How The Crew was ported to PlayStation 4

Ubisoft Reflections rounded off day two of last week's Develop conference with an intriguing talk, tantalisingly entitled "Tips and Tricks for Porting to Next-Gen". For Digital Foundry, it was a must-see presentation primarily because the vast majority - and perhaps even all - of the multi-platform games we'll be playing on Xbox One and PlayStation 4 by the end of the year have been derived from PC code, necessitating some level of porting across to the new hardware.

[majiebeast]

"The Crew across to PlayStation 4 was accomplished in six months with a team of just two to three people working on it."

Wow with only 2 or 3 people. In Cerny we trust.

Just for reference
PS1 1-2months
PS2 2-6 months
PS3 6-12 months(a lot more people working on the port)

[ShugaCane]

How about we trust in those two or three people first..

[Enemy]

That is insane. Cerny is a MAD architect.

[Majin-vegeta]

Indeed he is.
http://i.imgur.com/vwkoWUn....

[slapedurmomsace]

@ majin...look at people disagree cause ya made a joke about Cerny..come on people, it was funny

[black0o]

dev are talking freely about the ps4 meanwhile any Q about x1 one answer "clouds"

[mark134uk]

i think ms live in the clouds thats the problem :)

[shoddy]

Powa of teh cloud is so advance that you need to be a rocket scientist to understand.

That's why they don't bother explain it.

[Insomnia_84]

lol so true! +1

[husomc]

it's a water cooler :D

[Ozmoses]

how come the footage is from an Xbox???

video mark 1:18... when the screen splits to different windows.. you can clearly see it say B- Quit, A - Ok and at the top in the right it says LT/RT and RB/LB

I'm all in for Sony and PS4...

and I'm not trying to start anything, but this video footage of the crew is not from a Playstation console

[bsquwhere]

To be fair it could be on a PC with an Xbox controller.

[showtimefolks]

It's amazing how Cenry wanted the port time on ps4 like it was on ps1. Damn

Now could someone say why we shouldn't expect GTA5 and GT6 in q1 2014? Imagine if actually team of 50-100 people actually worked on port could it be even less than a month?

Also I believe Sony will surprise us by announcing TLOU on PS4 at gamescom or TGS

For me personally I also want beyond 2 souls on PS4 too

[Kevin ButIer]

Long live the three musketeer...

Cerny
Yoshi
Andy

[slimeybrainboy]

Well, that made no sense. I need to study.

[sigfredod]

"The PS4's GPU is very programmable. There's a lot of power in there that we're just not using yet. So what we want to do are some PS4-specific things for our rendering but within reason - it's a cross-platform game so we can't do too much that's PS4-specific," he reveals.
So much power not used yet sweet!!

[Minato-Namikaze]

Did he just confirm the the XB1 is gonna cause the game not to be made at full potential?

[sigfredod]

probably the studio is aiming for plataform parity, sadly

[Enemy]

Actually that's always going to be the case for multiplatform games. One can't look too much better than the other, even if they want to. It's all compromise.

It's why PS3 exclusives absolutely destroyed the competition this gen. Compare them side by side and even a half-blind person could tell the difference.

[Jaqen_Hghar]

PS4 version could have a stable framerate or even higher at least. That's not adding any features just showing the spare power for what they built. A man values framerate over resolution (within reason) anyway so he will take PS4 being more stable on multiplat games as a result of not being pushed as much as X1.

[Benchm4rk]

No he didn't. Read the second paragraph after that and it explains more about the 2 versions and how porting will be different in the new gen than the 360/ps3 gen

[Lboogieskells]

indeed

[_FantasmA_]

See! This is why I'm against having 2 main consoles. Competition is great, except in the gaming world. If we had the PS4 and the PS4 only, it would be like the PS2 days all over again. Imagine all Ubisoft, Activision, 2K,etc all taking the extra time to really push the PS4. I think we'd actually see innovation this way instead of holding out on stuff so that Xboner can catch up

[ZodTheRipper]

Well said. Microsoft isn't contributing to this industry enough to get so much support from third parties imo. Nintendo at least goes it's own way and brings enough first party support to make third parties almost dispensable.

