'Everyone Is Using 100 Per Cent Of Xbox One' Says Forza's Creative Director

NowGamer: 'Even people who are upscaling are still using 100 per cent of the box' says Forza 5's creative director.

[TimmyShire]

Wow. That's pretty damning if true. I mean, I know devs say this exact phrase all the time (and it's not likely they've maxed out the X1 so soon) but it speaks volumes if the devs are using as much as they can get at this stage and can't manage 1080p.

[jackanderson1985]

not really it's just saying that certain devs are gonna take time/skill to get the ESRAM working as best they can...it's evident that the X1 can do 1080p (think 4 games so far are confirmed at that) so why would those games be able to achieve it but the X1 is incapable of it in general?

[mcstorm]

People will just pickup on any scraps they are given to put down the xbox one. Games will look better on the WiiU, Xbox One and PS4 in 12 months time as developers will have better looking games on all 3 consoles through out the generation.

[NCAzrael]

@mcstorm

Except, of course, that the WiiU is on par with last generation's hardware, so it's doubtful they'll be improving on the visuals too much.

[Blackdeath_663]

yes but that argument is null as it is true for both. as the xboxone is improved the ps4 will also be improved it doesn't work just one way if the gap is there already it means it will always be there if not get bigger in a few years time

[kneon]

Well I'm sure both consoles can also do gaming at 4K resolution, so long as you don't want to play anything much more demanding than pac man ;)

Not all games have the same resource requirements, so just because some can run at 1080p doesn't mean that all can run at 1080p.

As for this 100% crap, it's easy to use 100% of resources with crappy coding. All devs will be working on optimizing their engines throughout this generation.

[andrewsqual]

Not really, Naughty Dog said after Uncharted 2 that they still weren't tapping the PS3, the only developer allowed to say such a thing. Uncharted 3 came out and turns out, yeah they were right.

[medman]

It's interesting to note that the creative director of Forza thinks F1 cars achieve 220 mph around the track. F1 cars aren't geared for 220 on race day, and track design prohibits achievement of those speeds. So you're telling me the guy making the game knows nothing about motorsports? Oh, I forgot, it's a Microsoft developer. They never let pesky facts get in the way of their utter bullshot.

[rainslacker]

If devs didn't take a lot of time to learn the Cell this gen, what makes you think they're going to take the time to learn ESRAM optimization next gen? First party games sure, but multi-plats will go the easy route more often than not. For reference, see aforementioned this gen and Cell processing.

The ESRAM set up is similar to this gens set up, however, from my understanding, MS is utilizing it to make up for a weaker GPU, and allowing things that aren't really meant for a cache memory setup...such as tiled resources. This isn't unlike the Cell being able to be used to enhance the GPU of the PS3. Very few devs took advantage of it. Only in first party, and a few 3rd party exclusives, did it really show off it's potential.

[christrules0041]

Developers on PC have been using ESRAM on the GPU for years already. The PC uses DDR3 RAM and then GDDR is baked onto the GPU. Developers know how to use ESRAM. On the contrary the PS3s CELL architecture was completely different as you could use the SPUs to carry data around but they had to use tons of tricks to do that efficiently. Another thing that hasn't been done before is having an extra BUS inbetween the GPU and CPU so they can pass 20GB/second bypassing the reading and writing. You can google Killzone Shadowfall demo postmortem and there is a slideshow but on one of the slides it gives how much data is going where and only about 128MB/second is being used. Whether that wil increase or if it'll make a difference I don't know.

[AndrewLB]

Andrew- When they said they "weren't fully tapping" the ps4, they were referring to optimization. unoptimized code is the result of not cleaning up and streamlining processes, pi$$-poor code is the result of the same thing, along with not using all the resources available. I have a feeling the launch titles for both consoles are not only poorly optimized, but many don't even use all available power.

But what do you expect from many development firms who have many programmers that have limited experience creating games for x86 architecture. Both consoles will improve over time but the fact that Xbone's gpu can only do 1.3tflops and PS4 1.84 tflops respectively... which just isn't that much computational power these days. PC's had that kind of single gpu power back in 2010, and 2009 for the xbox. lol.

[Skizelli]

@medman

You're reaching. Under certain conditions, they most certainly can achieve those speeds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

[Mosiac77]

Every dev says that for every game they develop only to find out that they never did when they develop the sequel. Even the 360 and ps3 haven't been max out.

[BG11579]

For the 360, I don't know, but for the PS3, TLOU may have max out the capabilities of the console.

[BullyMangler]

nnnooo

[Sayai jin]

MS made a system that is hard to program for. So the learning curve is steep. The roles are reversed for next gen.

[tokugawa]

How true is that comment I wonder?

[kneon]

How is it any harder to develop for than the 360? It's the same basic architecture, just faster and with a different CPU/GPU

[Christopher]

Not really. The system follows the exact same as this generation's hardware.

Hint: Xbox 360 uses ESRAM as well...

[LordMaim]

Except in this generation the console that is hard to program for is the less powerful one.

