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Submitted by fastrez 759d ago | news

EA: ‘I get hurt when I see BioWare & DICE criticised’ – Moore

EA’s Peter Moore has given a rare insight into his views on the gaming populace, backlash aimed squarely at him, as well as criticism hurled at BioWare and DICE. The EA COO has also spoken out regarding the company’s policy of DLC and service subscriptions like Battlefield 3′s Battlelog. (EA, PC, Peter Moore, Xbox 360)

pandehz  +   759d ago
Me too
Yi-Long  +   759d ago
They get criticised when they're being too greedy...
... with DLC, or when they release unfinished games (Mass Effect 3), or sequels that are lazy quick cash-ins (Dragon Age 2).

If that hurts Peter Moore, it should be very easy for him to change the greedy policies in that company into something that will bring out love, respect, and admiration from the gamers.

Everybody loves Team Meat, for instance. Why!? Value for money, and free DLC. They released a brilliant game, and they did it out of a love for gaming, and they keep rewarding those who bought it with free DLC.
#1.1 (Edited 759d ago ) | Agree(15) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
pandehz  +   759d ago
Its sad that no one puts forward complaints and issues in a orderly manner and have to take it out personally on devs and certain individuals.

We all know there are many ppl involved in the decision making process but in our rude method of criticism a lot of ppl are negatively affected.

Im sad for the person, and once again I get disagreed for my personal feelings as if that can actually be disagreed lol
cleft5  +   759d ago
No they get hated on for trying to be a successful company. Nothing is free in this world and for as much as people complain about dlc they certainly run out and buy all the COD and Battlefield DLC right away. It disturbing how we demand more of Bioware, yet so many other companies get a pass. Oh and the Binding of Issac DLC cost money to get.
DarkSymbiote  +   759d ago
"Sometimes I feel sorry for gamers whose world was cartridges. I sense on the boards there is a pining for the old times."

Or maybe we just like complete games... It is not that hard to understand.
matgrowcott  +   759d ago
Except a lot of old games would have hugely benefited from DLC. If all you're going to judge previous generations on is the top tier games, of course things are going to look worse this generation when you take every single game into account. Look at the lower-mid tier games that were released over the last 30 years though and the majority were short, buggy and are now massively viewed through rose-tinted glasses.

Not every game today is a Chrono Cross, a Final Fantasy, a Zelda or a Metroid, but I swear some gamers forget that that wasn't ever true.
h311rais3r  +   759d ago
Well that and teh interwebs wasn't as filled with crybabies.
CrimsonessCross  +   759d ago
Exactly. Games in those eras also DID NOT NEED patches and updates constantly and we had the community actually helping keep a game alive, which is unheard of anymore.

I would bring up the expansions and sequels conversation but, in a way, they're both getting the job done. *shrugs* it depends, but I guess i'd say modern exp/seq's have less (new) content.
Hufandpuf  +   759d ago
Yes they did. Only the games made by really talented devs did not need patches.

I remember playing games on playstaion and n64 that work have the WEIRDEST game breaking bugs.
HammadTheBeast  +   759d ago
He's such an ass. Just because the older gamers can't be taken advantage of like the 8-9 year olds tat they milk their franchises off of, the feel that they are "pining for cartridge days". How about we get free expension packs like before? How about complete games for once.
zeal0us  +   759d ago
If we don't criticized these companies they will keep falling in the same holes. Not only that but they will think what they are doing is right when it could be hurting them.
amaguli  +   759d ago
And I get hurt whenever a professor criticizes a paper I worked hard on. You know what I do about it? Listen to their criticism and use it to improve on my next paper.
DARK WITNESS  +   759d ago
exactly and that is probably the biggest problem off all.. they really are not getting the message at all.
aiBreeze  +   759d ago
That's where you're wrong though.. the message is loud and clear in EA's opinion, people rather criticize with their keyboards than with their wallets. As long as this remains true, EA have no reason to listen.
#4.1.1 (Edited 759d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(0) | Report
DARK WITNESS  +   759d ago
yes and no...