[sAVAge_bEaST]

^^^
Agreed, Micro$oft is a cancerous tumor to the industry, and needs to be cut off.. Ps4, and Nintendo would be great,. Each doing their own thing,.. The whole industry has started to stagnate, and go down hill, ever since M$ came on to the scene.

[elhebbo16]

But wasn't it the same think back then since the PS2 was holding back GC and og Xbox ports? imo lets just wait for the first-party games to do the talking, I'm excited to see what ND and MM have behind the curtains for the PS4.

[H0RSE]

And now you can see why PC gamers have been getting shafted for years now with multiplat games, and why PC gamers are so angry about it - You have superior hardware that is not used to it's full potential, due to the industry having to use the "lowest common denominator" and system parity as a guideline.

Of course, PC games tend to have higher graphics options, I am more referring to the lack of content or the scope of games in general.

[RavageX]

You know, I kinda miss the old days when multiplat games WERE different.

SNES games were generally better looking the the Genesis, but you did have quite a few sega gems that were better than the SNES version.

[sAVAge_bEaST]

Mortal Kombat,. Genesis had Blood, Snes had better graphics,. result- tie. (I had it for both systems. -just one example out of many.) {Jungle & Desert Strike -another example}

[KwietStorm_BLM]

I miss that too. And the third party studios are selling games regardless, so who cares if one platform looks decidedly better than the other. They don't have obligations to the platform holders' situations, so just take advantage of what's in front of you.

[ABizzel1]

A B A C A B B = BLOOD :)

[Tatsuya]

Sexy ass graphics, hopefully the finish game will look something like this or even better :)

http://images2.wikia.nocook...

[sourav93]

As much as I'd hope it did, I doubt it, since the E3 gameplay wasn't even close to that screenshot. But we can always dream. The CGI trailer was the bomb though!

[husomc]

we can hope but i very much doubt it'd be even close. the gameplay video seemed pretty average. the innovative feature touted being the playing as connected teams

[OldGirl]

Where are all the people who said Mark Cerny was lying now, about how easily PC games can be ported to PS4 in a matter of months. I think if 2-3 people can do it in 6 months that just about validates his claims.

Seeing as the developers of Warframe another small team did it in 3 months.. You really need more proof he is not making this stuff up just for PR?

[AnteCash]

Well xbox 1 lead architect says .........erm ...... whost the lead architect on xbone again?

[pyramidshead]

I doubt any one person wants to own up to making that.. lol

[nosferatuzodd]

lol good one

[husomc]

the xbox guy's been smoking weed and staring at the clouds

[Destrania]

PS4 is beast

[Talamak]

This was a really interesting read...it seems that the PS4 has lot of tools that give you what you want without many compromises, its just written in different code...also the dev environment seems mature and easy to access....multi-plat games should run better than on the PS3 during it's initial launch

[Roper316]

" it's a cross-platform game so we can't do too much that's PS4-specific," he reveals."

That is why 1st party games trounce 3rd party games in quality because they don't cater to the lowest common denominator and they try to push the system as far as it can be.

[ZodTheRipper]

Luckily, Sony has the strongest first party studios in the industry :)
Can't wait to see what Naughty Dog, Santa Monica and Media Molecule can achieve on PS4.

[Jaqen_Hghar]

Most of man's PS3 games are first party (other than PS+ downloads) he just loves the work they do compared to third party companies. Not to say 3rd party doesn't have gems (a man is looking forward to getting GTA5, Watch Dogs, and BF4 this Fall alone) but first party games from Sony get revisited by a man more than any 3rd party game apart from Arkham.

[husomc]

but 3rd parties like ubisoft have nearly unlimited budgets so they can get their games up to par just by throwing more money at the problem

[GribbleGrunger]

"The PS4's GPU is very programmable. There's a lot of power in there that we're just not using yet. So what we want to do are some PS4-specific things for our rendering but within reason - it's a cross-platform game so we can't do too much that's PS4-specific,"

That's the bit you need to worry about folks. It made me shudder.

It's time for a mandate, Sony.