[christrules0041]

X86 is PC architecture and developers that develope on PC have been using RAM on the GPU for years already. If you go out to buy a PC it comes with DDR3 RAM and the Titan(Nvidia GPU) for example has 6GB of GDDR5 baked onto it. Developers know how to use it. Unlike the PS3 which used the CELL architecture was completely different and you can see how first party devs really took advantage of it.

I'm not saying there won't be a slight improvement but I wouldn't expect a huge one like the PS3 had.

[MightyNoX]

1) Upscaling uses 100% of the box
2)Down the line, we'll learn to 'trick' the box

I ruined my monitor by spitting out my drink when I read those lines. Awww, man! Twice!

[come_bom]

"'Everyone Is Using 100 Per Cent Of Xbox One' Says Forza's Creative Director"

That's not a good sign...

I have a feeling that the X1's architecture is one big mess.

[ambientFLIER]

I have a feeling that you simply do not understand how programming works. Every game, even launch titles, even on the almighty PS4, use 100%. The visuals get better down the line simply because the developers get more efficient as they learn the hardware and optimize more and more and develop new tools to take advantage of the console's power.

[Aceman18]

You know the higher, higher ups should tell all their people to shut the hell up because the more they speak the more they make their company and system look bad.

Its impossible to use 100% of the system this early in the systems life, and if by some miracle they did then there's a serious issue when you can't achieve a simple 1080p resolution.

For all that's holy MS tell your underlings to shut the hell up.

[dmeador]

@Aceman18
I think maybe you need to be the one that doesn't speak when you dont know what you are talking about. Just about all games use up all of the resources of a console, it is just with better optimizing and new techniques that games look and play better.

Devs do need to not say the 100% statements (even though they have been for the past 10 years) because most people dont understand what they mean, like you

[christrules0041]

Even the higher ups have made stupid comments. Adam Orths #dealwithit or hows about the if you don't hage an internet connection, we fortunately have a product for you. It's called the Xbox 360.

[JackBNimble]

What dmesdor said is true. It seems that 99% of you guys misunderstand what the 100% statement means.

[Guwapo77]

With CURRENT tools and knowledge of the system devs are maxing out the system. Later in life they will get tool upgrades and tips, tricks and optimizations to improve the games. We hard this same thing with the first wave of games for the PS3... Remember they didn't even know how to the use the SPUs but the system was at 100% *rolls eyes*.

With that said - I know there will be improvements but how much is another story.

[christrules0041]

Yeah that is what I'm thinking. Devs that do make games on PC already use RAM that is baked onto the GPU. They know how to get most out of the system. I think there will be improvements but not like the PS3. Like no one knew how to use the SPUs efficiently which is why there was a steep learning curve. But now that both architectures are x86 they can get way more out of the consoles then they could with the PS3 at launch. Only time will tell though.

[Volkama]

It's a common-sense statement. No dev in their right mind deliberately opts against using the resource available to them.

Games get better over time because devs get better at using the resources the consoles already have, not because they feel like using more of the power as time goes on.

[JackISbacK]

yeah they are provided 100% power to them but it is on them that how to youse that power ,its simple with time they will learn esram is an new thing to work on it is not simple and linear to work with gddr5 ram because almost all devs know how to work with that ,but this ram is new and is very diiferent from edram from xb360 wait for some time for only some months as they learn more they will be able to deliver waht we are getting on ps4 and yeah i am little disapointed with ms becuase even at the time of e3 devs were not provided with dev kit of xb1 ,its ms fault but now every dev is having it in monts they will learn and will deliver best and stiil xb1 dev kit is not complete as it willl get better games will also get better .devs and ms is working hard.dont be fanboys keep calm.

[MysticStrummer]

"That's pretty damning if true."

Agreed, but I doubt it's true.

[assdan]

Thats very bad. Before we could say maybe they just aren't good at using its new arcirechture yet. That excuse is gone.

[ambientFLIER]

Um, wrong. Infinity Ward said it was a challenge to learn the new architecture and that their games down the line will improve significantly. I'd trust their word over your opinion anyday.

[3-4-5]

"But the truth is that I get asked are we using 100 per cent of the box? Of course we are. Everyone is. Even people who are upscaling are still using 100 per cent of the box. What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimisation.

"We had more time so we’re very well optimised and we will continue to optimise this game. If you think about Forza 2, it was a well optimised game, but Forza 4 looked a lot better than Forza 2. That just comes with time."

[Mister_Dawg]

What the hell are you people reading?

He talks about having more time to fine tune their engine for forza5. He states he cannot speak for other devs but they didn't have the time his team has had with the XBO.

Read it more carefully fuzz balls.

[Jazz4108]

he said nothing about maxing it out he's talking about every dev having the same resources available. I hope sony is not holding back there machine as that would be damning. He is speaking about optimization and I believe you are taking a quote out of context.

[Rageanitus]

Same goes in reverse.... I find it all BS in the end of the day.

Just look at all last generation..... ppl kept saying we are only USING X% from the consoles power YET they struggle to hit beyond native 720p.

How little does it take to forget all these comments.

