DSOGaming writes: "John Carmack has just revealed in QuakeCon 2012 what we knew all this time. Remember when we were claiming in some of our articles that Doom 3 modded looked better than RAGE? Well, the man himself said that Doom 3 levels were more taxing than the ones of RAGE, especially due to the stencil shadows and its more complex lighting system"
businessinsider writes: "His exit came on Friday, the people said. Carmack, who has been openly critical of Meta's advancements in AR and VR, core to its metaverse ambitions, posted to the company's internal Workplace forum about his decision to leave."
I hope he starts up another new company and can get another new game engine on the market too.
He's apparently focusing on AGI, Artificial General Intelligence, AKA trying to get AI to be sentient. Which according to Ray Kurzweil could happen by 2029.
Then I need to look more into this because it sounds like the backbone tech I need to make Projekt Monika a reality.
AI advances are really starting to open my eyes to us not even having scratched the surface. But with the field itself growing exponentially and stuff I'd never considered before like putting AI to work finding cures for major diseases - it's exciting but also kinda scary tbh.
More on topic - sentient AI. Creating a digital soul so to speak. Spooky in a what have we done and is it good or bad kind of way.
He is like: "Im done with F#@#$%NG nonsense, pff Metaverse da funk I was thinking!!, Im out!! :D"
Yeah he put a smile in his face too in the end.
I hope he goes back to traditional games.
VR gaming is a flop and the Metaverse has (fortunately) completely failed to take off.
VR has much more potential than flat screen games. Just need to tap the right market and fund AAA development. Meta is a rotten company though so good to see him leave.
That's where it becomes a catch-22 problem though. Very few companies (if any) are going to spend AAA amounts of dollars on VR if the market isn't there - and the market isn't there.
If it was the future of gaming we'd see the big publishers getting involved - and basically none of them are.
Agree on Meta 100% - horrible company and I really do hope FB (and social media) dies some day soon.
There will never be AAA games until VR sells at the rate of mainstream consoles. Understand that even if Sony do sell 3.5 million VR in the next 2 or 3 years like they hope, that isn't ever going to get any commitments for AAA budget. No investor would ever sign off on that.
The adoption has been terrible and the market basically non-existent as a result of that.
We're now 10 years into PC VR gaming, 6 years into console VR gaming and it just hasn't taken off - the reality is, most consumers don't care for it.
Even with a huge install base like the PS4, only a few million adopted it, about 3-4%.
He only thinks it in his mind. Because Microsoft isn't offering "high fidelity VR." Only Sony is offering "high fidelity VR" because they actually deliver.
I just read today that Honda is moving forward in using VR and has vehicles that were built in VR without an actual real vehicle.
Orchard just doesn't know any better. He claims he's a PlayStation fan but doesn't want Sony to succeed in growing the VR market. But he's okay with Microsoft buying up the industry and game pass. Tell you where his mind is actually at. Or he has investment in it.
But Carmack leaving is only that he was frustrated with higher ups. But he's very interested in AI. And that's a good field of investment too.
If any of the big 3 had sales were like VR for their console, they would fold like the Saturn. Right now VR is nothing more then a high priced peripheral and no one should expect AAA for it.
By the way , I am one who would like to see VR succeed, but it has a long way to go before that ever happens.
@Apocalypse
"Only Sony is offering "high fidelity VR" because they actually deliver."
And the reality is, from what we've seen thus far, the vast majority, about 97% of Sony customers don't care about it in the slightest. They can't even sell out of PSVR2 devices, which are supposedly in short supply. Better to just invest in traditional experiences instead.
"I just read today that Honda is moving forward in using VR and has vehicles that were built in VR without an actual real vehicle."
Yes. And that helps gaming how? I've said time and time again that AR/VR is great for enterprise. Just not great for gaming.
The lack of customers, lack of customer interest, and lack of AAA game companies investing & AAA game experiences being crafted says everything we need to know about the state and future of gaming VR.
When uncle philly announced true vr experience and demoed fallout 4 in one x, some xboys sings different tune..
'Just not great for gaming.'.
That's your heavily biased opinion. You are in every VR thread trying to project your doom and gloom. Why?
