I just wished that GT 5 had the type of community like Forza has though.. By that I mean a custom auction house that also sells cars with custom vinyls and paint jobs. That would blow my mind!
I have been playing TDU2 a bit more lately due to the new dlc cars on ps3 but I play GT5 all the time and bought all the dlc for it easily my favorite game of this generation.
They're both good games, but Turn 10 has been in a one sided feud with PD since Forza 2 when MS chose them over Gotham as a GT killer. With the only thing odder/sadder is the apparent favoritism gaming media tends to show Forza while GT gets nitpicked.
Forza 4 has no night or wet racing and real world tracks, including the Ring, were widened to make them more fun online. It got 9s and 10s all over the place.
GT5 has 800 standard cars you don't have to use, 7s everywhere.
I don't really care about the reviews, but if you don't think GT5 was nitpicked, and hell, you gave the example above of the standard cars that you don't even have to use, then you weren't paying attention.
I think IGN's review summed it up "Gran Turismo 5 is a 10/10 simulator wrapped up in a 5/10 game" and game reviewers would rather have a "10/10 game" but that's not Gran Turismo.
@Pirate Thom There are two mistakes in your comment.
First, you say "real world tracks" with an "s" in "tracks" implying it's plural. Only ONE track was widened. There are still dozens of accurate tracks. Besides, to use your reasoning, if you don't like the widened track, don't use it.
Second, the track was widened for Forza 3, not Forza 4.
As far as the standard cars go, adding inferior content as quantity for quantity's sake and expecting everyone to just ignore it in reviews is ridiculous.
There was no nitpicking. That's just a tired old excuse.
"Forza 4 has no night or wet racing and real world tracks, including the Ring, were widened to make them more fun online. "
Forza doesnt do those things because it would compromise 60fps/0% tearing. like Turn 10 said, if ANYTHING they were adding would even make it tear or drop a single frame, it was cut. Rain and night racing both look ridiculous in GT5, and they cause the performance to basically halve or worse.
Rain causes the framerate to drop to ~30fps and causes the PS1-style blocky graphics.
Night just looks pathetic. headlights simply go straight through other cars! they do not reflect off other cars at all. go play the game if you dont believe me. all they did was turn the sky black instead of blue.
as for real world tracks, the only one made wider was the Nurburgring, and really, who cares? 99.999999999% of people who play these games have never and will never drive the nurburgring in real life, so they dont know whats real or not. its still a "good enough" represenation, and they never said its a 1:1 model.
"GT5 has 800 standard cars you don't have to use" incorrect. have you even played the career mode? doesnt sound like it if you think you dont have to use them. and even if you didnt have to drive them, you HAVE to see their horrible, horrible PS2 models while you race against them.
"if you don't think GT5 was nitpicked...then you weren't paying attention. "
what was it UNFAIRLY nitpicked on though?
GT Planet has without doubt proven that GT5 has no tyre model. the different types of tyres are simply a grip multiplier. a mini cooper will give the same maximum lateral grip and g forces as a corvette z06 if they both use the same tyre compound in GT5. this is fact, and easily proven by ANYONE with the game. dont you think that SHOULD be criticized?
GT5 doesnt even allow you to upgrade brakes on your cars! anyone thats EVER been to a track knows that one of the very very very first things you upgrade is your brakes! GT5s braking is all wrong, letting you just change the brake bias setting to increase your braking performance.
then theres the damage modelling. quite frankly theyd have been better off without it, its that poorly implemented. a dozen plus 200km/h head ons with a brick wall and you *might*, just maybe, get a slight deformation of your front bumper. 1 time out of 10.
then theres the fact that there are ADMITTEDLY 2 different sets of physics, one for online and one for offline! how is this acceptable in a "simulator"?! which one is supposed to be more real? whats different?
theres also the fact that the low-speed physics in particular are just woeful. why can i take a 400kw RWD Turbo sports car, give it a wide open throttle launch, and the wheels will simply give off a little puff of smoke and the car will head off in a 100% straight line? if youve ever actually driven even a 150kw RWD car, not even turbo, youd know that the car should be going sideways and spinning out unless you counter-steer to correct the car.
GT5 was lucky it got the scores it did. its really only a 6-7/10 simulator wrapped up in a 4-5/10 game.
so excuse me if ill take a slightly wider/longer nurburgring (which lets face it, if they simply called it 'forest stage' noone would complain) over having no low-speed physics, no tyre model, laughable damage, no brake upgrades, no engine swaps, no customisable transmissions for the first 12 months at least, and not even being able to paint my car the colour i want unless i go and find a freaking stupid "paint chip".