[Mithan]

Nah, you and most of the 219 idiots that agreed with you are just clueless. Re-read what he said.

It will improve a lot with time.

If you think the Xbox1 is maxed out, the PS4 will be maxed out the day it releases as well, being easier to develop for.

The truth is, they both have a lot of room and games we see in 5 years from now will make todays games look like garbage. CHILL.

[showtimefolks]

So we can't even get 1080P with 60FPS yet developers are using 100%? If this is the case than how is is next gen than?

Developers always say we maxed out this console but fact is with time developers will figure out of to get the most out of ps4 and Xbox one, launch titles will not stand the test of time in few years when games truly look and play next gen

[Pillz_Brown]

Basically he says that their studio is using the XBOX One at 100% efficiency. Basically it took them 3 years to fully understand the hardware since they said its been development since Forza 4.

Forza released in 2011 so it had to be in development since 2010.

Means next year or early 2015 is when the 1080p 60FPS games on X1 should be the norm.

[HighResHero]

Not sure if the title is more of a compliment or an insult, but TBH it's kind of a misleading title (unfortunately heh heh ;x).

[OlgerO]

Yeah he obviously didnt mean it negative at all, but it doesnt sound all that positive.

[HighResHero]

Considering who they work they could be more careful for a while. :P

[Orpheo]

Completely agree, this is bad press for Microsoft.

You can tell the Turn10 developer didn't mean it in a negative way but if true, which I expect it isn't, than this could be trouble.

Essentially what Turn10 has said is, prior to X-Box One even launching the full 'raw' power of the system has been utilized; you will see improvements through our optimizations but what you're seeing now is pretty much what you'll be getting.

Isn't this what CBOAT said? Doesn't this just confirm his leak?

Still, while said with the best of intentions I find it hard to believe that Turn10, or any developer for that matter, has fully tapped into the 'raw' power of either console.

[Hellsvacancy]

Poor choice of words

[pyramidshead]

Definitely lol. Maybe the 100% can be even more balanced in the future or something...hopefully..

[tigertron]

100%? so we're only going to be getting 720p/30fps for most games?

Unlikely that developers have fully utilised the console's power at launch, but fact that launch games have been struggling with 1080p is concerning.

[DeadlyFire]

I expect 720p 60 fps is more likely with some games stretching to 900p or 1080p with 30 fps with the rare 1080p at 60fps title.

So far Ryse is 900p, Froza is 1080@60fps, and NFS: Rivals is 30 fps at 1080p.

[ambientFLIER]

Um...launch games ARE SUPPOSED to struggle. And later on games look better and better. That's how it frikkin works EVERY SINGLE GEN.

[Manic2014]

"We had more time so we’re very well optimised and we will continue to optimise this game. If you think about Forza 2, it was a well optimised game, but Forza 4 looked a lot better than Forza 2. That just comes with time."

[BobBelcher]

****************************** **************************
***************************** ***************************
***************************** ***************************
"What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimisation."

"We had more time so we’re very well optimised and we will continue to optimise this game. If you think about Forza 2, it was a well optimised game, but Forza 4 looked a lot better than Forza 2. That just comes with time."
***************************** ***************************
of course we'll just leave this part out all together right? Gotta love the internet...
Click whores.

[cl1983]

Just because an person uses all of a resource doesn't mean that they used that resource wisely. Yes I believe it will be interesting to see how the future goes.

[Bathyj]

Shut up
Shut up!
SHUT UP!

God, everyone working on Xbox needs to be slapped with a gag order.

[bunt-custardly]

Ha, funny you dropped that in here. I was just reading the comments and thinking to myself, Microsoft needs to just shut up, and there you are with my exact sentiments.

[InTheLab]

Agreed.

Especially when the people saying things like 100% are making a game that's 50% of Forza 4.....

[Mister_Dawg]

Why should he when he's just stating the obvious?

[PS4isKing_82]

Who cares. Forza 5 looks amazing and is a blast to play. I played it this weekend at the mall and loved every minute of it. Can't wait for it!!!

[wenaldy]

Thats a BOLD statement.

[NoLongerHereCBA]

A similar article was here over a month ago. He simply stated that everyone always uses the max of a console. People are just using code that is far from being optimized, which can mean that games can look 5x better with more time and knowledge of the systems.

Counts for PS4, Xbox One, 360, ps3 etc etc.

[mhunterjr]

Smh, people don't understand how development works... Every AAA game is going to use 100%. As the generation goes on, developers get better at using that 100%.

Killzone SF, is using 100%... That doesn't mean we've see all of what the PS4 is capable of...

I mean really do you think a good developer is going to stop adding features and effects to a game if their only using 80% of the hardware. They want each game to look and play as good as possible, every time.

