PS4: new kits shipping now, AMD A10 used as base

VG247 reports that dev kits for PS4 are shipping out to studios now and that the unit will use an AMD A10 as its base. Sources close to the site state that the console - codename Orbis - is not being made in Japan. All the details here.

[a_bro]

sounds good.

[Abash]

Yeah Im excited for the next PlayStation, but based on 2013's releases Im fine with my PS3 for at least another year

[Army_of_Darkness]

"The “ultimate goal” for the hardware, we were told, is for it to be able to run 1080p60 games in 3D with “no problem,” to create a machine that’s powerful enough for “today and tomorrow’s market”

Now this has officially got me excited for the PS orbis!

[NewMonday]

A big thing from the extra RAM will be full system acsess with the ps buttun and background downloads and updates

[darthv72]

Maybe so but the problem is getting people to buy 3d tv's. I like the idea but hate the prices and the non standardization of the tech.

Active or passive? shutter or anamorphic?

A gaming platform cant make people buy a new display format (ie: 3d) but it certainly has done wonders to get people to buy HDTV's in general.

there needs to be a commitment from all 4 sides to make it work. Content providers (movies/games), retailers (pricing) and mfgs (set builders and a standard). Once those 3 sides can come together we will have the new age of entertainment.

Oh, the 4th side is consumer acceptance.

[bumnut]

1080p @60fps in 3d won't happen. You need multiple graphics cards for that kind of performance.

720p... maybe, but don't get your hopes up for 1080.

[Qrphe]

@bumnut

It can happen definitely. The problem would be having a proper 3DTV with a refresh rate good enough to keep up with the hardware but that's about it.

[Beastforlifenoob]

@qrphe
most 3D plasma's already have a refresh rate of 240-320 HZ or 240fps-320fps so media is actually behind TV

[ABizzel1]

Not to sure about this rumor.

The goal is 1080p @ 60fps in 3D, but the A10 will have a hard time doing that unless they plan on running it Xfire with another dedicated GPU.

The A10 alone with it's standard 7660 does current gen games at better frame-rates than current consoles, but going with this set-up would put it only slightly more powerful than the Wii-U (excluding the huge amount of RAM).

Seeing how it's not likely to be announced until E3 2013 they'd be better off going with AMD's Steamroller APU's which should offer a significant improvement over the current A10, but the release date for those APU's are still up in the air.

Their best bet would be to use Xfire with a 7850. They'll meet their goal on almost all games, and it'll be a $400 console.

[Peppino7]

Im happy with concrete news vs rumors and speculation. This is very good news.

[AsimLeonheart]

Now this is a TRUE next-gen system unlike the WiiU which is actually a "PS360 1.5". The Nintendo fans were jumping all over the place over 2Gb RAM in the WiiU. What do you guys have to say now that we know that the Orbis has at least 8GB RAM! The PS3 with its XFIRE setup and 8GB will blow WiiU out of the water. I just checked the benchmark for A10 APUs and the latest one is capable of running the Witcher 2 at 720p and 28fps by itself without any dedicated GPU. With a XFIRE setup the Orbis will be a beast!

[SlavisH2]

Lots of RAM and NO CELL are a plus! I hope this will mean more developer involvement and making the ps4 so there are less problems when making games! No Cell also means no or few ps3 games will work on it. Thats fine if you loved your ps3 games THEN keep your PS3!

~ Facts hurt Fanboys :(

[jimbobwahey]

That's exactly what I'll do, keep my PS3 and wait for a price drop or two on the PS4.

Expecting people to have two PlayStations under their TV is just silly, and since the first year or so of a consoles life is severely lacking in games (particularly good ones) then Sony will be missing out on a launch day sale to me if their new console isn't backwards compatible.

[frelyler]

I would agree from a hardware standpoint, however Sony bought Gaiki, remember? So that solves that.

[mi_titan27]

my hope is with the rate of downloadable games, all those will be backwards compatible via your PSN acct. Even if the harware cant play the PS3 discs.

[pixelsword]

No. Me loves me PS3, me love da cell.

AMD can go to... my PC!

:D

[gatormatt80]

I'm personally very intrigued with how Sony is going to handle the PS Store when the PS4 is launched. Will we see two separate stores, one being on the PS3 and Vita, and the PS4 having its own separate store?? I'm sure Sony's ownership of Gaikai is going to come into play somewhere, more than likely being involved in backwards compatibility.

But where will Sony draw the line when it comes to PS3 backwards compatibility??? For example, digital PS3 full games bought from the PS Store. Will Gaikai handle those as well?

[BattleAxe]

I don't have a problem with the hardware of the PS4 not being backwards compatible, but they better at least give me access to all the games that I have bought, by allowing me to play them through GaiKai.

[DeadlyFire]

Its a plus in many ways, but No Cell would slow their sales. Personally I can see a Cell+RSX combo chip thrown in every PS4 for compatibility with PS3 and PSN games on the PS4. Primarily for backwards compatibility. So no development use. Unless they plan for Cell/Cell 2 as a sidekick to the APU+GPU combo. Heating could be an issue if so.

[wishingW3L]

I hate to be negative, specially when I'm a huge Sony fan and I can't wait for the PS4 but this sounds weak as hell! The jump will be like going from a PS2 to an Xbox 1. ;___;

The most powerful APU right now comes with an HD 7750 and that is really weak. Games will look basically the same! OMG, I'm so fkg disappointed... Sony wasted so much money on that stupid PS Vita and now they will give us a weak-ass console!!!! FAAAAWWWK!

[Persistantthug]

How do we not know that the PS4 won't contain some custom APU and also have the approx equivalent of a custom 7950?

You're sentiment seems like you're jumping the proverbial gun.

[SirBradders]

I agree with the guy above, I'm no tech whizz but I'm sure I remember readin something bout the ps3 having a custom processor or something.