The thing is, there's buying the game and then continuing to play it. Of the friends i have that own a PS3 and bought the game, two of these don't even know now why they they got the game. GT is synonymous with the PS brand and a large percentage of this bought a PS machine to begin with because of their love for cars and not games. That audience continues to buy these games and or the machine to go with it but there isn't much of a thought process other than a programmed one brought about by how appealing another version of the game they don't in fact play. Same with a number of folk that buy Fifa games
Great franchise and while it certainly has it true followers that also like to actually play the damn thing, GT numbers will drop quite some when that certain other percentage realises they don't these days care any more like way back
Yes, the 5th full iteration and people are still confused as to what they're getting... except, it's still sold over 7m units on the PS console with the lowest install base...
Did you even think about this before you typed it?
@Hufandpuf: I'm not really sure what you're getting at. Are you saying GT owners are mad at Forza owners moreso than at Forza? If so, you're probably correct about that. All you have to do is look at the craziness that people like Forza_Is_King spouts regularly to see why, though.
I'll admit, I've attacked Forza, myself, if only in response to those who attacked GT5 unnecessarily. PhearR3d above shows- though in a minimalist fashion- how when something positive about GT5 is involved, they can't help but try and be negative.
Honestly, Forza fans should be happy GT sells as well as it does, if it didn't Microsoft might invest lest time making Forza an actual competitor to it and vice versa obviously.
It isn't wrong psn_arakouftaian, because like PirateThom said we need competition. Forza excelled when it came to online play and forming communities, GT developers most likely paid attention to that. Now we are seeing Forza Horizon with night driving and other things that were not a part of the Forza franchise because of GT.
You don't think Sony invested so much in Killzone to counter Halo? I like having a selection and i certainly don't limit that selection and post M$ instead of MS because i have deep-seeded issues towards Microsoft. Be a gamer, not a fanatical cheerleader for a company who doesn't care about you anymore than Joe Schmo.
I never say GT could not use ideas from other ips (like forza or other racers) but something is sure is that GT was and it will aim to be the best, forza does not make the difference in it.
And yes I know and i say in my post that other corp. copy what's good and what sales, like ND copy tombR.
not to be a b%c$ but your answer to me is pointless, its very clear that you did not even read what I say or don't have enough brain to understand something smart. but your low iq had to change subject and make useless comparison.
I bet your a brainwash sheep, from North America (I also live in the US) that think that competition is always good! lets use common sense, if there was a ps3 only and the xbox 360 (saying this example because playstation was first) was not made and corp use their full resources to make their games only for the ps3 and maybe some pc. will not that help to make the game better and also faster on it? but devs are to make two teams, they have to use the low capabilities on one console into the other, even when it could have been better and they have to waste time in developing the game for bout. edith. w/e xbox360 has bring into the table is useless in a gaming point of view and cross game chat and other silly features will have been here eventually in the ps4 since social apps are important. If the xbox360 was no made, Halo will have been made for the PC and maybe ps3, same goes for gears and forza is not needed because we got GT with is bigger and better but it have have been a good PC sim. exclusive just like their flight sims. The ps3 will have reach over 110mill. on sales by now .
Hicken, So now you're happy sales show it's a beast when the other day you're attacking Xbots for talking numbers. You never cease to amaze me with how biased one person can be all while being a complete hypocrite.
As for the whole controvery between Gt fanboys like yourself and Forza fanboys that too shows the level of maturity i'm dealing with when speaking to you. You never give it a rest do you, continually defending all that is Sony like they planted a seed in your Mothers womb 16 years ago.
Gran Tursimo is awesome and deserves the credit it gets. One of the reasons why the game got picked on early was obvious, after all thsoe years in development it still felt unfinished. The menu's and navigating through the game needed improvement. The attention to detail on the cars were diminished because most of the cars were PS2 models, so you had this clash between new and old which was weird. The game also had bugs which also questioned the long development. Months after its initial release the game was what it was supposed to be (minus the hundreds of car models still being last generation). So yes, a lot of the negatives in reviews were warrented and i would imagine you spent your whole time downplaying them.
I own Forza snd Gran Tursimo games and enjoy both and each have their own flaws. I, unlike, you can view each game on its own merits and not form a preconceived biased position all due to which system they are on. Stop being a fanboy and maybe i'll stop picking on you.