[Gekko36]

Bollocks Title

Bollocks Author

Bollocks N4G

I think someone at N4G needs a kick in the testicles for letting this one through with a misleading title like that

[fattyuk]

B**cks Gekko

[Christopher]

These are the people who let it through:

eezo (2) | 16h ago
jackanderson1985 (1) | 16h ago
DarkLordMalik (2) | 17h ago
dodgeuk19 (1) | 17h ago
M-M (1) | 17h ago
Lukas_Japonicus (1) | 16h ago
TimmyShire (2) | 17h ago
Binnsy (1) | 17h ago

[Gekko36]

Thanks so much

Let the testicle kicking commence! - lol

[ufo8mycat]

Pacman can use 100% of a CPU if the optimisation is poor enough.

[TwistingWords]

Please... Let's not have another generation of claiming that x game is using 100% power, then a year later saying it only used 50% and then saying x console has 'untapped' power...

[Volkama]

The stupidy of those claims are what the guy was addressing, more so than any commentary on the console's power. It's plan dumb to think that devs aren't using all the 'power' they can, and this developer decided against saying any different.

[MasterCornholio]

No one is using 100% of the console at launch. Same goes for the PS4.

Nexus 7 2013

[dmeador]

False. Read the article

[Goku781]

XBox One has a hard time bench pressing 1080p without cutting corners, we all see it weather some of us believe it or not. 720p is looking like it average so hopefully whatever game people buy for this system that game better have a better than 8 score based on gameplay cause if not that $500 could have been better spent on direct TV or something. "The Content Experience" indeed.

[1080pgamer]

Dat UI though, forget resolution and games. lol

[GirlOnFire]

lol at your name. That's hurtful! ^~^

[Jdoki]

Bit of a stupid comment by the devs.

Many games use '100%', but 100% is never 100%. Optimisation gets better, developers get more experienced with the hardware, SDK's get refined and improved.

So a game that uses '100%' in 2013 is not going to be as refined or optimised as a game that uses '100%' in 2014, or 15 and so on.

[5eriously]

Unfortunately I am not prepared to wait another few years for 1080p native gaming, that's just bollocks. Why can the PS4 do it but the XB1 can't without some serious compromises? You just cannot tell me that all the devs are useless with the coding and optimizing? M$ must pull out some magic NOW! else they are dead in the water.

Switch on the dGPU /s

[boeso]

Well, 90%, lets not get carried away.

[TristanPR77]

Well that is not good. If they are using 100% of the console and it still cannot match the PS4 and have problems with 1080p then that's really bad news.

[dmeador]

Read the article

[bleedsoe9mm]

reading is hard , headlines are enough for me . yup must be true there it is "Dan Greenawalt says xbox one is trash" right there in a headline

[BABY-JEDI]

I guess this is another Rep who has said something that is unfortunate.
But what if it's true? Of course not. But what if.
LoL just kidding

[landhuman]

The point nobody is getting:
Games improve during a console generation by learning better techniques - both in terms of code efficiency and the particular nuances of the hardware.

There is no better recent example than the PS3 - you can CLEARLY see where this happened over the years.

This developer IS NOT SAYING that Xbox One games will improve no further. He is saying the direct opposite. It's right there in the article. He shouldn't even have to say it. It's the same thing that has happened on any platform, ever.

This is a non story.

All major PS4 games are also using 100% of the PS4, because the devs are pushing as hard as they can (as always). They too will improve in quality as developers learn to write more efficient engines.

[MilkMan]

LOLOLOLOL.
What a joke.
Can devs learn to optimize their damn code!
This next-gen is screwed BEFORE its even off the ground.
LOL!

[ambientFLIER]

That comes with time, dummy. PS4 will use 100% for Shadowfall, yet the Killzone in 5 years will look a whole lot better...

[MilkMan]

Time? What have they been doing their whole careers? A good programmer is a good programmer. You keep your code tight and learn how to optimize. These new consoles are PC's whats to learn?
@sshole!

[landhuman]

I'm sure you crazy people don't really believe that Xbone One games won't improve. It's an amazingly silly notion, pretty much inconsistent with the rest of console gaming history.

I get that it's fun to jump on antihype bandwagon for kicks.

For all the talk of mishandled PR... even when this Xbox One dev says that Xbox One games WILL get better (read the article), they still get an uproar of haters.

What I do sincerely hope though is that this Forza dev never gets bothered with some kind of inane request to "clarify" what he's saying off the back of this nonsense.

I thought towards the end of last gen console discussions were finding some logic and reason, but it vanished again :)

By the way, I'm starting this new gen with Killzone (as a long time fan). When Titanfall is out however I'll grab an XBO because it looks F#@KING AMAZING.

just game and be happy. And CHILL maybe...

[Nocando]

As usual no one reads the article, either that or they are just stupid.

[boeso]

Its too late for that. There is no coming back for Microsoft. N4G has spoken!

[mcgrottys]

People still don't see how much game optimization affects a game's performance.

Here is a quick lesson on software optimization as well as some computer architecture. You will need to know this if you want to work as a programmer or in a similar field.

BACKGROUND ON A CPU'S LOW LEVEL COMPUTATIONS:

consoles now have 64 bit CPU's that means that the cpu can read a 64 bits/8 bytes at once. A bit is essentially a 1 or a 0 and those ones and zeroes can be used represent other numbers. I am not going into the depths of binary though.

a whole number (int) = 8 bits/1 byte
larger whole number (long int) = 32 bits/4bytes
number with decimal places (float) = 32 bits/4 bytes
double precision float (doubles) = 64bits/8bytes

Theoretically you can have 1 double, 8 ints even 2 floats or any combination of those at the same time going through one CPU cycle.