[irepbtown]

I can only scratch the surface when it comes to PC specs. I know the basics that's it.

''Orbis, we were told today, is based on the AMD’s A10 APU series. An APU (Accelerated Processing Unit) is a combined CPU and GPU.

PS4′s APU was described today as a “derivative” of existing A10 hardware. The hardware is “based on A10 system and base platform”''.

From what I understood, they are simply basing it on the A10. This does NOT mean it will be the same. They're simply taking key bits and (I think it's quite obvious) improving it. Or maybe they're simply taking the combination of CPU/GPU and because of that, they say 'its based on the A10'.

There's so much that we dont know it's wrong to make a conclusion now. I mean, I think they'll unveil it next year with a 2014 release date. I'll be happy with that looking at the games coming out next year. GTA V alone is worth a year on its own lol.

PS/ Am i the only one that wants the PS4 pad to be identical to the PS3. And if not, have it so we can use PS3 pad for PS4?

[DeadlyFire]

I predict AMD APU + top tier mobile GPU. Say APU has up to 1 Tflops at most + maybe a scaled back AMD 7870M GPU which runs at 2.1 Tflops. Scaled back to maybe 1.8 Tflops or so. Which would equal around 2.8-3.1 Tflops. So no worries buddy.

There was a rumor of AMD GPU with 1.8 Tflops beside APU. No word about this new kit though. It might have something a little stronger.

[JsonHenry]

For anyone that knows anything about the AMD APUs you know you are laughing when you read the 108060hz+3D. The only way this will happen is if they are running the system in 'crossfire' with more APUs or an actual dedicated video card.

I have high hopes for Sony next generation. Going with a coder friendly setup like an AMD APU is a HUGE step in the right direction and I believe shows that Sony certainly learned their lesson this generation. MS and Nintendo may be in for some stiff competition next time around the block.

[andibandit]

Oh noes....the A10

[a_squirrel]

A-10 Thunderbolt?

[princejb134]

i hope ps4 architecture is easier to develop for

happy developers+easy to develop for+powerful system= happy developers making great games

[Tsar4ever01]

YEAH, Sony's is listening and not dictating. 8GB or more of RAM! YYEASSSS!!! A10 series AMD APU, Hah!, An A10 was one of my predictions in the past after reading about the earlier A8 apu, No lie, go and check.....But, months later I started opting for an AMD-FX 8 core APU, Oh well, Maybe the final spec will go for the AMD FX-8 core apu. The moderately weaker A-10 should allow the console to have a MORE favorable consumer launch cost.

But 8GB(*or more) of system RAM!!!! YESSSS!! Sony's heard the devs and listened. TAKE THAT to all those that said "4GB is more than enough", crap. Assheads!!! That'll mean that launch games should look & run AT LEAST as good as the HIGH-END PC games running at ULTRA SETTINGS right now.

As for the storage HDD, The premium model should be of 320GB, not 256gb and the "bundles deals" should be of 500gb w game or BR movie & free months of playstaion plus. Wait a min, 256gb? whats the extra 6gb for? You sure that wasn't a typo from the article? maybe it was meant to be 256MB of "EDRAM" or better yet "FLASH RAM" built on-board the dev-kit motherboard.

[bozebo]

8/16 is only for the devkit so it could be more than the console. I do think 4 could be too little though.

[akaFullMetal]

4 gigs should be plenty, considering what the ps3 can do with 512 mb, compared to a computer that will have 3 or 4 gigs. Not that i wouldn't love 8 gigs, but people need to stop comparing how a console works with ram compared to a computer. A computer is pretty much unoptimized, where consoles are.
I mean ps3 can push out really great graphics with only half a gig of ram. If you did the same thing with a pc, it wouldn't play games.

[PHATL2028]

Well 256gb is going to be a SSD drive which is outstanding. Using a SSD and 8-16gb of ram would be amazing for the future of Sony. The machine would run circles around the gimmicky Wii-U, and rumors of microsoft having isssues with the chipset they chose leading to possible delays.

I would love the option of two different system configs for the " ORBIS". One being 256gb ssd with 8gb ram with a cost of around $399.99 ( wouldn't be shocked if it was cheaper like $349.99 to stick it to Nintendo ). Second option would be the " High-End " version with say a 500gb ssd and 16gb of ram for $599.99. I would jump on that in a heartbeat!

[JsonHenry]

Typically dev kits have double the amount of RAM the system will actually have. So more than likely it will be 4gigs. But I would not complain about 8 gigs if it happened.

[kneon]

8-16gb is for the dev kit, they typically have around double the ram of the real product. So we can likely expect 4-8gb in the consumer version.

And with a hard drive size of 256gb that sure sounds like an SSD since there are no mechanical hard drives made in that size.

[Rage_S90]

It looks like Xbox is gonna be the more powerful console.

[PHATL2028]

How so ?

[DeadlyFire]

AMD Trinity A10 + Piledriver cores - 2012
3rd kit AMD Steamroller A10? - 2013
4th kit AMD Kaveri A10? - 2013

8-16 GB means we will see 4-8 GB of RAM in PS4. Likely 8 GB will be possible.

[Hellsvacancy]

Not that im going to pretend i understand any of it, but with what little RAM the PS3 has had this gen its made some pretty incredible looking games, by logic im thinking if it has more, then the games will be more......"incredible&quo t;

Fallout 4 is what im looking forward to the most, "no excuses this time Bethesda"

[UnwanteDreamz]

They never had any excuse IMO. They have openly treated PS like a red headed stepchild the entire gen.

[Blankman85]

Well that's because like gingers, the ps3 doesn't have a soul. . .on account of it being a console and not a human being and all.

[pixelsword]

Gingers don't have souls?