"how when something positive about GT5 is involved, they can't help but try and be negative."
I love that last line from you. Think about that the next time you come trolling into a Microsoft related article.
Forza Horizon did NOT get night racing from GT5 which only just got that feature. Forza Horizon is made by ex PGR guys which has had night racing and weather for years now...way before GT5. Forza Horizon is more like an open world PGR.
You have to excuse all the people that bring up Forza every time we mention GT5. They are still reeling from the fact that after all the nasty things they said and taunting they did about GT5,it STILL sold well and STILL has more features then Forza 4 and the fact that Forza 4 ended up being more of an arcade racer then a simulator and even worse the gaming world showed how much they really cared about Forza 4 and it is eating them up inside. Hatred and denial is an ugly thing indeed
Look again. The first people to mention Forza are PS3 supporters like Godmars, the worst, Pirate Thom, @ IRetrouk. That's a HUGE indicator of how the tides have turned this generation. Calling Forza 4 an "arcade racer" is just sour grapes.
You're right that hatred & denial are ugly - but you're mistaken about where it's actually coming from.
someone talking about xbox sales on n4g gets attacked. but when people talk about a ps3 games sales, everything is ok, and everybody has that warm giddy feeling.. honestly, fanboys never cease amaze me!
@ pirate thom. not only did you try and deliberately try to start the flames with your first post, you were then popping up all over the thread in a shos of sony love.. bubbles -
You have to excuse all this ignorant poeple, that can't accept that Forza and GT are two great franchises!
The other comments, are simply a mirror of the N4g mentality...
I could refer Scaff analysis- from GTplanet not a Gt fanboy like most of the users that commented, but a user which provides facts, about the two franchises, and doesn't glorify one franchise over another....
Typic fanboy bullshit, like forza is an arcade racer, the worst racing game, gt standards are ps2 graphics upscaled, gt5 cars sound like vaccum cleaners....
Are all useless comments, from butthurt fans, which can't enjoy the two great franchises....
This isn't about the quality of the two games, it's about fanboy wars...
I do not understand this rivalry between GT & Forza at all. If they were on the same platform than yes people can compare them all they want, but they are not. Though i do kinda realize that this all started probably cause of the comments by Dan Greenwalt.
The GT series should be praised since it has stood the test of time & still remains a relevant game in the industry. Being a driving game that is unheard of. With the success of the GT series (used by many as a testing ground to becoming a pro driver) it has spawned many worthy series after it, Iracing, Forza, Rfactor etc. to name a few. Many consider it to be the most influential racing/driving game.
So without GT being so popular there would be no Forza. Fans of Forza should be happy they have a game that stands next to GT in gameplay but it is no where near as influential or successful as GT...yet.
Both games are great in their own way, both have flaws & advantages over one another. Each game can learn from one another to push the driving/racing sim to new levels.
LMAO @Hicken posting earlier. I was one of the Xbots that he said numbers don't mean a thing to... and now Numbers mean a thing to him all of a sudden. LOL... I might be a fanboy, but at least I know I am one. And I'm not to an extreme in denial little kid about it.
The generation of selective success criteria. Is it reviews? Is it sales? The answer changes depending on the system and game title. Many hypocrites from both camps above.
Why do people keep comparing Forza to GT? Forza is an ARCADE RACER!! As evident to what Horizons will be offering. GT is a sim first, game later. As evident to the PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS it produces.
Hardcore sims? Greenawalt or Turn 10 consider their games to be Action Racers with sim physics. I don't know exactly why they're considered "Action", but that's what they call it. Hardcore sim? EFF no. If anything, the only console racer that can be considered a Harcore Sim will have to be pCars.
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I know what you're saying though, as more popular something gets, more hate it gets too..
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They're both good games, but Turn 10 has been in a one sided feud with PD since Forza 2 when MS chose them over Gotham as a GT killer. With the only thing odder/sadder is the apparent favoritism gaming media tends to show Forza while GT gets nitpicked.
LMAO! And the excuses continue.
Still doesn't mean things are 100% fair, but it is what it is.
Forza 4 has no night or wet racing and real world tracks, including the Ring, were widened to make them more fun online. It got 9s and 10s all over the place.
GT5 has 800 standard cars you don't have to use, 7s everywhere.
I don't really care about the reviews, but if you don't think GT5 was nitpicked, and hell, you gave the example above of the standard cars that you don't even have to use, then you weren't paying attention.