Next thing to know is CPU cache which usually about 6 or 8MB, and because it is part of the CPU it is the highest speed and lowest latency memory on a computer. It is used to store anything that you will be about to put through the CPU. Anything else that will be used by the program will be stored in the RAM while everything else is on the HDD.

A program might have hundreds of different numbers especially when we get to arrays which is essentially a list of numbers and that can be thousands of numbers that need crunching. What happens then is the array is passed to the CPU cache and then is read part by part by the CPU.

These arrays are large and you can't every array on the cache so in coding you have the array and then what is known as the array's pointer. A pointer is a byte and it has the address of where the array is stored in memory, so the array is stored in the ram until the pointer is called and the array is passed to the cache.

QUICK OPTIMIZATION PROBLEM:

lets say a developer has a two dimensional array (2 arrays) that he wants the CPU to manipulate. There are two similar ways to do this but one is wrong.

for(i = 0; i<n; i++)
{
for(j = 0; j<n; j++)
{
array[i][j]=z
}
}

and

for(j = 0; j<n; j++)
{
for(i = 0; i<n; i++)
{
array[i][j]=z
}
}

the first one calls one array and then modifies each element in it then goes to the next array, while the second one calls where an element will be then calls calls array after array manipulating there value at that element and then it goes to the next element. Calling an array means getting it from the RAM then putting it on the cache so in the first one you only call each array once while the second you call an array each time you manipulate it. It is the same as have a set of drawers that you need to sort so for the first option you go from the bottom draw organizing it completely and once its done you go to the next when option two is when you open up the bottom draw partly organize it then do the same with the next but you then go back to the bottom to organize it a bit more and it repeats. The opening the draw may not seem like much of a waste of time but when you are dealing with thousands of them then the difference is exponential.

so anyone can use more power for the second option however the first option uses less and is faster. And when devs are making games that deal with tens of thousands of lines of code it wouldn't be surprising if they made a similar mistakes.

TL:DR simple optimization goes a long way.

[russo121]

Re-read your programming book for noobs or dummies because there are a lot and big errors in your explanation (good effort any way) - if you wanna talk about programming, please do, but more knowledge is needed than "hello world".

PS: sorry if I'm harsh... but you're spitting too much non sense. And good to know you arrived at the arrays chapter.

[mcgrottys]

Hello World is a good example for people who haven't tried programming before, I'm not saying that a lot of N4G commenters are clueless but I'm just going to have to say that the discussions are not not much better than what you would read on youtube. So pardon me for starting off with low expectations.

Software optimization is the first thing they teach you if you take a class involving computer concepts (my class was Assembly code and computer concepts). It isn't what I'm concentrating on though I'm more interested in OOP and Graphics programming (Using OpenGL/Direct3D).

The point I was trying to make with the little snippet of code was an example of how optimized vs optimized code will look and run. I was trying to show they can look very similar at first glance meaning it can be missed in the final build, a game engine with have thousands of lines of code and even after testing there are things that can slip by.

Trust me, I know much more about programming and computers in general than you think. I just didn't want to spend more than ten minutes working on a comment that only a small handful of people would read.

Right now devs have the overhead to be lazy with their code because everything they see now is better than last gen. The only things they will spend time to fix will be game breaking bugs. Sometimes they know where they are wasting resources on a certain area but changing that one thing could mean tweaking other areas of the game to account for that one change. So instead of patching the game for that they just find all these non game breaking bugs and fix those for the next game and when they do that they will have left over resources to use elsewhere.

[DVAcme]

Maxing out the system specs right out of the gate is bad news, and I seriously doubt MS's much-touted "power of the cloud" will enhance performance dramatically enough to compensate. Maxing out the specs should be something that happens at the tail-end of a console's lifetime, as can be appreciated in pretty much every generation prior to this one.

[jimbobbeers]

Wakey wakey folks, this is the same for every console. Do you honestly believe they dont try to make games the best they can? Course they do, but with time that 100% can be used more efficiently. Look at the PS4, not every game is 1080p neither, does it mean they never will be? No, of course not, but they're using 100% of what they can right now.

[mitford]

same old i remember when the 360 came out im sure devs were saying the same thing

[AceBlazer13]

That's pretty sad honestly.

[bligmerk]

Usually, devs say they are using 100% of a console's resources and power towards the end of life for that console. Might be what this statement is saying about the XBone, still born. Does everybody forget the MS lapdog xbots crap storm when ND said Uncharted 1 was using more than half the power of the PS3? That was over 5 years ago and ND only said they were using 100% of the PS3 for TLOU. XBone sounds more and more limp every day.

[cactusjack]

so forza looks a tinch better than the upcoming Gran turismo game for PLAYSTATION 3, and its using 100% of the xbone, at 720p. the xbone is dead in the water.

