Team Ninja was shocked by reaction to Ninja Gaiden III

While speaking with Gamasutra, director Yohei Shimbori said that "everybody at the studio was pretty shocked. It really made us take another look at the game and why that reaction was there. One of the things that I learned was the power of having a series behind you, and what it means to be part of a series. There are existing fans out there, and you have to think about the people who have supported the series for so long, and you want to make sure that the game that you make appeals to them first, and satisfies those fans first.”

[NastyLeftHook0]

that's because it was terrible.

[Knight_Crawler]

Capcom please take notes...I grew up on Resident Evil and it saddens me to see what has become of my beloved franchise. You dont screw over your true fanbase who have supported you for years and give them the middle finger just so you can make some quick money from the shooter fever that has infested this gen - sure the shooter junkies will buy your game but as soon as the next fresh shooters comes out they will move on, the true fans will always buy your games and support you as long as you give them what they want.

Respect to Team Ninja for the below statement, now go and send Tomonobu Itagaki a Facebook friend request and get him back onboard :)

""everybody at the studio was pretty shocked. It really made us take another look at the game and why that reaction was there. One of the things that I learned was the power of having a series behind you, and what it means to be part of a series. There are existing fans out there, and you have to think about the people who have supported the series for so long, and you want to make sure that the game that you make appeals to them first, and satisfies those fans first.”

[cleft5]

Lets see how good Devil's Third, Tomonobu Itagaki's game, is before we start acting as if he was the driving force behind Team Ninja. I am sure that guy was good at managing people and taking credit for others work, sort of like David Jaffe, but lets see what his game does before we start thinking he was what made Team Ninja great.

I think that once they fired Itagaki the current lead of Team Ninja threw away all of Itagaki's idea in flavor of doing things his way. In doing that he got rid of the good and bad that went along with Itagaki's ideas and that was his mistake. It sounds like they understand now what they need to do and while Ninja Gaiden 3 was bad for ps3/360 I am very interested to see how the revamped Ninja Gaiden 3 for WiiU plays. It seems like they went back to what was great about the Ninja Gaiden games for the WiiU. So lets give them one more chance, these guys became full of themselves and got smacked down for it. So lets see what a Team Ninja that has to prove something can do.

[geddesmond]

True Capcom do need to listen to the fans who grew up with them however all Capcom listens to is the money and if RE6 doesn't flop then they'll never listen to fans. Thats why I won't be supporting Capcom until they finally do listen. Which is probably never.

My reason for not getting NG3 was the lack of weapons and how they no longer level up like in NG2. You can't make NG2 and have 8 or so different weapons to use and then scale back to 1 weapon for your next game in the series. Ah well glad Team Ninja learned their lesson.

[Yi-Long]

... that all the signs were already there that this was going to be bad.

And Team Ninja was too arrogant, and decided to ignore the warning signs.

They've been crap since Itagaki left the studio.

[Slapshot82]

They did, it's called Resident Evil: Revelations on 3DS. ;)

[maelstromb]

"There are existing fans out there, and you have to think about the people who have supported the series for so long, and you want to make sure that the game that you make appeals to them first, and satisfies those fans first.”

Umm... did these people just start developing games yesterday?? That should the FIRST thing a developer considers -- ALWAYS! It's like Ferrari all of a sudden deciding they're going to build an economy vehicle with the hope that upon release, it will catch the attention of Ferrari enthusiasts. In the end, they'd just end up insulting their customers and their tastes, which is exactly what happened in this case. However, I do applaud them for stepping up and being open and honest, despite the fact that it won't fix the mess that is Ninja Gaiden III.

[wishingW3L]

@cleft5 Itagaki created Dead or Alive and he rebooted the Ninja Gaiden franchise. He directed, designed and bet his career on saving Tecmo from bankruptcy with those games and he did it!

Right now Tecmo still exists all thanks to him and his games. And when Itagaki left many key people from Team Ninja left the company too and are now working with him on Valhalla Game Studios. The importance of Itagaki to Team Ninja can't be debated, specially after making 2 successful IPs. -_-

[knowyourstuff]

Don't you love it when an incompetent dev team can't figure out why everyone hates their shitty game? Like when Atari couldn't figure out why everyone hated the disaster that was Alone in the Dark, or why the people who made the disaster that was Kane and Lynch couldn't figure out what all the fuss was about, what with the glitchy crappy game design.... I face palm every time stuff like this from devs.

Play-test your games and this won't happen!