[noctis_lumia]

it's a cross-platform game so we can't do too much that's PS4-specific,"

thats what i am worry about...
i dont wont yet again for a generation MS saying ports must be exact...even if the ps4 is x2 more powerful

[GribbleGrunger]

They just openly admitted that they're going to downgrade the game to stay in line with the X1. Clearly they're not talking about the Wiiu here. That policy looks like it's still in place I'm afraid. Holding tech back for the sake of parity isn't a good sign for next gen from 3rd party developers. Having said that, it still looks fantastic though. :)

[starchild]

No, they didn't. They simply said that they are going to add some things, but only within reason.

It's the same thing that happens on PC. We get better versions for sure, but it's not like they spend the time to create a vastly different game for us even though our hardware is several times more powerful than the consoles.

There is no policy to downgrade PS3 or PS4 games. The PS3 was difficult to work with and actually had a slightly weaker GPU and less available RAM than the 360...THAT is the reason multiplats sometimes suffered on the PS3, not because developers held back the PS3 versions. Don't be silly.

[n4rc]

Optimistic a tad aren't we?

He said they can't do too many ps4 specific things.. They also can't do too many Xbox specific things.. Absolutely nothing about that says the game is held back due to Xbox.. But I expect nothing g less from this site

[husomc]

just wait for the 20 odd ps4 exclusives

[jobboy]

10 fps?? wtf!

[AbortMission]

If this is actually true... then I hope that this will lead to more multiplats coming to the PS4 far more frequently. I'm honestly ecstatic to try out all this new racers!

[noctis_lumia]

the reasons why ps4 will outsell worldwide the xbox

1.1st party studios
2.indie Games
3.Mark Cerny
4.nuff said

[NioRide]

Any word on the actual square miles of this game? I'm playing fuel right now and I know its over 5,500 square miles.

[Corpser]

What's revealed here is interesting, PS4's CPUs can only use 20GB/s of bandwidth , not the full 176 GB/s GPU can use, they're actually 2 separate buses

[TheObserver]

Have been known for a while now. And it is an advantage, not a negative.

http://www.gamasutra.com/vi...

According to Cerny, PS4 addresses the hiccups that can come from the communication between CPU, GPU, and RAM in a traditional PC. "A typical PC GPU has two buses," Cerny told Gamasutra in a very detailed technical write-up. "There's a bus the GPU uses to access VRAM, and there is a second bus that goes over the PCI Express that the GPU uses to access system memory. But whichever bus is used, the internal caches of the GPU become a significant barrier to CPU/GPU communication--any time the GPU wants to read information the CPU wrote, or the GPU wants to write information so that the CPU can see it, time-consuming flushes of the GPU internal caches are required."

PS4 addresses these concerns by adding another bus to the GPU "that allows it to read directly from system memory or write directly to system memory, bypassing its own L1 and L2 caches." The end result is that it removes synchronization issues between the CPU and GPU. "We can pass almost 20 gigabytes a second down that bus," Cerny said, pointing out that it's "larger than the PCIe on most PCs!"

What that means in term of DBZ power level terms? Instant transmission for GPU and CPU to the GDDR5. They both have their own "doorway" so to speak. GDDR5 latency irrelevant.

[Corpser]

That doesn't change what I said. So now we know PS4 CPU has DDR3-like bandwidth of 20 GB/s, only GPU can use the full GDDR5 bandwidth of 176GB/s. that's actually just like a PC setup.

[JP1369]

" But whichever bus is used, the internal caches of the GPU become a significant barrier to CPU/GPU communication--any time the GPU wants to read information the CPU wrote, or the GPU wants to write information so that the CPU can see it, time-consuming flushes of the GPU internal caches are required."

PS4 addresses these concerns by adding another bus to the GPU "that allows it to read directly from system memory or write directly to system memory, bypassing its own L1 and L2 caches." The end result is that it removes synchronization issues between the CPU and GPU. "We can pass almost 20 gigabytes a second down that bus," Cerny said, pointing out that it's "larger than the PCIe on most PCs!"

Corpser - Read the two paragraphs above and then tell me how it's like a PC setup. (Hint: the quoted material specifically states how it isn't)

[annus]

@JP1369

Stop reading what you want to read. He CLEARLY states "We can pass almost 20 gigabytes a second down that bus,".