[PsylentKiller]

If you are using a 100% of your brain and are not a nuclear physicist then you are retarded.

It is said that humans use only 10% of their brains. This is untrue. Humans use 100% of their brains. It only seems like they use less because we are capable of so much more.

The same could be said for these next-gen consoles. The PS4 is realizing more of its potential out of the box. Whereas, the XB1 has yet to realize what it is capable of.

[jacksjus]

I don't know how he thought this would go over well. If you're using 100% of the X1's power now, how much better does he think things will get say 5 years from now. Makes no sense.

[H0RSE]

"But the truth is that I get asked are we using 100 per cent of the box? Of course we are. Everyone is. Even people who are upscaling are still using 100 per cent of the box. What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimisation.

"We had more time so we’re very well optimised and we will continue to optimise this game. If you think about Forza 2, it was a well optimised game, but Forza 4 looked a lot better than Forza 2. That just comes with time."

- This is what it really comes down to - optimization, which differs from dev to dev, which is why a demanding game like Ryse can run at 900p and a game like COD only at 720p. It has less to do with the hardware of the system and more with how devs use it. Also not mentioned in the article, is the fact that MS dev-kits and drivers were sent out/finished late, which allowed even less time for devs to fully get accustomed to the console.

In the early launch stages of the consoles, devs claiming to use 100% of the console, aren't actually using 100% - they are using 100% according to what they know, or even from within the time that had to work with. Think of it like loading a truck full of stuff. An inexperienced loader will leave spaces here and there and be like, "man, it's full." An experienced loader will utilize every inch of the truck, and arrange items in a way to truly maximize the space available.

[jacksjus]

The problem is the PS4 is a 2-Ton truck adn the X1 is a 1-ton truck. The only way X1 will be able to catch up is to design new hardware from scratch.

[H0RSE]

That's not really the point though. I'm not claiming that the X1 is as powerful as the PS4, even with proper optimization, but more so that a big part of the problems lie with the developers and not the hardware itself. This goes for both platforms.

I don't care if one console is more powerful than the other, I just want developers to fully utilize what is available to them.

[Big-Bruizzer]

To me, this means the Xbox one isn't as future proof as everyone is saying it is.

[feraldrgn]

They hit the ceiling already?

[alexkoepp]

PS4 is using 100% too, game developers use all the resources, the way in which games are optimized is where the improvement comes in as the generation moves on.

[corvusmd]

I love how this headline is purposely misleading and clearly fanboy bait...being as the NEXT LINE is actually the most important one, but the poster of this article intentionally left it out....well done sir...well done.

[KontryBoy706]

man the console war is in full swing

[GraveLord]

Xbox One maxed out at 720p then? Ouch. This console is weaker than we thought.

[JuniorCE]

How ironic is this... Indeed, this is xbox 720...

[DialgaMarine]

Meanwhile, most games on PS4 are running on the old dev kits that only used 4 GB of RAM... The PS4 is just getting started, and it's already destroying XBone.

[Phantom_Puss]

I am sure that was a typo, more like 1.00 % which is excellent at today's standards right? /s

[nasnas76]

It may be "100%" right now but it's still a new system. How long did it take to get the full potential on any consoles in the past? That "100%" will certainly be a lot less once they find new ways to use the hardware to it's real 100% potential.

[Ukdude]

Lets look logical at this:

Xbox one graphics and cpu is estimate minimum 3x more powerfull than the 360.
360 could play 720p at 60fps on some games.
Theres no reason at all why the One cant hit 60fps 1080p.
Its plain and simple:
The potential of the architecture has in no way been seen yet and the devs have not put in the time.
Give it 12 months and im v sure games will be looking great.

[russo121]

As I said in another thread - too much noise coming from ms / ms developers and I don't understand why - just shut up.

[hankmoody]

"But the truth is that I get asked are we using 100 per cent of the box? Of course we are. Everyone is. Even people who are upscaling are still using 100 per cent of the box. What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimization."

Any questions?

[NikonSteve]

http://members.modernvespa....

[Gondee]

Look, i could write a pong game that max's out a super computer....These games started development when the Xbox and PS4 didn't even have specs yet. They are built to scale to every bit of available performance. Future titles will be built against a solid spec line, and developers will manually optimize

[DoggyBiscuit]

If power is what u want just get a PS4 and just forget bout the spy box

[marcofdeath]

The idiots that are on this website is in denial. This is only what I have been trying to tell you for the last three months, the Paper station 4 is behind in video quality even at 1080p, as the games of BF4, Need for speed, and soon Call of duty ghost have shown. have you noticed that it's the same problem in each of the three games of texture quality or pixel quality. I can go on record as saying right now that CODG will be at a lower resolution on Xbox one and still have better textures and geometry than the PaperStation 4 on screen. In this article he is stating that as developers optimize this architecture the games will continue to get better and that is why the comment of " they are behind and they will stay behind". Proof of fact RYSE VS KZSF both first party games.