What about the chick on Gilligan's Island?

[Qrphe]

Bethesda has coded buggy games since I can remember (Daggerfall to me) so do not expect anything better from them, ever. Fallout has only ever been good in the hands of Obsidian, its creator, who also corrected Betheda's mistakes with Fallout 3 by developing New VegS.

[SandwichHammock]

I heart APUs. Not as much as SoC, but eh. Currently running an A8-3500; thing runs cool and quite.

The curious thing about this news, if true, is what graphic core they're gonna go with.

[Shikoro]

If they aren't going with a discrete GPU, the PS4 won't be that powerful. Having just an APU is too weak to have for the next 5+ years so I hope that their source forgot to mention the GPU, too.

At the end of the day, the reveal is just over half a year away. Fun times ahead. :D

[fossilfern]

Yeah the A10s are good and all but not for full 1080p gaming with the graphics maxed out. Unless they will have another Co-GPU inside the machine to work along with the integrated GPU

[Ju]

A10 "Base". If Dual 1080@60Hz is required (for 3D) than that standard GPU won't cut it, but that doesn't mean AMD can't throw in what ever GPU they want. It'll be a custom chip any way, like it always is for consoles. Can quite diverge from the standard chip. A10 is usually 2.3Ghz, but also, I pretty sure a closed platform can do whatever they want with that frequency as well. "APU" doesn't mean it is slow by itself, I can imagine, these days that's more like building blocks you can throw at the SoC and the basic architecture. Question is if AMD can just "throw" in another core mask and be done with it. Can't see why not.

[ABizzel1]

Agreed

They need to at least throw a HD7850 in there if they want to reach their goal, and by then it should be at entry level prices.

Ideally a 7870

[DeadlyFire]

I say the AMD 7870M runs at 2.1 Tflops. As rumors of a GPU with 1.8 Tflops GPU running beside APU. In the end it could have 1 Tflop APU + 2.1 Tflops possibly. Maybe more or less.

Cell could possibly be thrown in the mix. I am doubtful, but possible for backwards compatibility to exist with all PS3 games. It would help alot of PSN releases that run on PS3 hardware work on the PS4.

[steve30x]

The dev Kits always have more ram than the retail units. Looking at those specs I am guessing the PS4 or whatever it will be called will have around 4 GB of ram which isnt too bad.

[Eldyraen]

The old kits could be the ones with 8 and new ones with 16-if so then ps4 could easily have 8gigs still. Either way its a huge upgrade though.

[Walker]

"The dev kits have “either 8Gb or 16Gb of RAM"

Just WOW, Avatar in Real-Time is coming !

[Hoje0308]

Not even close, buddy. Read my post below.

[LOGICWINS]

PCs are about half a decade ahead of consoles. If PCs can't sport Avatar quality graphics at this point, how in the blue hell will the PS4 do it?

[Beastforlifenoob]

My PC already has 16GB ram its not that "wow" \
Alot of PC's nowdays have 32GB's or RAM

[adorie]

Nah. Most PC's run a standard 2-4 gigs of ram. You're probably talking about mobos. Lot's of new mobos these days offer support up to 32gb's of ram, some, even 64 gbs of ram.

[steve30x]

Its only people who wand big epeen need 16GB of ram. The sweet spot is 8Gb of ram on a PC because of lots of other things running in the background. A consoles sweet spot would be 4 - 6GB of ram. For futureproofing I would say 6GB would be good.

[PHATL2028]

You can get high end mobo's with 128gb of ram. But for console to run 8-16 would be great.

[NastyLeftHook0]

im buying this thing day 1! #1 gaming machine

[Hoje0308]

It's a dev kit, which means the retail unit will have about half that. And it still won't have nearly enough grunt to render anything near the fidelity of Avatar. PC will do that long before consoles.
Sorry, meant to respond to Walker. Damn phone.

[NastyLeftHook0]

even if it does not look like avatar im still looking foward to the things they can do with more tech, imagine 5000 players in a room in bf3.

[WiiUalpha]

LOL.. Current top end PC games only allow for 1000 in some games to maybe 64 in BF3 and you actually think a console that will be using outdated tech is going to go beyond what the PC can do?

You Sony fans are a funny lot. You talk about tech and how important it is but yet you are almost always completely clueless to it and how it works. Not just you but these comments in general... 16 gigs and a top of the line CPU and GPU all for 399. Just 50 more than the Wii? LOL not gonna happen. You guys keep living in your fantasy world......

BTW @Army_of_Darkness, its funny how 1080p and 60FPS is now suddenly okay but when it was announced Wii U could do it you were singing a different tune. Funny how the opinion changes when you simply change the comapny name on the product.

[Ju]

^^^ Says the one with the "WiiUalpha" nick...hm...

[ziggurcat]

@ WiiUalpha:

the wiiu isn't going to be able to handle 1080p @ 60fps... sorry to burst your bubble.

[Beastforlifenoob]

@wiiUalpha
Yeah and the WII-U is a amazing incredible miracle in the hardware industry across the world
/s

[fr0sty]

WiiU can do 1080p60, on current gen games. Just like PS3 can do 1080p60 on previous gen games. It isn't the resolution or the framerate alone that determines a system's power, it's what fidelity the visuals at that resolution/frame rate are being rendered at. If you're doing visuals well above the level of Uncharted 3 at 1080p60 in 3D (I doubt Wii U could even run current gen games at 1080p60 in 3D, that's essentially 2x the power needed to render), then you have something to brag about.

[Ryo-Hazuki]

Day 1

[taquito]

keep the same or near same controller

8 gb ram minimum

cpu at least as fast as an i-5 2600

MOST IMPORTANTLY, gpu at least up to par with a gtx 560 ti

[fossilfern]

Why 8gb of Ram ? There is no need for that amount of memory on a console your not running a PC.