I know what you mean.. As gamers we don't vote enough with our wallets, not as much as we should..

but in some cases where we have, more often then not the publishers have just shutdown the studio.

For a very long time I stopped buying ea games and I only started again with the first dead space and mirrors edge.

Now they have gone back to the old ways, I don't see myself buing into ea again. I skipped on ME3 even though I bought 1 and 2 on launch when they came out.

I guess there are just not enough of us that care enough to make a difference and even when the sales start to go down, they will find every reason under the sun to blame the poor sales on except their business model.
HammadTheBeast  +   759d ago
Your professor wouldn't critisize you if gave him the whole paper on the due date, instead of cutting out the middle and promising him you'll give it to him in a couple months as DLC.
matgrowcott  +   759d ago
Right, but how about if you had two professors and they both told you opposite things? What if you had a thousand professors debating over your paper and each one thought they were the one true expert?

What if you had large groups of professors that all felt they had the way of fixing your paper despite the fact that you'd already been given top marks and everybody not obsessed with the problems of your paper thought it was more than passable?

Your analogy only works if there's only one opinion and unfortunately everybody on sites like these knows - doesn't think, KNOWS - that they are the only person who can fix the industry. They don't stop for a second to ask why they're not getting listened to, they just presume the developers don't know what they're doing. They certainly don't look at the bigger picture and they don't understand that just because a game doesn't appeal to them doesn't mean it is useless to everybody.
amaguli  +   759d ago
Ok, let's say I submitted my work to be reviewed by a large group of professors. Couldn't I just acknowledge the ones that praised my work, and to the ones that criticized me say "Well you're stupid, you don't get it"?

Shouldn't we be accountable to acknowledge the ones that criticize us more than the ones that praise us? Acknowledging criticism is what makes us improve our work. I know for a fact that if I could I would just listen to the professors that tell me my work is good enough, but that is doing a huge disservice to myself.

I admit my analogy is not perfect, but what are you going to do? It's just a matter of perspective. I view criticism as a positive and can be a way for improvement, and not all criticism is trolling.
pandaboy  +   759d ago
Note also that many of the professors who praised the work had a financial obligation to do so. The ones who gave the lower score had no ulterior motive.
#4.3.2 (Edited 759d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(2) | Report
matgrowcott  +   759d ago
@Amaguli

Nobody is ignoring the criticism, that's not my point. Developers always watch forums and message boards to see what people are thinking. The problem is, the internet is a mess of opinions (good and bad) and selfishness and vocal minorities and it just isn't as simple as you made it out to be.

Here we go: group A will quite happily criticize game A for being boring, not having enough story and for being ugly, whereas group B will criticize game A for being short, unrealistic and lacking innovation.

Group C love the game and want it to stay exactly how it was. So the developer takes Game A and creates Game A-2. It fixes the graphics, has a better story, more interesting characters and new features not found in any other game.

Group A is still complaining, because they feel the lack of new features wasn't what was wrong with the old game and that the new features make the game harder to play. Group B is disappointed because they feel more work has been placed into story and graphics, and that the gameplay now lacks that special something that interested them in the first place.

Worse though, group C is pissed off as well, because it's not the game they originally bought and they feel they're the people that made Game A a success in the first place.

So what do the developers fix now? They've taken on board criticism from the vocal groups and created a game they feel fixes many of the original's issues, but they've created new issues and alienated everybody by doing so.

Whatever they do, they're going to continue displeasing almost everybody who has the time and energy to complain because, in short, the people complaining all think their opinion is the only one and can't admit that the game was never meant for them in the first place. Really they just want something else entirely, but they want Game A (and its sequels) to be that something else. They want the developers to want their sales, whether the product is aimed at them or not.

Which is why so many people complain about the multitude of Disney games on the PlayStation store. One developer, Disney Interactive, massively supports the digital space and sells a ton of games (they're super popular amongst families) and both Sony and Disney are attacked by gamers because "nobody wants Disney games, where are the classics I want?"
amaguli  +   759d ago
@matgrowcott

I am going to assume you are talking about Dragon Age II just for the sake of argument.