I think IGN's review summed it up "Gran Turismo 5 is a 10/10 simulator wrapped up in a 5/10 game" and game reviewers would rather have a "10/10 game" but that's not Gran Turismo.
There are two mistakes in your comment.
First, you say "real world tracks" with an "s" in "tracks" implying it's plural. Only ONE track was widened. There are still dozens of accurate tracks. Besides, to use your reasoning, if you don't like the widened track, don't use it.
Second, the track was widened for Forza 3, not Forza 4.
As far as the standard cars go, adding inferior content as quantity for quantity's sake and expecting everyone to just ignore it in reviews is ridiculous.
There was no nitpicking. That's just a tired old excuse.
Forza doesnt do those things because it would compromise 60fps/0% tearing. like Turn 10 said, if ANYTHING they were adding would even make it tear or drop a single frame, it was cut. Rain and night racing both look ridiculous in GT5, and they cause the performance to basically halve or worse.
Rain causes the framerate to drop to ~30fps and causes the PS1-style blocky graphics.
Night just looks pathetic. headlights simply go straight through other cars! they do not reflect off other cars at all. go play the game if you dont believe me. all they did was turn the sky black instead of blue.
as for real world tracks, the only one made wider was the Nurburgring, and really, who cares? 99.999999999% of people who play these games have never and will never drive the nurburgring in real life, so they dont know whats real or not. its still a "good enough" represenation, and they never said its a 1:1 model.
"GT5 has 800 standard cars you don't have to use"
incorrect. have you even played the career mode? doesnt sound like it if you think you dont have to use them. and even if you didnt have to drive them, you HAVE to see their horrible, horrible PS2 models while you race against them.
"if you don't think GT5 was nitpicked...then you weren't paying attention. "
what was it UNFAIRLY nitpicked on though?
GT Planet has without doubt proven that GT5 has no tyre model. the different types of tyres are simply a grip multiplier. a mini cooper will give the same maximum lateral grip and g forces as a corvette z06 if they both use the same tyre compound in GT5. this is fact, and easily proven by ANYONE with the game. dont you think that SHOULD be criticized?
GT5 doesnt even allow you to upgrade brakes on your cars! anyone thats EVER been to a track knows that one of the very very very first things you upgrade is your brakes! GT5s braking is all wrong, letting you just change the brake bias setting to increase your braking performance.
then theres the damage modelling. quite frankly theyd have been better off without it, its that poorly implemented. a dozen plus 200km/h head ons with a brick wall and you *might*, just maybe, get a slight deformation of your front bumper. 1 time out of 10.
then theres the fact that there are ADMITTEDLY 2 different sets of physics, one for online and one for offline! how is this acceptable in a "simulator"?! which one is supposed to be more real? whats different?
theres also the fact that the low-speed physics in particular are just woeful. why can i take a 400kw RWD Turbo sports car, give it a wide open throttle launch, and the wheels will simply give off a little puff of smoke and the car will head off in a 100% straight line? if youve ever actually driven even a 150kw RWD car, not even turbo, youd know that the car should be going sideways and spinning out unless you counter-steer to correct the car.
GT5 was lucky it got the scores it did. its really only a 6-7/10 simulator wrapped up in a 4-5/10 game.
so excuse me if ill take a slightly wider/longer nurburgring (which lets face it, if they simply called it 'forest stage' noone would complain) over having no low-speed physics, no tyre model, laughable damage, no brake upgrades, no engine swaps, no customisable transmissions for the first 12 months at least, and not even being able to paint my car the colour i want unless i go and find a freaking stupid "paint chip".
nitpicking it aint.
Great franchise and while it certainly has it true followers that also like to actually play the damn thing, GT numbers will drop quite some when that certain other percentage realises they don't these days care any more like way back
Did you even think about this before you typed it?
@Hufandpuf: I'm not really sure what you're getting at. Are you saying GT owners are mad at Forza owners moreso than at Forza? If so, you're probably correct about that. All you have to do is look at the craziness that people like Forza_Is_King spouts regularly to see why, though.
I'll admit, I've attacked Forza, myself, if only in response to those who attacked GT5 unnecessarily. PhearR3d above shows- though in a minimalist fashion- how when something positive about GT5 is involved, they can't help but try and be negative.
Honestly, Forza fans should be happy GT sells as well as it does, if it didn't Microsoft might invest lest time making Forza an actual competitor to it and vice versa obviously.