"What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimisation."

since most of you have no clue about producing video games, you believe that the paper specs of PS4 shows that they are not using all of its power. Dan Greenwall just explain to you how development works " optimization". Over time Paper Station 4 will continue to be optimized for greater performance as well from this point And the same will happen to Xbox one as well.

"We had more time so we’re very well optimised and we will continue to optimise this game. If you think about Forza 2, it was a well optimised game, but Forza 4 looked a lot better than Forza 2. That just comes with time."

Here he explains why over time these optimizations make each platform perform better. Xbox ones developer Turn 10 has been work on the engine for Forza 5 over the last 2 1/2 years in development therefore the engine is much further ahead in optimization when compared to your third-party games who have not had the same amount of time with the hardware. In the future this hardware when optimize will allow almost every game to be 900p or 1080p 60 frames per second. The Xbox ones architecture is not like the Paper station 4 with the use of off-the-shelf parts to make it like a PC architecture, As Mark Carey already explained, and therefore shares some of the same inefficiencies of PC hardware.

[Grimhammer00]

Delusions much?

[Demonblade]

Sounds like the kind of stupid crazy crap you can read at misterxmedia blog. Please go back to that website, as it suits your negative IQ better.

[marcofdeath]

"stupid crazy crap"
1.By Thomas Morgan:
"As you may notice in our screengrabs, the actual results on PS4 lack the corresponding level of crystal clarity we'd expect of such a significant resolution boost. This should surely be a home run for Sony's console, but what is likely to be a software-based upscale to 1080p delivers less-than-stellar returns, and for better or worse leaves the Xbox One with an often crisper looking, albeit much more aliased image."

"3/4 Alpha buffers are lower in resolution compared to the PC release, as shown in the fountain in this shot, and licks of flames elsewhere. A delay in texture streaming also afflicts the PS4 version in occasional spots - such as the concrete wall in the foreground."

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

Me: 2 you: 0

Mark Cerny:
"I think of it a super-charged PC architecture, and that's because we have gone in and altered it in a number of ways to make it better for gaming."
http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

Me: 3 You: 0

Dan Greenawalt:
"But the truth is that I get asked are we using 100 per cent of the box? Of course we are. Everyone is. Even people who are upscaling are still using 100 per cent of the box. What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimisation."

"We had more time so we’re very well optimised and we will continue to optimise this game. If you think about Forza 2, it was a well optimised game, but Forza 4 looked a lot better than Forza That just comes with time."

ME 4 you 0

Now who is the stupid crazy crap? Looks like you!

[Demonblade]

The mental gymnastics you do are quite impressive. Keep it up please, and post more stuff at misterxmedia site, stuff there is always so entertaining. Keep searching for that dgpu.

[PersonMan]

The point is... you can max out a system with PONG. It depends on how wisely you're using the resources you're given. Just because it's maxed out, doesn't mean the games won't get better as seen with this gen.

Look at GTA IV, there's no doubt that Rockstar's engine was squeezing every last drop of power that they knew how to squeeze, but then look at GTA V's massive improvements in lighting and animation... that's how you optimize.

[cell989]

I really hope they dont mean that as literally cause wow thats a fail

[PeanutPower]

Its the stupid kinect that's preventing the system to have 1080p games

[FF]

Mas que gente estupida...

[etownone]

I don't they are speaking for everyone.

But they managed to make a beautiful game at 1080p 60 fps

[Wikkid666]

If people actually read the article you would understand what he means.

[Dohv]

That's really bad if true. Using 100% of the console's power at launch ? And most of the games can't even handle 1080p.

[bleedsoe9mm]

i love partial quotes taken out of context (and so does adam sessler) the second part of the quote is " What happens over the course of years is that we get better at tricking the box into doing what we want. It’s optimisation."
do people just read the headlines without thinking

[SovereignSnaKe]

~Well, I guess I for one will never know because I am never EVER playing Forza.

Dead Rising 3 > Forza

[iplay1up2]

I was not planning on buying a XB1 anyway...LOL...go for it kids. I have Wii U, and a PS4 pre ordered...LMAO...

[NeXXXuS]

You preordered a Wii U while it's already been released?

[iplay1up2]

I have a Wii U, and I have pre ordered PS4. Is that better? I should have used a period.

[Gore-Content]

This is just the launch. If everyone's already using 100%, then I don't see a bright future for xbone.

[iceman600]

lol that's what you idiots get for trying to be a pc, and the tech they use is so behind the curve it's not even funny.

[NeXXXuS]

Already?

[Krosis]

Hmmm, how can we spin this to jab at MS? Oh, let's interpret it as they are already using all Xbox Ones power! Sickening. If this was turned around and directed at PS4, the article wouldn't be approved.