[Conzul]

"When asked if PS4 will have an optical drive, specifically Blu-ray, our source responded: “Of course it has.” We’ve been told the hard drive will be 256Gb “as standard,” but it’s not clear if it’ll be a normal HDD or a solid state drive."

Looking good. A model with even a small SSD would wake people up to the future.

[Dasteru]

Highly unlikely.

8gb DDR3@1600mhz = $90
i5-2600 = $317
GTX 560ti = $207
Thats $614 there, then you have to factor in the HDD, Disk drive, main board, enclosure, etc.

(Prices from newegg)

Even with manufacturer wholesale costs on the parts you would still be looking at probably over $800 after profit margins.

The AMD A10 APU that is rumored for it is a fraction the power of either of those.

[bozebo]

What. Not only do they obviously not use standard PC parts, but they sell consoles at a loss most of the time.

So even if it was $600 for not being standard PC parts (no plug & play among loads of other things, like different board partners, retailers and distributors taking a cut) and they took a $100 loss on the sale, it'd be $500 which isn't too bad for a launch price.

AMD A10 does seem like a weak choice but they would just be basing it on the architecture so it will probably be totally different.

[konnerbllb]

as a follow up to bozebo's post, they won't be paying retail for that tech.

[TheUndertaker85]

They both forgot to mention that really, do you think Sony is buying parts one by one on Newegg? If you even try to say yes when typing a reply please, just stop what you're doing and back away.

Cause you know what happens when you set up bulk orders through companies in many major instances don't you? With those discounts Sony is probably spending less than a third of those prices per component.

[Dasteru]

@TheUndertaker85:

Learn to read or take your own advice and back away.

I never said Sony would be buying parts from Newegg, I was simply using it as a reference and i also clearly stated "AFTER MANUFACTURER WHOLESALE COSTS" Reading really is an important aspect of any argument.

Despite not getting parts from Newegg, Sony does not pay $10 for every part nomatter what it is or where they get it, the baseline price on Newegg is still useful info.

Also if you had ever run a business yourself before you wouldn't be assuming something so absurd as "a third"

Even with large bulk purchases they only get around a 20% discount on parts, contrary to popular belief.

Also the PS3 is the first Sony console that started selling at a loss, Both the PS1 and PS2 came out of the gate making a profit, And Sony has stated recently that they have learned from this gen's mistakes. If anyone honestly belives Sony will be selling at a loss again for the PS4, They are supremely delusional.

Edit: Before anyone replies to this, please read the entire post first, rather than just picking and choosing whatever words in it allow you to form your own flawed response.

[Dasteru]

Just to add to my last reply.

The reason i used Newegg was because its one of the cheapest online retail outlets for PC parts and would be closest to what Sony would be paying.

These are all also the cheapest versions of the parts i could find on the site.

8gb DDR3@1600mhz = $90
i5-2600 = $317
GTX 560ti = $207
256gb SSD (Regular platter based HDDs aren't available in in 256gb so if the 256 rumor is true then it has to be an SSD) = $179

Blu-ray Drive = $59
All other parts (Mainboard, Enclosure, Cooling, Wifi chip, Bluetooth chip, Media slots, etc)
Conservative estimate = $50

90+317+207+179+59+50=961 - 20%. Lets say -25% to be conservative again = $720 + Manufacturer markup + Retail markup = You do the math.

Unless the PS4 is still 5 years from release i don't see it happening.

Btw i am not trying to start arguments here, i am simply being realistic and stating facts. If anyone has trouble accepting facts, that is fine but please don't insult me and don't make random assumptions about me, especially if you haven't fully read my posts yet.

Edit: Just remembered the Retail markups, so even IF it only costs them $600 to make as suggested by bozebo, and even IF Sony decides to sell at a loss of $100, That still makes it a $750 console after the average 50% retail markup.

[chasegarcia]

I guess AMD got the contract for WiiU and PS4. I wonder if they also got one for x720.

[Ju]

AMD doesn't make WiiIU's CPU, though. Only GPU.

[WetN00dle69]

Simple, The Xbox has been with AMD since the beginning of the 360 development.

[Vickistheman]

All I care about is launch price. Please make it $399 Sony.

[Conzul]

I'm thinking a $450 and a $500 model. Both would be fine.

[Vickistheman]

As long as it's pretty powerful, $450 seems reasonable.

[SAE]

when ps3 released it cost me 650$

so im expecting that price for it in release date ...

450$ is the price of the ps3 right now in my country ....

it's not reasonable to me even though i would love to get that price , i wouldnt mind getting a ps4 for 650 if it's more powerful ..

[Neonridr]

16GB of RAM seems a little excessive.

Still nice to hear some news about next gen, even though we don't if it's true or not.

[XB1_PS4]

It is excessive. People that are disagreeing don't understand how ram is used while playing games.. You don't need that much. 8gb of ram is more than plenty, and it will cut down the price.

I'm expecting it will have 4-6gb ram though, which is still enough.

[soundslike]

RAM is so cheap its not like it would affect the overall price very much to have too much rather than just enough.

[Consoldtobots]

nonsense, you can never have too much memory. people who say otherwise have no idea what they are talking about.

[Neonridr]

okay, so put 64GB of RAM into your computer - oh wait, most PC's only support up to 32GB of RAM. And even then, unless you have Windows 7 Professional, it won't even recognize more than 16GB of RAM. So yes, there is such a thing as too much memory since programs don't exist to even take advantage of it.

I want you to show me significant benefits of having a PC with 8GB of RAM, and then put in 16GB instead. You think suddenly you're going to get 15 extra fps or something?

The only thing having that much memory will do as a benefit is make the system more future-proof. Unless the new PS4 is supposedly going to be able to multi-task like 4 different things at once.