You don't think Sony invested so much in Killzone to counter Halo? I like having a selection and i certainly don't limit that selection and post M$ instead of MS because i have deep-seeded issues towards Microsoft. Be a gamer, not a fanatical cheerleader for a company who doesn't care about you anymore than Joe Schmo.
And yes I know and i say in my post that other corp. copy what's good and what sales, like ND copy tombR.
not to be a b%c$ but your answer to me is pointless, its very clear that you did not even read what I say or don't have enough brain to understand something smart.
but your low iq had to change subject and make useless comparison.
I bet your a brainwash sheep, from North America (I also live in the US)
that think that competition is always good!
lets use common sense, if there was a ps3 only and the xbox 360 (saying this example because playstation was first) was not made and corp use their full resources to make their games only for the ps3 and maybe some pc.
will not that help to make the game better and also faster on it? but devs are to make two teams, they have to use the low capabilities on one console into the other, even when it could have been better and they have to waste time in developing the game for bout.
edith.
w/e xbox360 has bring into the table is useless in a gaming point of view and cross game chat and other silly features will have been here eventually in the ps4 since social apps are important.
If the xbox360 was no made, Halo will have been made for the PC and maybe ps3, same goes for gears and forza is not needed because we got GT with is bigger and better but it have have been a good PC sim. exclusive just like their flight sims.
The ps3 will have reach over 110mill. on sales by now .
So now you're happy sales show it's a beast when the other day you're attacking Xbots for talking numbers. You never cease to amaze me with how biased one person can be all while being a complete hypocrite.
As for the whole controvery between Gt fanboys like yourself and Forza fanboys that too shows the level of maturity i'm dealing with when speaking to you. You never give it a rest do you, continually defending all that is Sony like they planted a seed in your Mothers womb 16 years ago.
Gran Tursimo is awesome and deserves the credit it gets. One of the reasons why the game got picked on early was obvious, after all thsoe years in development it still felt unfinished. The menu's and navigating through the game needed improvement. The attention to detail on the cars were diminished because most of the cars were PS2 models, so you had this clash between new and old which was weird. The game also had bugs which also questioned the long development. Months after its initial release the game was what it was supposed to be (minus the hundreds of car models still being last generation). So yes, a lot of the negatives in reviews were warrented and i would imagine you spent your whole time downplaying them.
I own Forza snd Gran Tursimo games and enjoy both and each have their own flaws. I, unlike, you can view each game on its own merits and not form a preconceived biased position all due to which system they are on. Stop being a fanboy and maybe i'll stop picking on you.
"how when something positive about GT5 is involved, they can't help but try and be negative."
I love that last line from you. Think about that the next time you come trolling into a Microsoft related article.
Forza Horizon did NOT get night racing from GT5 which only just got that feature. Forza Horizon is made by ex PGR guys which has had night racing and weather for years now...way before GT5. Forza Horizon is more like an open world PGR.
You're right that hatred & denial are ugly - but you're mistaken about where it's actually coming from.
@ pirate thom. not only did you try and deliberately try to start the flames with your first post, you were then popping up all over the thread in a shos of sony love.. bubbles -
The other comments, are simply a mirror of the N4g mentality...
I could refer Scaff analysis- from GTplanet not a Gt fanboy like most of the users that commented, but a user which provides facts, about the two franchises, and doesn't glorify one franchise over another....
Typic fanboy bullshit, like forza is an arcade racer, the worst racing game, gt standards are ps2 graphics upscaled, gt5 cars sound like vaccum cleaners....
Are all useless comments, from butthurt fans, which can't enjoy the two great franchises....
This isn't about the quality of the two games, it's about fanboy wars...
Besides forza horizon wasn't made by turn 10.
Uncalled for and lame.
The GT series should be praised since it has stood the test of time & still remains a relevant game in the industry. Being a driving game that is unheard of. With the success of the GT series (used by many as a testing ground to becoming a pro driver) it has spawned many worthy series after it, Iracing, Forza, Rfactor etc. to name a few. Many consider it to be the most influential racing/driving game.
So without GT being so popular there would be no Forza. Fans of Forza should be happy they have a game that stands next to GT in gameplay but it is no where near as influential or successful as GT...yet.
Both games are great in their own way, both have flaws & advantages over one another. Each game can learn from one another to push the driving/racing sim to new levels.
And u don't even have the game ?
Obvious troll is obvious
2/10 try harder.
But boy this guy... L to the O and back to the L.
Horizon is a spinoff into another genre using the Forza name and assets. That doesn't change anything about Forza 1, 2, 3 or 4.