All he is saying is that it has a secondary bus that allows communication directly between the two, instead of going through the middle man. That speeds it up, but it still can't travel at the full speed of GDDR5 due to bottle necking of the bus, so it is still similar to a PC in that it can only use the amount of speed similar to that of DDR3, and the GPU can still theoretically use the full speed of GDDR5. What isn't there to understand?

[JP1369]

Anus-
The bandwidth assigned to each pipeline being similar doesn't mean that the architecture is the same. The difference between this and PC architecture is the fact that both the CPU and GPU can use the same data sets stored in the ram instead of copying from one allocation to the other.

[Akuma2K]

The DBZ comment is funny as hell....lol

[Ju]

This was known, wasn't it? Well, 20GB/s is a bit on the slow side, but a cpu is dead in the water moving data around anyway. Ever tried to switch off caches in a PC? No matter how fast your RAM is, it'll not gonna work reading/writing without caches on. "Slow" is relative. It's still as fast as it is in e.g. the PS3 (or most PCs these days) and what it basically means "your PCIe" runs at the full speed of your memory. Quite usable in a "non-cacheable" configuration (this is pure non-cacheable bandwidth). The main purpose is communication between CPU & GPU - not "sharing" data. That's what you have shared memory for. You can share addresses and hand data over. You can allow a shared memory buffer (e.g. command buffers) and make them as big as you like.

The CPU can also do "cache snooping" in the CPUs cache area to allow for cache coherency. But this would generate overhead in such a configuration because if a CPU writes to an address through it's caches where the GPU is "listening" to (snooping) it will force the memory controller to flush caches to make sure those data end up in the proper location in memory and in return the GPU must load those again.

The direct bus cuts this short and does not (!) require a cache flush - which means, it has no impact on general purpose code - a cache flush does! It is basically a 20GB/s buffered CPU-GPU interconnect.

[sephiroth420]

ITS OVER 9000!!!

[Thunderhawkxbox]

Another crappy article made up by Sony fans

[Sephiroushin]

Another crappy comment made up by Thunderhawkxbox

[thereapersson]

How does blunderhawkxb0x have more than one bubble?

[nosferatuzodd]

wow a game developer speaking and hes a Sony fan whats wrong with xbox fans every time Microsoft screws up is Sony fault wow talk about bias

[spektical]

honestly, this game looks boring. Sure it'll be fun the first several times. but what then? its not really a racer.. and you just have so many missions driving cars and bashing them against each other.. its like twisted metal with no guns.

idk, need to see more.

[Dubfella]

I hope the driving mechanics in this will be like how it's gonna be in GTA V!

[Akuma2K]

With the porting time frame much lower on the PS4, the game library is gonna fill up even quicker than the PS1 and PS2 game libraries did.....good job on sony's part for learning from their mistakes with the PS3 in every way possible.

Greatness awaits....

[zainkool]

this racing game just blew me away. wow so seamless and biggest map I ever seen in a game. GTA u slacking on map size.

[EPiCDiNGO]

Hopefully developers use the extra power the Playstation 4 has over the XBone and multi plats are superior on the ps4. It would not be nice if the Xbox games was ported to the PS4 like current gen.

[Thunderhawkxbox]

Extra power my ass Sony fan boys do make me laugh everyday I couldn't live without them they do make me laugh . I bet u r one of those 13 years old Sony fans do trash talking lots

[EPiCDiNGO]

You are the one insulting me yet you are the one calling me a 13 year old trash talker? It is clear from all the stats from everyone including Microsoft that the ps4 has more power than the XBone. It seems that the facts have upset you and I can only hope that you stop being a bitter fanboy. I will be buying the PS4 and the XBone on release date just like I own a ps3 and Xbox 360 one now. For this current generation I buy multiplat games on Xbox 360 as I know games developers port the games from Xbox to the ps3 and the ps3 ports suffer because of this. I would say yes I am a fanboy but not a fanboy of Sony or Microsoft I am a fan of good games no matter what console they are released on. And if the PS4 can make the games look and play better than the XBone then that is what I want.

[thereapersson]

A delusional troll... the worst kind.