There are many genres where VR is at least equal to or better than flat. VR in a driving game destroys the flat experience.
FPS, horror games, even Tetris is better in VR.
You speak about AAA as if it's the only consideration, moving goalposts.
Capcom.
Are they not a AAA publisher?
Is RE4 not a AAA game? RE7? RE8?
The Metaverse is one big flop but VR gaming on its own still has steam and growth potential. Remember Mark and his Meta wants you to associate gaming with the meta verse the gaming industry and its large number of users has the capacity to sway the opinion of the mass market.
Incidentally, Meta is haemorrhaging money and expertise that’s what this article is highlighting.
See, the problem orchard is that you see what you want to see. Sony sold PSVR at profit. They made money on software. They made money on a 10 year old peripheral. Yeah. It didn't sell 100 million. How many games sell bucket loads when they cost almost 10 times less than PSVR was at launch? That's why the new headset is coming. Before, there was no console VR. There is now. To grow the market, you must keep pushing and not be afraid like Microsoft. Facebook, HTC, ByteDance, Varjo, Valve, Sony, etc are growing the gaming market. Did flat gaming sell millions overnight? No. It took time. Just like any other product. Fads fade. VR is not a fad because it has potential in many areas. Sony doesn't want PS VR 2 to be a Kinect. A fad. Millions on advertising but no substance. It's why PS Move still exists and works on PS5. And Kinect is dead. Move had substance. PSVR had substance. Which is why PS VR 2 exists.
Honda is an example of VR entering other sectors. It's fairly obvious that it "ain't no 3D TV." Bugatti also uses VR as well as other car manufacturers. VR is here to stay. I know it hurts you that it's growing bedsides flat gaming being successful too. Just like mobile.
You just like to lie to yourself and others. VR is in education, in construction, in the automotive industry, medicine, real estate, music.... AND GAMING. The market wasn't there. Now it's here and it's growing in every sector besides gaming. But you want it to jump out there immediately like some viral video or fad. That's not how it works.
Chances are, you developed something, because you call yourself a developer. And no one wanted your product. So you're projecting.But there are other companies and developers who are successful in making VR work. You just sucked at it.
You claim Sony isn't selling out on pre-orders. But you don't even know what numbers they have allocated. Or how many they are producing to meet demand. You just pull it out from you know where and lie to everyone that Sony is failing. Sony has said they will have headsets for launch and not have to worry about production. What do you have that goes against Sony's statements on the matter? Absolutely nothing. Put up your facts against Sony's production lines?
But tell us. What software you made for VR that failed so that we all can know where your mindset is?
@Knush You just highlighted the problem perfectly - the only AAA taking part in console VR is Capcom. Where is COD VR? Battlefield VR, GTA VR? All the big pubs are skipping on it because they don’t believe in its future - if they did they’d be investing in it now.
@Apocalyspe At the time I thought MS were insane for not getting into VR, but looking back on it, given where we are now, that seems like a very smart decision.
Honda making VR for car showrooms or whatever means nothing for gaming. The vast majority of gamers - PS gamers included - don’t care in the slightest about VR. The numbers show that.
I’ve never worked on a VR game nor do I want to. The market being non-existent means salaries are substantially lower when compared to AAA salaries. I wouldn’t take the pay cut - I’ve been in AAA since graduating college, and I intend to keep it that way.
But that’s also the good point of being a developer, ultimately it doesn’t really matter to me if the game sells well or poorly - I still get paid the same at the end of the day.
It’s funny that you mention Kinect because I consider the Kinect a failure too - but it still had 4x the sales of PSVR and a way higher attach rate.
We are supposedly still in the tail end of a chip shortage, so clearly we would expect a new device like PSVR to sell out - Sony themselves were too or they wouldn’t have done invites to get one initially - they thought it was going to be difficult for people to get one (so did many on here) but when it turned out it wasn’t they opened it up to everyone.
Clearly it isn’t moving as many units as they’d anticipated.
Come talk to me when we’re all sitting in our living rooms with VR headsets on and the attach rate is so high they ship it in the box as the default controller method - so I guess I won’t ever be hearing from you again :p
@Orchard
'the only AAA taking part in console VR is Capcom'.