First off, I assume that we can agree with the fact that you cannot please everybody. It's a fact that no matter how hard a developer works on a game, there will always be a group of people that will complain about something.

Dragon Age II is a perfect example of Bioware trying to please everyone and satisfy every complaint people had with Dragon Age: Origins. The graphics were improved, the story was more focused, the gameplay was streamlined, the difficulty was less challenging, so on and so forth.

However, how many of the things did Bioware fixed actually need fixing? Was the gameplay so difficult in the Origins that it was necessary to streamline everything? Was the level up tree so complex in Origins that it required to be gimped? Was it necessary to have the majority of the story take place in one location?

I honestly don't know how Bioware went about with addressing the criticisms of Origins. Maybe they just went down a checklist of the top 5 complaints that people had. I can admit that I don't know and only Bioware knows why the did what they did.

What I can say is that I am happy that I don't have to deal with what they have to go through. It must be very difficult and frustrating. You just have prioritize and gauge the intensity of the issues, but in the end the developer has to do what they feel is best for their game.
matgrowcott  +   759d ago
@Amaguli

Dragon Age II is a great example. I remember the Mass Effect crowd being annoyed by Dragon Age's traditional gameplay, I remember people being disappointed by the story and the fact that your choices/origins didn't really matter and I remember general things like graphics bugging others.

So Bioware tried to balance things out as best they could in a sequel and all the same people complained but for different reasons. Worse, all the same people, despite complaining endlessly about it prior to the sequel's release, are now saying "the original was perfect, why bother changing it?"

I think, generally, developers are quite smart about how much they give into fans and about where and who they gauge complaints from. I think sometimes though that complaints are so loud, whether valid or not, that it's impossible not to think that it's a major problem. Loads of people complained about Mass Effect 3's ending, then loads of people complained when it was "fixed". How do you win in this situation?

As a side note, it's nice to come to some sort of friendly conclusion on N4G (and the internet as a whole). Bubbles for you, sir.
amaguli  +   759d ago
@matgrowcott

I extend the same compliment to you too my good sir.
zekk  +   759d ago
but your professor probably doesnt send u death threats.....
DARK WITNESS  +   759d ago
Generational....

One of the first things I will teach my kid and hope to God he learns it well is when you recognise you are being ripped off and when to simply say No!!

Games were doing just fine last gen and that was not that long ago.

It's simple.. the publishers have got greedier and greedier, which is what most people tend to do when they see a golden goose.

for most dev's there really is not much else they can do about it but defend the publishers... so they make up excuses to try and make it sound like all this milking is part of the plan and it's great value and we the gamers are stupid.

I don't mind dlc when it's done right, but all this crap with online passes and season passes etc.. I am sorry but naa. The companies need a good tongue lashing or they will just carry on with this crap.
modesign  +   759d ago
No suprise EA and activision are going down the tubes, they really thought they could pump out generic and incomplete games and everyone was going to A) buy them, B) not critize them for their lack of quality. haha nice try EAvision.
Flatbattery  +   759d ago
Everything and everyone will get criticized on a regular basis, it's how the human race communicates a sense of displeasure. It's nothing new, and the entertainment industry has been at the sharp end of it since day one, if you can't cope get out.

That being said, I don't think anyone in the gaming industry except for the string pullers should take it too much to heart, after all it's the publishers,leads, directors, producers and CEOs who have all the say in what is produced, any criticism should be taken by them.
CrimsonessCross  +   759d ago
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

This is what would have happened if today's generation was placed into the "golden days" of gaming. Might not be too accurate (as it's a joke) but probably dead on.