[HardcoreDaBoss]

Its no way the xbox one is maxed out on launch games. consoles have custom hardware and developers have to learn it and with time they master it and push consoles way futher then people would think possible. uncharted looks amazing on ps3 and this is done with 512 mb shared ram and a weak gpu by todays standards. If anyone thinks the 6-8 cores are maxed out and the 8 gigs of ram are also they are not even thinking at all and just hating M$

[ParanoidFreak]

Prob not the best thing to say about a launch game... let alone a system that hasn't even released! Holy hell, MS has no clue a bout nothing anymore. Hahaha

I don't care really, especially after reading about what they did to Rare

[LaidBakLazyHippo]

Honestly developers say they are using 100 percent of the console, but then they find more ways to unlock more power. Example: Metal gear solid for ps3 was said to use 100 percent of the ps3's power then comes uncharted 3 which looked way better! So I honestly people need to chill, it takes time to learn how to program for new hardware

[LAWSON72]

per cent lol.

[Rickgrimes95]

How much you wanna bet destiny runs sub 1080 on xbox one and native 1080 on ps4

[D0UbleF_]

I remember Killzone 2 on the Playstation 3 was announced to use 70-75% of the amazing Cell processor's power.

When I saw Killzone 3 and especially The Last of Us this year I think Killzone 2 was even lower than that.

I'm pretty sure this time we'll have the same scenario, where the first generation of PS4 games will be using about 70% of it's actual power.
Don't forget here - This time we've got a bazillion times more RAM and GPU power as well.

I'm very curious what studios like Naughty Dog and Santa Monica will serve us in 2014 :)

[Crypt0117]

At this time. Just like any other time. When devs get familar with the tools and hardware that 100 percent will be a different 100 percent. Plus this is old news. Stop with the timely rehash stories.

[larrysdirtydrawss]

damn,to bad for the one,,ps4 i bet still has a long way to go,i doubt any dev right now is taking full advantage of the 8ACE'S 64 queues the ps4 has to do compute on the gpu's unused cycles...

[DivineAssault]

haymaker

[KevPC]

i don't understand...so does this mean that even with 100% they still wont reach 1080p???

[madjedi]

Depends on the decisions of the devs really, a retail xbox one game can hit 1080p it just depends on how much the devs want to sacrifice to achieve it.

Ps4 has a easier time reaching 1080p do to it's more powerful hardware, but that doesn't exempt it's devs from also having to make concessions/sacrifies ect.

So 10% of the gpu wasn't reserved for snap, apps and multitasking or that they are using 100% of the system that is available to them.

[XxGOWxX]

Most of you arent reading this correctly.

He is saying all devs are using 100% of the resources available.

BUT they all arent using the best available engine for the system, so what theyre doing is using all the hardware available, BUT just not effective or efficiently.

Basically he said at the moment the current engines devs are using are old but still just work on PS4 atm (like ghosts because of the extra power) but they need updating and optimizing to run better on XBO (because of the different hardware structure)

So good news for everyone, when the devs update their engines we all win and get even nicer looking games in the future. yay!

[urwifeminder]

Ten days to go see you on live will be a top day maxed big deal.

[coopman300]

I highly doubt it. Devs didnt start maxing out current gen hardware til the last year or so. Highly unlikely either console would be maxed out out of the gate.

[Morgue]

If you plan on buying an X1 still. Don't worry...

100% of your money is gonna be worth it.

sarcasm....

[BobBelcher]

lol... silly hoes didn't even read the article.

[user7402931]

pathetic

[jasonmcee]

Its funny how everyone talks about 720p and 900p games. But from what I have seen Killer Instinct, Dead Rising 3, and Ryse looks better then any 1080p ps4 game. It must not be all about graphics if a 720p game can look better then a 1080p game. Xbox 1 is the future for sure notonly is it about gaming but gives you a multitude of other things you can do with it. And there launch games blow anything away from ps4 by far.I don't care who has more power in the end Microsoft will have a better gaming experience, better ui, better online gameplay, and by the looks of things microsofts xbox1 720p beats out playstation 4 1080p. So who is really better let me see.. Yeah its a no brainer xbox1

[Dehnus]

Sigh, still with the percentages like a so many generations ago.

You always try to use 100% of the hardware, especially for the more taxing situations. However with any console, the engines become smarter and more efficient. So where before maxing out the hardware would give you a pretty picture, now maxing out the hardware in a smarter more efficitent way gives you a prettier picture. Nothing new there, and I wish that thing about "Only using <x>%" would just die out.

No developer, first until third party, will deliberatly gimp him or herself. As they have no reason to do so.

[badboy776]

Question- Is this good or bad???

[Azzanation]

Pity next Gen consoles cant do 4k gaming.. I mean who the hell cares its only resolution. The greatest games of all time on last gen aren't even 720p.

[2pacalypsenow]

And it cant run COD at 1080p .....

[abradley]

This is not the best of news for the console generation. No developer, not even first party, should be already using 100% of a system.

Only lately have Sony's first parties really shown how much more it was capable of against the Xbox 360. This gives consoles room to grow and expand much like the PC market does over time. If the Xbox One doesn't have that, we could see cross platforms leading on PS4 more and a much bigger difference in scope of games on the two platforms.

This is of course without the added help of MS's cloud system but I still fail to see how that will benefit the majority of gamers, specially those with poor internet connections.

[DoggyBiscuit]

We been warned already graphics are not gonna improve that much this generation so don't be surprise just enjoy the gameplay and stop being a graphics whore