No, EA and Ubisoft have VR games on console.
https://www.ea.com/games/f1...
Problem with VR is that it hasn't have legs. Everything from mevement, enemies, pacing, puzzles has to take that into equation.
Replies(2)I agree with you. I remember when Second Life was as the dogs bollocks and big business had store fronts or ambassador land parcels but soon discovered that it was pie in the sky. Second Life is still operational but only frequented by a stagnant population of people who were with it since it’s launch. New people sign up to try it out but tend to not stay. People want to browse the internet or use it to play games not live in it.
"And yet, you can provide me no evidence to the contrary."
Compare sales of gen 1 VR headsets with sales of gen 1 home consoles.
One of if not, the best game engine developer in the world. I hope he gets back into developing game engines.
They need to stick VR back in RnD departments everywhere that or let the porn industry lead the way like everything else that's been introduced then brought to mass market after porn made it a thing lmfao
Yea VR has that virt-a-mate thing which seems to be quite popular with adult Quest 2 owners, but i mean there is Half Life Alyx, few other things.. nothing huge after those so far.
Legendary developer John Carmack reacted to the acquisition of Bethesda and ID Software's parent company ZeniMax Media by Microsoft:
"Great! I think Microsoft has been a good parent company for gaming IPs, and they don’t have a grudge against me, so maybe I will be able to re engage with some of my old titles."
John Carmack has always innovated game technology. Carmack having access to a Microsoft R&D budget can be very bad for the competition. Plus Jim Keller is out there too. Phil get on both of those task.
Yea, he's more interested in making gamer's head and hands move vigorously.
He left the VR world to focus on AI, actually. We need him now more than ever, in that case.
Because it doesn't entirely depend on him. He always had a good relationship with Microsoft (rare given his personality) so if he's given a good project, that'd be great news. I remember he was the first guy who pushed streaming assets directly from the HDD in games with Rage. Direct Storage/XVA guys would be happy to have him showing stuff off.
Geniuses often have issues dealing with people that don't have their vision. It can be hard to believe that things that are obvious to them aren't just as obvious to you. It's actually a compliment to you and shows that they don't see themselves as special. Unfortunately, their vision IS special.
Indeed. He actually foresaw what's going on now with consoles and SSDs and that was in 2009 (when he first shared his vision)
Give him a damn Quake game with awesome visuals. The fanbase will be glad.
This is so annoying that this much welcomed news comes AFTER Facebook deleted their VR for everyone not gullible enough to give away their whole privacy for pennies.
I would be so happy if this news happened a few months ago. Now I couldn't care less.
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Carmack lost my respect with the PC version of Rage. What a damn shame that was.
Thanks for imparting your wisdom on us John.... no kidding a PC is more powerful than current consoles, current consoles are 7+ yr old tech. Why don't you explain why id hasn't made a good game in 20 yrs, everything is graphics this, shadows that, how about a game thats fun to play?
@hiptanaka
the pc version of rage looked 5x better than any console game ever created/// It wasnt a benchmark for pc games like crysis 1 was back in 2007 or anything, but it makes uncharted 3 look last gen.
so I'm not sure what you mean, it ran at a perfect 60 frames for the entire game and other than the amd/ati users issues with texture loading, i dont really remember anything bad, then again, i buy nvidia always, amd/ati always have driver issues.
"Last but not least, Carmack admitted that PCs are superior to consoles, although there are still some headaches with drivers and such things on the PC platform."
That is all that needs to be said, of course its gonna look better on a PC, everyone SHOULD KNOW THAT!. But I can care less, I'll play on a console version w/o the headache of driver issues and hardware upgrades, its not like is a 8-bit looking game, RAGE still looked AWESOME on the consoles.
This article sounds a bit fanboyish and misleading/confusing. Is it only 30 FPS when in 3D mode or all the time? And does it really need to be re-stated that PCs are more powerful than consoles, that fact couldn't be more obvious.
Being more powerful doesn't necessarily mean superior though, some of the best games are only on consoles and some of the best games are only on PC. I'd prefer to have both as they both have benefits that the other lacks.