180°

Denis Dyack: Used Game Sales and Piracy Very Similar

GamingUnion.net writes, "Early last week London, Ontario hosted the DIG London video game developers conference, with developers such as renowned developer and Silicon Knights president, Denis Dyack. GamingUnion.net had the unique opportunity to take part in an on-stage interview with Dyack, focusing on his core values within the video game industry. However, before going on stage we caught up with Denis for an exclusive interview about other industry issues.

GamingUnion.net has prepared a two part interview for later today, and tomorrow, with Denis Dyack speaking on such issues as video game piracy, the injustice of used video game sales, and what digital distribution will do to the industry as we know it. Likely the most debatable issue discussed, used game sales, was a particularly interesting point of discussion."

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gamingunion.net
mephman5269d ago

It's perhaps a weird analogy to make, but it's actually quite true.

reintype5269d ago

But at least, we paid for it.

Publishers/Devs may not like it, but there are few games imo, that is worth its initial asking price.

Besides that, there are other reasons too. I for one, have a profound dislike for certain Publishers, thinking of them making a profit from me, does not sit too well, better the bloke or the Used gameshop imo.

Gamehead365269d ago

Maybe if every game didn't ask for $60 people wouldn't look towards used games as much. The only thing that stops me from buying used is the thought of supporting gamestop.

morganfell5269d ago (Edited 5269d ago )

Denis would know. He is an expert in ripping people off.

So what he is saying is that selling your used 2007 Dodge Charger that you bought new with your own money is the same thing as making a copy of a 2007 Dodge and selling it.

And the person that legally buys your used 2007 Dodge Charger is as guilty as a person that buys an illegally made duplicate of a 2007 Dodge Charger.

umair_s515269d ago

I think upon resale of a game a fixed percentage should be given to the developer. I have no idea how this system would be implemented. But its a good idea

morganfell5269d ago

I don't remember Rembrandt's family getting a percentage of the last resale of one of his paintings. The idea of such a system is absurd.

The best insurance against re-sales is for developers to make a great game. The number of pirated game copies produced in this world doesn't even begin to approach the number of legally produced pieces of crap trhat are shoved out the door and called retail games.

Besides, Dyack is becoming the king of whiners.,.about everything.

velcry5269d ago

For the thousandth time, when there is a healthy used-game market, first-hand buyers SPEND MORE because there is always the option of selling games if they end up tight for cash.

Take away the used-game market, and first-time buyers will realize that when they sink their money into games, they are essentially locking away that cash for good, and WILL SPEND LESS.

True, the used-game market undercuts developers, but to say that buying used-games is not much different from piracy?!? Give some credit to the people like me who make an effort to stay away from piracy, WHICH HELPS NEITHER THE DEVELOPER NOR FIRST-HAND BUYERS.

Geez.

IdleLeeSiuLung5269d ago

from a legal standpoint the latter is illegal while the former is legal.

Therefore I see no problem with the former and developers should encourage (as they already do) development of games that appeals longer.

evrfighter5269d ago

I agree used game sales and piracy are one and the same. Except there's a cash flow when it comes to used game sales.

Simple fix really. games should be locked to your profile like steam does it. Sure you can get around that and play single player still but games like MW2 would be useless should you buy it used.

sunil5269d ago

if used game sales is piracy, new game sales is day light robbery

raztad5269d ago

I strongly support (buy) used games. It's just a way to get the same game cheaper. I dont see the auto industry calling people "pirates" when buying a second/third hand car.

Illegal copies and used games arent definitely the same problem. An used game is just ONE used game on a single user hand, a downloaded game can be replicated at infinitum. If the game industry wants to sell more, they just need to lower the price. $50 (MAX) will boost sales for sure.

I find a bit interesting that Sony's full downloadable games for the PSP are even more expensive than regular retail games throught amazon. That doesn't make sense.

Sarcasm5269d ago

Too Human and Haze review scores quite similar.

LastDance5269d ago

I work in an Australian video game store. When we sell a new game - lets say COD MW2 for example - we will pay about $90Au for it and sell it for 109.95.