[unchartedxplorer]

I think they are rushing it a bit for next generation. We are still getting brilliant releases next year like GTA V, the last of us...etc. I'm fine up until 2014 for next gen

[Npugz7]

You call 7 years rushing lol sorry but I don't want to be an old fart by the time I get to enjoy the next gen!

[Treian]

Awesome. Sony specs next dissapoint. Now my PC and PS4 will be closer together.

[WildStyles]

Good. As long as it's not over 400, I'm buying.

[XB1_PS4]

I'm thinking it will be $499.. As much as I'd like it to be $399, I'd rather it have good specs to last a full generation.

[EffectO]

So much for bu bu bu no PS3 in 2013.Near final kits in January,final kits in summer,pre E3 reveal.

Fall 2013 release confirmed.

Also you people do realize that PC based early devkits have gobs of RAM anyway.Even final devkits have much more RAM than console.

[Torkith]

I'm a little surprised there was no mention of 4K resolution considering they had just shown off GT5 running at 4K.

[Neonridr]

who has a TV that is capable of running that? Sony's 84" 4K LCD TV goes for a whopping $25,000.

How many people do you think are going to own a 4K capable TV in the next 2-3 years? The price of those TV's won't even be reasonable for another 3-4.

[Torkith]

Oh I totally agree with you, however that doesn't mean the system wouldn't be capable of it.

[Getowned]

that would not be an affordable PS4/Orbis. lol

[Beastforlifenoob]

To run a game smooth on 4K you would need like 32-64GB of RAM... so no maybe Next Next generation

[specialguest]

PC already has up to 32gb of ram. It takes a hell of a lot more than ram to run native 4k res.

[bozebo]

No, about 6-8GB of Video Memory.

[OC_MurphysLaw]

Hmm... not sure I will sign off on this rumor as being fact just yet. The not in Japan part seems very out of place for Sony.

[BlaqMagiq24]

Can't wait to see the outcome of this.

[3-4-5]

They are going after the PC gamers. Trying to bring them over to Playstation. Not a bad move and very smart including 256 Gb HD and 8-16 Gb RAM.

That is....if this is true

[Lifebanisher]

The only way that's gonna happen is if they implement keyboard and mouse on every ps4 FPS,RPG Online game, then they'll start to pull some pc players.. pc players hate the controller they are so used to keyboard and mouse.

[Sykoticz]

I want intel and nvidia. AMD has nothing remotely as good as intel in the CPU department and also AMD has not as good candy features as nvidia. I hope this isn't true.

[XB1_PS4]

I'm an Intel/Nvidia fan too. Either way though, the ps4 won't have the very top of the line from either. That makes it irrelevant as to which company has the best stuff.
AMD is generally a bit cheaper, so having their chips could cut prices. Which is good. :)

[bladesofagony]

i completely agree with you guys, intel/nvidia are perfect companion, even entry level core i3 sandy bridge cpu's blows top end AMD quad core phenom's out of the water, they are so shit on pc's, i wonder what good will it bring to PS4

[Npugz7]

I recently read that the next xbox is using nvidia whether that is true or not.

[yewles1]

"When asked if PS4 will have an optical drive, specifically Blu-ray, our source responded: “Of course it has.” We’ve been told the hard drive will be 256Gb “as standard,” but it’s not clear if it’ll be a normal HDD or a solid state drive."

That 256Gb just about verifies a SSD...

http://www.amazon.com/Cruci...

Or possible Flash internal, take your pick.

[Eldyraen]

More than likely you're right--256 does scream one of the 2. Nice thinking ;)

[ozzywazzy]

jizz worthy if true, either way my body is ready.

[doogiebear]

I dunno man, even on sale its $200. Kinda expensive when u factor in the cpu, graphics chip, internal wifi, etc that will be in the Orbis.

[OooHJohnny]

"Sony’s aim with Orbis is to avoid problems involved in launching PS3 by creating something very affordable but that isn’t a slouch"

Good to hear.

[Ziggyvertang]

I think that's a good thing aswell but another part of me is also wants the most powerful PS4 I can get...some people also need to learn to save for things aswell. I have already started saving for my next gen console with what ever one its going to be

[Clarence]

Funny I remember a couple of articles and people on here saying that the PS3 was Sonys last console.

[Getowned]

"PS4′s APU was described today as a “derivative” of existing A10 hardware. The hardware is “based on A10 system and base platform”."

Intresting indeed I want to know more, it almost sounds a bit weaker in the graphics department than I imagined but it's to early to say that I guess, and if their goal is

"The “ultimate goal” for the hardware, we were told, is for it to be able to run 1080p60 games in 3D with “no problem,” to create a machine that’s powerful enough for “today and tomorrow’s market”."

Than I fully believe they will reach it. Sofar ps4 seems a bit more powerful that the Wii U if I'm not mistaken I don't know much about GPGPUs and APUs.

This is great news and sounds more affordable than ps3 at launch.

Orbis, Orbis, Orbis ... I hope it's not orb shaped.

[DivineAssault]

Oh ya baby its coming.. It will be mine DAY 1! I already have some money set aside for it & cant wait for the reveal.. Damn I wanna see it!!! All u haters out there, eat it up & wish doom some more, It wont stop the inevitable.. This console has a lot more than whats mentioned here.. Theres nothing saying all this is FACTUAL but rumors are coming in & will continue for the nx yr so u have a long time to keep hating.. Nothing here says that its not capable of upscaling 4kx2k resolutions.. We dont know what it can/cant do just yet.. I tell u one thing tho, if sony is putting out TVs that run 4k & showed 4K demos w only 4 ps3s doing it, its far from impossible..

lol ppl think thats not much stronger than wii u?! 8GB or ram w AMD A10?? that b*tch slaps wii u w its GPGPU 2GB ram.. Yes actual graphical power of these have yet to be seen but the ram alone is annihilation so of course the rest is much more powerful

[YoungPlex]

The “ultimate goal” for the hardware, we were told, is for it to be able to run 1080p60 games in 3D with “no problem,” to create a machine that’s powerful enough for “today and tomorrow’s market”.