Anymore I am afraid to see what some devs/pubs do with games after release. I am trying to support the developers that I know who are doing good for the customers and community...The only comment I can make is "try it sometime"
rdgneoz3  +   759d ago
Poor Tails. Forever alone..
Tachyon_Nova  +   759d ago
Bad luck, it hurts me as a battlefield fan from the early days to have to play the shoddy shite you put out recently.
Agent_hitman  +   759d ago
I feel happy when I see stupid company like this criticised 99 times a year, due to it's stupidity, one example is Generals 2 disaster..
#10 (Edited 759d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
nofallouthero  +   759d ago
oddly enough it makes me happy when mediocre games get criticized. i mean bioware made kotor and dice made bf2 which were two really great games that change there genre
franko  +   759d ago
Yea,i'm hurt too when i play bf3 without sound,when i get instantly disconnected,when some retarded 8year old kid with mommys credit card kick me cause of your greedy politics you let him to be the admin...so Moore stop talking s**t
aiBreeze  +   759d ago
I agree with Peter Moore from the topic title, I can't be assed to read any more of EA's PR bullshit but I too at least feel sorry for when people criticize DICE and BW.. the only thing they're both guilty of is selling their companies out. You wanna blame anyone for the quality of the product, go blame EA who are probably running the show and forcing them to release early, do DLC etc.
hiptanaka  +   759d ago
I get hurt when I see you make crap games and turn EA into a free-to-play shitfest.
cleft5  +   759d ago
I am so sick and tired of all the bandwagon people that hate on Bioware and EA. To say Dragon Age 2 or Mass Effect 3 isn't a good game is just pure bullshit. While neither one of those game lived up to it's full potential and promise they where still solid games. It's like when people talk about Bioware their games have to be OMG Amazing or pure shit. There is no, well it was a good game but not great stance, and that is just pure garbage. This whole situation shows a huge immaturity on the Hardcore gamers side.
whatRU  +   759d ago
You are not focusing on the important aspects of this discussion in my opinion.

People are ALWAYS going to piss and moan about things.. and that includes good/decent/grey area games. You can't be the rating police and demand that people refer to a game you thought was good as a decent game, simply because you don't agree with their opinions. That's bigotry imo

On the other hand, publishers have just recently started to scheme and really come up with several new ways to suck a few extra dollars out of customers (FTP w/ micro transactions, paid DLC for unlocking pre-loaded disk content, Subscriptions and Online Passes) in the last few years.. and so I think the discussion worth having is: How can we as the consumer use our buying power to prevent them from continuing down this greedy, profit-over-all-else mindset?
cleft5  +   758d ago
You know what Peter Moore said actually answers your question perfectly. The truth is that where you see a problem others have decided that this is going to be the way the industry is going to be from now on out. To be honest I think this policy of nickle and diming customers out of every penny that they have will eventually lead to the entire Video Game Industry crashing.

I will be glad when the gaming industry crash. Maybe then they will stop cheating consumers out of every penny they have in the name of business. The Video Game Industry use to be more than any other business. The people who made games weren't in it for just a few dollars, they actually cared about everything they made and the people who brought their games. In my opinion, and unfortunately I have to say that phrase, Bioware is still one of the few companies that genuinely care about their customers.

Even now they still care, but people have to understand that Bioware's decision to join EA was one made so they could continue to make the games they love without fear of their company going under because a game doesn't sell well. People have to face up to the reality that video game companies are going under left and right. THQ is in such bad shape they are struggling not to go under and they are a much bigger company than Bioware ever was. By joining EA Bioware ensured that they can still be around if a game doesn't sell well. This whole Star Wars MMO thing could have been enough to cause Bioware to go under if they weren't part of EA. Unfortunately, that means they have to make compromises to EA but at least this way they are still around tomorrow.
user5467007  +   759d ago
Moore - EA SPORTS....nuff sad
MacDonagh  +   759d ago
Cry me a river. EA has done it to themselves with the way that they've been handling their own franchises and their DLC practices.
MySwordIsHeavenly  +   759d ago
Am I the ONLY ONE who sees that Peter Moore and Anton Lavey are the same person?

https://www.google.com/sear...

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