[Andreas-Sword]

I think, "Ninja Gaiden 4" and "YAIBA: Ninja Gaiden Z" will be great games!

[otherZinc]

I Agree Completely!

Just like a company, thinking they know every damn thing.

Tecmo should Fire the idiots that fired Tomonobu!
Then fire this idiot that think the problem is brests.
Then bring Tomonobu BACK!

Ive beaten Ninja Gaiden several times
Beat Ninja Gaiden Black a few times
Beat Ninja Gaiden 2 a few times

Ninja Gaiden 3 is a horrendous game!
Why:
F***ed-up QTE's
Terrible animations
1 weapon!

I'll never buy anything from Tecmo or Team Ninja ever again! POS Company!

[a_bro]

not to mention, the lack of gore, a staple of the ninja gaiden series.

[lex-1020]

And how easy the game was

[Th3 Chr0nic]

@otherZinc
Tomonobu was not fired.
On June 2, 2008, just before the release of Ninja Gaiden II for the Xbox 360, Itagaki announced that he was resigning from Tecmo and was suing the company for withholding a bonus promised for his previous works. He was also suing Tecmo's president Yoshimi Yasuda for damages based on "unreasonable and disingenuous statements" made in front of Itagaki's colleagues.[14] In an interview with 1up.com, Itagaki has revealed that he is working on a project with former members of Team Ninja under a new studio, Valhalla Game Studios.[15] The title in question, Devil's Third, was revealed shortly before E3 2010.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

[turgore]

Itagaki was not fired, but the company was stupid for letting their # 1 employee leave. Thats like Nintendo not paying Miyamoto and letting him leave. Crazy.

[ziggurcat]

i haven't played the game, but i remember watching a video of them demoing the multiplayer and it was god awful... unless i'm getting confused with another ninja gaiden game?

[t0mmyb0y]

Just Tuurrible

[princejb134]

After buying ninja garden sigma 1 and 2 on ps3
I skipped this one
The demo was terrible
Big ninja garden fan because of its difficulty but 3 was nerfed so bad

[Th3 Chr0nic]

@cleft5 HE WASNT FIRED read his damn wiki page and gain simple knowledge. he quit and sued them for back bonus pay derpalerpa

[BinaryMind]

The fact that they were shocked AFTER it was released tells me they really had no clue what they are doing with the series. RIP Ninja Gaiden (though at least Yaiba looks good)

[ChrisW]

The whole game screamed "Our Japanese publisher made us do this!" which is sadly the same for many Japanese games these days. If Japanese developers were able to do what they wanted, we wouldn't have such horrible games.

[DeletedAcc]

Awful game

[NYC_Gamer]

NG3 was just garbage.Team Ninja stripped away everything that fans enjoyed about the franchise.

[rbailey]

The original creator of the series wasn't even involved in this game. What did people expect would happen? SMH

[Blacklash93]

Do you mean Itagaki? The guy who made the Dead or Alive Volleyball/Vacation games that touted ridiculous breast physics and overdone fanservice a key element in the game? The guy who created the mess of cheap AI and awful level design that is Ninja Gaiden 2, his "swan song" before leaving TN?

Yeah I don't miss him.

[Rush]

Protip, not every game that comes out of Japan has to be aimed towards a western audience.

If you don't like "fanservice" games don't play them. I haven't even played the game because I knew it wasn't for me simply by looking at the box art.

Honestly if you bought that game expecting an in-depth volleyball simulator, it says a lot more about you than the game.

[Frankfurt]

You have NO idea what you're talking about. Go read up on what happened - there are extensive reports on the whole thing including court info.

Tecmo's president DARED Itagaki to quit Tecmo during NG2's production. Itagaki held on until the game was playable enough then left. He said himself he wanted the game to be a lot further along, but having an asshole President that owes your whole team money REFUSE TO PAY YOU and even DARE YOU TO QUIT is just too much.

And YET, NG2 is still a better game than Sigma 2 and NG3 (and every other action game this gen not called "DMC 4" or "Bayonetta").

[Blacklash93]

A game that prides and basically sells itself off fanservice is not what should be called a good game in any culture. It wasn't even good for what is was.

And my point being that NG2 was awful compared to the original. I don't care how PO'd Itagaki was at Tecmo (which I am aware of), he made a bad product and disappointed many fans. The camera was still awful, the level design was frustrating and occassionally deceptive, and the incredibly cheap spamming AI that ruined the combat. NG3 was worse, obviously, but I expected a lot more from a new NG game under him.