Why don't you learn how to read? Oh well this is nice indeed and exactly what I expected!

[SonyNGP]

Definitely not a fanboy. Nope. No siree!

[Pillsbury1]

It's highly doubtful Sony will include 4k support as Tvs that support it cost thousands. It would take a lot of horsepower to provide 4k on 3d hopefully next gen, all I would be happy with is true 1080p at 60fps.

[Ziggyvertang]

4k TV's are set to be released around the end of next year and early 2014 and considering he is right there has been a demo of running a modded GT5 using 4 PS3 to run at 4K resolutions 60FPS and when using Moores law when is very accurate to todays tech still and states that the number of transistors on a board doubles ever two years we can expect the PS4 to be around 8 maybe 10 times more power so it should in theory be able to play a game at 4K without a problem

[madjedi]

And why the hell wouldn't sony include 4k support, they are a tv and movie company as well. <-- Might be useful to have a 4k ready device in many households.

Why are some people foolish enough to think sony won't try to make their product built to take advantage of future upcoming improvements/technologies that are within reason.

This is sony, they push the industry forward, not we will get there yrs after the fact nintendo.

The ps4 will likely support 4k resolution, just don't expect any games to go above 1080p.

10-12 yrs ago a new hdtv was $16k(maybe a 46 inch at best) at best buy, now look at the price of tv's.

But until they start making alot of content at 4k resolution this is a fairly mute subject.

Till i hear something more substantial than a rumor article not believing anything.

I though the issue was a bandwidth limitation on hdmi version 1.4.

[Sarobi]

This is definitely interesting news. Hopefully we'll start getting more information on this and the neXtbox as this year packs up'

[StrawHatPatriot]

"The “ultimate goal” for the hardware, we were told, is for it to be able to run 1080p60 games in 3D with “no problem""

I kept on saying virtual reality will be the main feature with the PS4, based on all the patents they have had. However, I was close...

[lfclee]

Bit late though arn't they.

[Tyrone_Biggums]

Y NO CELL?

[doogiebear]

Because cell sucks. Besides, Gaikai might be able to emulate ps3 games anyway

[DigitalAnalog]

The “ultimate goal” for the hardware, we were told, is for it to be able to run 1080p60 games in 3D with “no problem,” to create a machine that’s powerful enough for “today and tomorrow’s market”.

Now this is VERY telling. Assuming this rumor is to be true, 2 things need to be considered:

1) 1080p 60fps in 3D (which is double the performance cost) would most certainly apply to the PS3 titles.

2) This would place the power equivalent to at least a 560ti (factoring in the APU optimizations for console overhead compensation).

[JAMurida]

I wouldn't go to crazy on it though. Didn't Sony say that they wanted the PS3 to be able to output two 1080p signals at once? Not saying that what they are trying to achieve now is impossible, but Sony DOES have to make sure it's not expensive.

I'm still more interested to see what Gaikai will bring to the table tbh, I know these next gen systems will probably be around the power of a good gaming PC now, (with some tweaking to make it better).

[josephayal]

i want that FAT PS4 ASAP

[kwyjibo]

I doubt this is true, an AMD APU chip means an x86 console, I really doubt this is going to happen.

Wouldn't be surprised if they went AMD for the graphics, but fairly sure they'll stick with IBM for their processor.

[BitbyDeath]

Kinda hoping cell would come back but if it makes development easier then i guess AMD is the way to go.

Liking the sound of 8/16gb ram

2013 release is obvious

[ElementX]

I'm really tired of that image, it's used in every PS4 article

[Saleem101]

Ps4 has 2 graphics cards A10 and Amd 7000 series card maybe low end card....

[Saleem101]

This is old news...

[TheUndertaker85]

IF these specs are true it would appear that Nintendo might be in huge trouble when the other actual NextGen consoles come in.

I do however doubt they're going to put in 8 or 16 gigs of RAM. Even offering two RAM models seems stupid as that'd mean games would run one way on one version and completely different on the other. Splitting sides won't help and if people take a look at the PC gaming scene it could actually hurt. Games tend to take longer on PC because of the amount of different specs involved.

[BitbyDeath]

I don't think Ninty were ever planning to compete with PS4 and Xbox

[Theyellowflash30]

I don't think so, Dev kits always have more Ram than the final products, Wii U Dev Kits had 4-6 GB of Ram. Not to mention the leap is not as big. Wii U will be able to hold its own based on these specs. There are PC that Blow these specs out of the water

[JAMurida]

"IF these specs are true it would appear that Nintendo might be in huge trouble when the other actual NextGen consoles come in."

Tbh, I don't even think Nintendo is even studying MS and Sony like that. Nintendo's focus has been the main stream...the masses or however you want to call it. Sony on the other hand, (I would of said MS as well but they seem to be going the Nintendo route), is focusing on the core gamers.

Long story short, both companies are targeting different audiences.

[Vickistheman]

8 Gig RAM would make perfect sense. It might seem a bit overkill now, but if the console is designed to last for 10 years then it's not that hard to imagine.

I can see tablets and phones getting 8 gigs ram pretty damn soon since they upgrade them so damn fast.

[Brian1rr]

Phones use a completely different kind of ram

[bangshi]

ha, dream on, phones stalled on 1gb for ages and only now are we starting to see 2gb.

We won't see 8gb in phones for a very long time. There isn't the need for it.

I see the 8/16 split as perhaps Sony seeing what people can do with the extra RAM, and seeing if there is a case for putting in 8gb over 4gb. Remember dev kits have double the RAM.