Pre owned games pay the bills. Any game dev complaining about preowned sales is nothing more than a coporate greed monger.

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Izzy123455269d ago

There's been piracy and game swapping since the beginning of the industry. I recall there was a local store that traded used for used back in the NES days and the industry has only grown since then.

The fact is that there are so many games now that there is no point in buying so many that you will play thru once and then leave on a shelf. Used games give those with tighter budgets the chance to play a title they may not ordinarily like and a chance for those who are disappointed in a title to get some money back.

Piracy is different no money exchanges hands and is detrimental to the industry and gamers who have to eat the losses. There is some lost revenue from used game sales but piracy is far worse.

I like Bioware as a dev they make great games but this sounds more like the whining of a greedy corporate suit rather than a game producer. Sure he has to make money but trashing the used game industry is not the way to go piracy is the problem.

jerethdagryphon5269d ago

i totally agree

being on said tight budjet rentals and buying used are a way to get games i might not play,

for reference i have a ps3 so im no game pirate,

and i buy games new if its one ive been lookingforward to ie uncharted..

with prices as they are few could buy many games a month.

FantasyStar5269d ago (Edited 5269d ago )

I'd think it's more than just cutting from used-games and disposable income. It's what each individual think a game is worth that'll decide whether they pay the initial price or wait for it to drop. The used-game market exists for a reason.

For example: a game like Uncharted 2 to me is not worth $60. Why? I will never ever play multiplayer component whatsoever, so why pay for things I will never used? I was able to pick up the game from Craigslist for $45 which I feel is more fair. Had retailers dropped the price, I would've picked it up new just the same.

And even more, developers have to strive to give us the best entertainment dollar if they want us to pay their prices. $60 is alot for a game you're going to play once and put away. Games need to have replay value on top of good gameplay and graphics. That would include offline MP, offline co-op. LAN support. Online co-op. How many players are supported. Believe it. When developers make great games that provide bang for the buck pricing, and content that overflows with entertainment. Developers and Publishers will profit regardless of piracy and used-games because most people will run out to buy it new anyways.

Piracy and used-games are mostly a problem when people feel a game isn't worth the asking price. I wish developers would stop overthinking the issue and playing the victim. Bang for buck pricing and huge replay value is the way to deterring piracy and used-game sales. Not DRM, and Episodic Content. They are fighting the system and are losing. They know it. Customers decide what they want and what the asking price is, not the developers or publishers.

If you're trying to break into the industry, set your prices low so people will give you a chance. If you're trying out a new idea, set your prices low so people will advertise for you. A game like Folklore is a genuine example of a fresh take on gameplay but fell short because of the $60 value and what was offered. I picked it up for $22 and couldn't be happier. I just wish games would debut at this price point. Makes impulsive purchases more likely. If I see a game that's out of my expectations and asks for more than I'm paying. I'm going to do research first before buying.

The only real victims out of this whole debate are the ones that paid $60 for a game they didn't like and cannot return it. This is why the used-game market exists for people to get some part of their investment back. This is why the used-game market will never go away.

Ravage275269d ago

as much as i agree with you...

"$60 is alot for a game you're going to play once and put away. Games need to have replay value on top of good gameplay and graphics. That would include offline MP, offline co-op. LAN support. Online co-op."

I think Uncharted2 offers most of that. Are you really going to play it only once? There are loads of unlockables and modifiers, i'm pretty sure the SP alone has good replay value - i must have played through UC1 at least 8 times, worth every cent

FantasyStar5269d ago

At the time back in October, I did feel that way. When MP is purely online-only. I'm discouraged from making the full purchase because I consider my purchases years from now when PS4 drops. Would Uncharted 2 servers still be up? And what about my own internet and such. I really did like Uncharted 2 and it's a top-tier game. When Borderlands came out, my Uncharted 2 life went away real quickly.

