean ANY subject) is fair game for bitch fests to start on anything at all. Until we find a way to kill THAT culture, things like judging a game that hasn't even been released yet will never happen.

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