[Consoldtobots]

the biggest problem i have with my evo is the abysmal amount of NVRAM they put in it. Talk about gimping a phone for the android market.

[FFXI101]

“They’re trying to make it as fluid as possible”

I like that.

[guitar_nerd_23]

Sounds underwhelming to me. :(

[DarthBigE]

sooooo...I should start saving....
ps3 compatable? It better be!

[BitbyDeath]

Probably not if AMD is correct.

[DarthBigE]

Can you please explain? I'm not good with cpu's and their parts and functions..why would it matter if its AMD?

[BitbyDeath]

You may have heard of Cell's 7 SPU's which are each provided with tasks, AMD hardware have 1 giant bucket to process from instead of 7.

Most PS3 games (particularly the exclusives) are setup to read the cell architecture which AMD will not understand and hence making backwards compatibility unlikely.

That said i wouldn't rule it out completly as Sony could write Software to translate but it does make it less likely.

[JAMurida]

It could be if Sony used Gaikai for the PS3/PS2/PS1 library, but that's just streaming wise.

[IWentBrokeForGaming]

PS4 genuinley will be my 1st console purchase of the 3 Next Gen!

[DivineHand125]

If this is all true. We can now confirm that you will not be able to play your current "PS3" Blu-ray games on the system. Instead Sony might continue to do remastered collections(1080P@60fps in 3D) made availible on disk or true the cloud.

[remanutd55]

PS4 is coming baby!!!!! im ready to pre order it, buy it and play it.

[sdplisken]

day 1 rite here

[ALLWRONG]

Is Sony ditching the Cell?

[QuantumWake]

Most likely. While Cell proved itself later in the PS3's life cycle, it was just to cumbersome for developers. Sony obviously still want to deliver a powerhouse gaming console, but a lot more easier for developers to work with.

[Consoldtobots]

the use of AMD chips is dissappointing if true, at least at face value. Sony better have some genius juice ready to drop into the "base" chip like they did with the cell. Also for all the kids in here saying the cell sucks,failure,etc. just have NO IDEA what they are talking about. IT was and is a REVOLUTIONARY chip. Insomniac and Naughty Dog displayed some truly scary potential with the things they achieved in their development with the cell. This is where a visionary and not reactionary leader is needed. The cell IS a game changer, any chip worth it's game changing salt is ALWAYS gonna make weak developers cry like babies.

[tubers]

I think it's a good idea to give them a system that is easier to code with.. I don't think that hampers any talent.

[HappyTrigger]

Yeah but here's the thing with a developer like Naughty Dog, they are a first-party studio catered to developing strictly for the PS3. They have the budget and support to handle the architecture. The same cannot be said for multi-platform developers.

Some developers are really small and they cannot afford the R&D to invest in the PS3's complicated architecture. Some have a very strict deadline they must meet and if they're developing for both the 360 and PS3 it can, and will become stressful.

That is why The Witcher 2 never made it on the PS3 because CD Project RED didn't want to divide the programming team into developing for both platforms. It would have resulted in a very poor port.

Which is why it's in Sony's best interest to make the PS4 a lot easier to work with so multi-platform developers don't have to invest so much money and time into creating equal versions. I'm not saying the CELL was a failure (Naughty Dog obviously made great use of it), but it definitely made things too complicated.

[tubers]

The "1080p/60FPS/3D" goal is too vague. That can mean Doom 3 graphics @ said goal.

I firmly believe that a lot of developers will still use 720p with good AA @30fps because they would love to put other special effects, more textures or even better geometry (in the end a better looking game).

If that's kinda hard to understand think of a mid tier PC playing an game on ULTRA setting but at a lower resolution.. rather than playing at 1080p w/ lower effects like shadows and SSAOs.

This is not a bad thing IMO. I just ground my fantasies.

[Bladesfist]

1080p 3d 60fps with an A10 APU. LOL. Most computers need dual dedicated graphics cards to handle that.

[spinbot_lv1]

but a main GPU (if I'm not wrong should be a modified version of an HD 7970) chip separate from the APU seems to be quite obvious. However the A10 chips aren't that bad in terms of processing power. The A10-5700 (or some variant of it) has a 3.4GHz CPU and a 760MHz GPU with 384 cores (xbox360 main gpu actually has 48 cores at 500MHz )Put that into this perspective and you'll have a clear idea of how much ps4 could be powerful.

[Bladesfist]

I don't need to put that into perspective I am a pcgamer and have 4GHz x 8 cpu and a 1Ghz GPU and I cant do 1080p 3d @ 60fps on games like bf3.

[spinbot_lv1]

Ah ok I understand...stop reading at "I am a pcgamer....." You are right!

[PS4OUR]

It should be fairly obvious by now that the PS4 wont be housing an APU on its own as it will be nowhere near powerful enough to run AAA games at the graphic fidelity of say Watch Dogs or Star Wars 1313 and certainly not at 1080p (60fps).

8GB Ram is not overkill. These machines are going to evolve over time through updates and features and that 8GB Ram will come in handy when things like 3D and 4K displays become the norm.
People need to look further ahead. These machines are not going to get replaced after a year or so like mobile phones. They need the legs to be relevant tomorrow.

[spinbot_lv1]

The dev kits have “either 8Gb or 16Gb of RAM. Deduce from that what you will.”

This means that 8 gb of Vram is the version selled to customers and 16 gb (twice) of Vram is for the debug of the games.

[Bladesfist]

8 gigs of Video ram, you are crazy. Nvidias best dual gpu has 4gb. So you want 4 gpus in the ps4. Dream on.
BTW that dual GPU costs £729 each.