I got together with 3 other friends in my place and we LAN'd Borderlands in the backyard. I dunno, you got me rethinking about what I did now. Should I have paid full price then? Do I want to resell my used copy and get a new one to support ND? I did buy the first one at retail....

I think the penny-pincher in me would laugh at such thought.

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ChampIDC5269d ago

He's right from the perspective of a developer or publisher, as used games and piracy both net no money for them, but from a consumer's standpoint, used games are a legitimate purchase.

Revvin5269d ago

I imagine what really is frustrating to a developer is when large chains like GAME and Gamestation actively push used copies. 8 out of 10 times I've taken a new game to the counter to pay and they have asked if I'd prefer a used copy.

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130°

70 percent of devs unsure of live-service games sustainability

With so many games fighting for players' attention and interest losing out over time, time sink games are at risk of eventually losing steam.

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gamedeveloper.com
thorstein2d ago

It was worrisome to begin with.

It's a niche genre with only a handful of hits that can stand the test of time.

Cacabunga1d 6h ago

I like the sound of that!! I will for sure never support these gaas games.
Sony must be shocked at gamer's reaction, making them cancel a few of these and hopefully go back to the good heavy hitters they had us used to..
now bring on that PSPro reveal and show us some SP 1st party awesomeness.

CrimsonWing692d ago

What’s to be unsure of!? Look at the ratio of success to failure!

DarXyde1d 9h ago

It's pretty ridiculous.

Imagine having a breadth of data at your disposal to see the statistically low success rate of these games, only to be laser focused on the exceptional case studies.

shinoff21832d ago

Yes. Stop all the live service bs.

jznrpg2d ago

Only a few will catch on. You need a perfect storm to be successful in GaaS and a bit of luck on top of that. But a potential cash cow will keep them trying and some will go out of business because of it.

MIDGETonSTILTS172d ago

Helldivers 2 manages just fine…

Keep production costs low… don’t just make custscenes until the mechanics and enemies are perfected first.

Make so much content that you can drip extra content for years, and the game already feels complete without them.

Most importantly: make weapons, enemies, levels, and mechanics that will stand the test of 1000 hours. This might require more devs embracing procedurally generated leveled, which I think separates Helldivers 2 from Destiny’s repetitiveness.

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60°

The Battle Pass Is The Worst Thing To Happen To Modern Gaming

Nameer from eXputer: "Some exceptions aside, I don't think the battle pass is a net positive for gaming with how they're implemented in most live service titles."

got_dam2d ago

Battle passes AND meta gaming both.

DivineHand1252d ago (Edited 2d ago )

I like the way Helldivers 2 does battle passes. It allows you to make purchases on each level of the battle pass and gives you the option of choosing which item to unlock first. The more purchases you make using medals the further you progress. There is no timer and you can earn medals towards purchasing stuff via personal orders and Major orders.

I haven't played much live service games that have battle passes but I remember some games that have battle passes where you progress through it linearly using an exp system. What makes it really bad is that the battle pass will have like 50 or more levels with the cooler stuff being closer to the end. They also have an in-game shop that sells exp boosters so you can reach the end of the pass before it refreshes. Everyone ilse will have to grind their way through.

lucian2292d ago

battle pass in fortnite is perfect; buy one and it buys the rest for every other season as it gives you more money than the first cost. so 8.50 and season ends with you getting 13.00, it pays for the next and you have some pocket change to save up for cash shop. All of which is optional

470°

PS5 Pro specs leak video taken down by Sony

Sony is taking actions as video by Moore’s Law is Dead, has been issued with a copyright claim.

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videogameschronicle.com
andy852d ago

And people say it's all fake because Sony haven't said anything 😂 conveniently forget the PS4 Pro was only announced 2 months before release.

BeHunted2d ago

It's fake. There's no factual evidence other than his own made up specs.

Hereandthere2d ago

What were the specks Sony was afraid of showing?

Shikoku2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

Digital foundry put a video out saying what he leaked was exactly what they also knew about the PS5 PRO. So no it's not just stuff he made up

Babadook72d ago (Edited 2d ago )

If it’s fake what copyright does MLID infringe upon?

😂

andy852d ago

Aye because they'd go to the effort of copyright claiming it if it didn't exist 🙃😂 you'd have to be a special kind to be thinking its not a thing by now

Cacabunga2d ago

They need to reveal it with uncharted killzone or a heavy hitter like this

Ironmike2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

U mean the specs that we'll established digital foundry which said these are the actual specs published a video on 2 weeks ago I mean they are only one of most trusted sites for tech information but they just made up a video for the sake of it

Christopher2d ago

I would love for it all to be fake, but lots of people are saying they've seen/heard the same thing. But, man, we 100% don't need mid-gen upgrades when we're failing hard to optimize current hardware.

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Seraphim1d 23h ago (Edited 1d 23h ago )

if I recall Sony lowered sales expectations for PS5 earlier this year. if that is the case we won't hear anything about a Pro until next year or shortly before/when it's dropping. After all, if the Pro was dropping this year/fiscal year they wouldn't have lowered expectations.

As for squashing rumors. Yeah, shit like this prevents potential buyers from adopting now, just like slim rumors in the past. It only makes sense to keep things under wraps from a business perspective. Despite living in a technological age of unfettered access to information we don't need to know whats going on behind closed doors be that at Sony, Nintendo, MS, or amongst any development studios. When the steak is done we shall feast.

JackBNimble1d 22h ago

By the time games are actually made to take advantage of the pro spec's the ps6 will be released or close to it.

jznrpg2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

Just announce it already! I want to preorder one asap. But in reality they don’t want to lessen PS5 sales until Pro is ready to launch so I understand the business part of it. September is probably when they announce it with an early November launch like the PS4 Pro

Ironmike2d ago

Pro won't lessen sales sames ps4 pro never and the ps4 pro was more relevant at the time cos move to 4k this not needed

RaidenBlack2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

Yea, my brother got his PS4 (coz of a good deal) after the PS4 Pro's release.

darthv722d ago

^^same here. I got a base 4 for only $100 off a guy who bought the Pro. then a few months later I found a guy on craigslist selling a pro for $100 because it was left behind by his former roommate who moved out. That was the beginning of my obsession to buy up the different variants of the PS4 that were released.

As of now I am really only missing the 500m one and the gold slim but otherwise I have pretty much all the other retail ones. https://consolevariations.c...

crazyCoconuts2d ago

Anyone with 4K that appreciates 60fps is gonna disagree about it not being needed.
DLSS is a god send for Nvidia, and there's been nothing like it for AMD...yet ...

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DeadlyFire2d ago

They will announce it around E3 timeframe about May-June whenever they do a showcase for the year.

neutralgamer19922d ago

Just announce it this thing will sell well

Ironmike2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

I don't think it will pll still haven't seen the potential of ps5 yet

Cacabunga2d ago

agreed, but it might sell if they announce some 1st party games to lead the way. if people see the difference with the base version they can move on. for my sake I am still gaming mainly on PS4 (still not finished with RDR2 due to lack of gaming time). I have a huge backlog on PS5 I am hoping to get into.

mark3214uk2d ago

why? game makers havnt even come close to maxing out current spec yet, were getting al lthese new TFlops and game maker are making crappy remakes not worthy of the ps3

Minute Man 7212d ago

The guts of the 5 and X are 5 years old

fr0sty2d ago

People keep saying that, yet we still have games running at near HD resolutions, 30fps, and ray tracing features turned off.

PRIMORDUS2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

I would take that video and upload a torrent of it, fuck that copyright bullshit. If your going to do something that has a chance of being taken down, make a torrent first share it. Then Sony or any other company is helpless and you can laugh in their faces, taunting them to try to take it down 🤣

LoveSpuds2d ago

With kind of analysis and advice, you could be a lawyer for Trump!🤣

tronyx122d ago

As much as the PS4 Pro didn't represent a major % in the playerbase, announcing a 'better' model will hinder sales from the 'base' model. They are right, business-wise.

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