[spinbot_lv1]

why 4 gpus? Sure, 8gb can be split 4 for system memory and 4 for VRam. But memory and number of gpus aren't connected by the increase in power. however you are trying to compare high-and pc hardware vs customized hardware for consoles. this is mindless.

[TheKayle]

i think x720(8,next,loop etc etc) and ps4 will have both 4 gb ram...we r used to have 8/16/32/64 on our pc (i have 64 but i use 3dstudio max a lots) but this is needed coz we have on our pc a proper OS..that must be ready to run severals apps in the same time...u can have bf3 or any "heavy" game and photoshop with 3 browsers at the same time....(a nd still full os functions on ..and we all know windows need more than 4 to work properly )

the problem here is (ihmo) also if the apu will cut out the bottleneck between cpu and gpu (cell and rsx suffer of this prob a lots) the gpu inside that chip isnt fast enough to the "next gen" jump that we r expectng from the next console cycle

ok the ps4 should be more capable and FINALLY more easy to dev on....but sony with all the financial problems that they had...is now targeting (doing the right thing!) at some mid range jump ....i think after the rumors the r going aroudn from months we can forget a ps2/ps3 jump

i want add...some rumors from blogs and not serious websites was talking (making mistakes) about a sort of crossfire/sli mode for the orbis...but this is wrong...the rumors was about the x720 ....w

u can check it here

http://www.vg247.com/2012/0...

"Multiple sources have confirmed this morning that the machine will have two GPUs. One said: “It’s like two PCs taped together.”

We’re waiting for final confirmation of specs, but the graphics cards are thought to be equivalent to AMD’s 7000 series GPUs, but “not CrossFire or SLI”. The GPUs aren’t structured as they are in a normal dual PC set-up, in which the two chips take it in turns to draw lines of the same object: Xbox 720′s graphics units will be able to work independently, drawing separate items simultaneously."

while IF the ps4 will adopt a discrete gpu card..could have a sorf of "help" from the apu...but nothing similar to crossfire/sli mode.....

i think also u can forget everythin about 4k no one would be this stupid to push a tech that need a 10kk tv to run and with this specs around...u will not have just the power to hadle it

gaikai could be the way to have ps3 backward compatibilty on the ps4 with all the problem connect to that (server down/hacking attack/internet cap/slow connections) also if i think games in stremining r the future i dont think is still the time..... on the x720 rumors talk about the xenon on board for bc

new rumors talk about a sorf of android OS on the next ps4 that would fight again the windows 8 core of the next xbox OS............i hope for this coz....more we go ahead more the xbox taking over the poor "ps3 bar"

i think reading all the rumors around and all the "ppl inside the console market" the next powerhorse console will be the xbox...but we have time to see what happen

[TheKayle]

ah ps the rumors about two gpu on the x720

"The details have emerged in the wake of a hastily removed tweet from Sean Tracy, a technical designer for Crytek, that said he was attending the "Durango Summit" in London at the end of February. Durango is though to be the codename for the console."

[Robotronfiend]

I'd rather have projectors putting images on walls/ceiling/floor than have a 3D TV.

[zero_cool]

I'm pretty confident that the next generation playstation console's architectural design is borrowing heavily from the playstation 3 console's architectural design's key core strengths as the core foundation for the next generation playstation console.

Cheers Gamers & Happy Gaming!

[JAMurida]

I really liked what I saw about the UI improvements though. My main thing though is performance. A game can look pretty as ever but if it's constantly dropping to the 15-20 fps mark then it takes away from the experience as a whole. So if I could get a steady 30 fps on games, I would be happy.

As for being able to play PS3 games (and maybe PS2/PS1 games), I would say that's what Gaikai would be used for. But then the question comes up about why you would have to use the service when you already own the disc, so I don't know...

In the end, all we can do is wait and see.

[Ashunderfire86]

More than likely PS4 will be my first Next Gen console to pick next year. Gonna get the Wii U when it's heavy hitters like Metroid, Zelda, and Smash Bro 4 come out for example. Hope Sony announce PS4 soon so I can make up my mind next year.

[PS4OUR]

Many seem to forget that both the Xbox 8 and PS4 are going to be doing alot of multitasking and that requires more Ram.

Putting a AAA game on pause while seamlessly moving through the PS Store and even browsing will take use system resources and thats where the Ram comes in.

Xbox 8 is already said to be multitask focused.

These machines will no longer be doing just gaming. Those who preach 2Gb is enough is dillusional so its best all gamers accept that game consoles will no longer be just doing gaming. The focus will be on all forms of media as Sony and MS is pushing for that "one box does all" philosophy. And if one box wants to do all then it requires more juice and 2Gb and even 4Gb is not going to cut it.

[a08andan]

Well the "8 or 16GB" part doesn't mean anything. They need a lot of RAM for the development process for things like light-rendering.

[metroid32]

The WiiU already has displayed 1080p+2 480p images at 60fps in Trine2 DC yes it supports 2 gamepads and it has beter graphics than the pc version so thats 1080p and 960p basically on most future games ie Fifa ect the wiiu has a gpgpu a Modified E6760 so we know the stock version supports HD/3D and 6 display support big deal the wiiu has basically a Cpu and a Gpgpu so essentially 2 very powerful cpu's and a beastly gpu that supports compute shader11 and SM5.0 ect and a DX11 Comparable shaders i somehow dont think Nintendo are scared.

plus this statement is talking about dev kits so expect half the amount ie 4 and 8 gig just like wiiu has 4 gig for devs then it all gets scaled,plus devs have said the wiiu has limitless ram so i dont think it matters as the 360 hax twice the ps3 and the ps3 did fine so say the ps4 has 8 gig for devs and 4 gig for retail twice wiiu tgen expect no difference guys even at 16gig and 8gig with scaleling techniques it xoesnt matter as what wiiu has already is overkill look at the littered enviroments in ZombiU ?