He may have been a good designer at heart, but his last few games weren't showing it. I'm probably just bitter about it.

[aviator189]

The previous Dead or Alive game was under his control and that game was pretty darn awesome.

[DARK WITNESS]

@ Frankfurt

Thank You...

I was saying it at the time that NG2 felt a bit rushed and just didn't quite feel right looking at the time frame between the announcement and when it launched.

I still thought NG1 was better. You could tell something had not gone quite right with the game.

[Godchild1020]

So, they decided to do a better job, but only bring the better version to the Wii U? I don't understand how that is taking in consumer/fan feedback.

I understand the Original creator wasn't working on NG3, and he trusted his team and that's why it ended up the way it did on the PS3 and 360.

[NYC_Gamer]

360/PS3 owners should get some type of free dlc with the so called proper changes

[guitarded77]

Okay, I have some questions as I never played NG3.

1. What was it that made it so horrible? Was it technical issues, story, level design, gameplay, etc?

2. What is the Wii U getting besides bonus content? Is it enough to make the game good? Would the bonus content being added to the PS3/XBOX versions make the game good?

These are sincere questions since both of you seem to have experience with the game. I was debating getting it at some point when it hits about $20 || <

[NYC_Gamer]

@guitarded77

Have you played NG1?all of the gameplay and challenge has been toned down in NG3....Bull shit ass QTE moments.Can't even dismember enemies.You can't lose buying the game for $20 bucks though.

[FunAndGun]

I agree with guitarded, I want to know the answers.

[callahan09]

Well I'd assume it's because Nintendo is paying for the upgrade, considering the Wii U version is a Nintendo-published title.

[wishingW3L]

NG3 is easily one of the worst games I have played this generation just beside FF13. Both are terrible games.

[CanadianTurtle]

I agree with you completely. FF13 was horrendous and Square Enix should send out a public apology for their catastrophe of a game.

[mynameisEvil]

They've sent out numerous apologies for the crap that was FF13. How many more do they need to make?

[RmanX1000]

While i do think that XIII-2 and Lightning Returns are totally unnecessary, i enjoyed FFXIII for its story. And that battle system was pretty good. I can see where people fault it. It was linear as fuck. And the characters couldve not been anime stereotypes. And my god i wanted to punch Snow and Hope in the face.

[Relientk77]

I hope with Ninja Gaiden 4 they go back to what Ninja Gaiden is supposed to be

Ninja Gaiden Black/Sigma was awesome

[PirateThom]

I wish they'd just make 2D Ninja Gaiden games again.

[dirthurts]

Those were always my favorite. With the current trend of downloadable games, you would think this would be a no brainer.

[belal]

Oh thats why you are changing dmc right?

[DaPrintz]

Team Ninja man, not Ninja Theory.

[MidnytRain]

Lol, fail.

[belal]

oh damn, my bad!

[Relientk77]

I probably would have made the same mistake, name too similar lol

[Darrius Cole]

But I understand why he got them mixed up. Ninja Theory doesn't listen to their fans either.

[WheatBread]

LOLz

[Bimkoblerutso]

I don't think it's even a matter of fans being stubborn. They took out a lot of what made the franchise fun and exciting, meaning the game was genuinely poorly designed.

It would have been an unfun game regardless, but it hit fans even harder because it was an unfun Ninja Gaiden game.

[Captain Qwark 9]

for once i agree. most of the time all the whining isnt totally justified ( ME2 was still great even if it wasnt as good and less rpg than 1, ME3s ending was fine, RE5 was still a good game just not as good as the older ones as i imagine 6 will follow the same path based off the demo. ) but NG3, it was just wasnt a good game esp compared to past entires, it was stripped down, the camera actually did suck this time, gore was gone, only had the sword weapon at the time of release, i like quick time events but they have no business in NG, difficulty on lower settings was toned down, etc.......just a bad entry in the series

[Vandamme21]

Don't worry folk ng3 razor's edge fixed all the issues

[Hufandpuf]

Played the demo. Wasn't impressed.

And I was really looking forward to that game too.

[Klonopin]

It all boils down to "If it ain't broke don't fix it". Too many developers nowadays are finding it necessary to ruin well established franchises for the sake of "innovation". Just stick with whatever works and give the fans what they want.

[soundslike]

Ninja Gaiden had pretty much reached gaming perfection. Not everyone could handle it but thats life.

Same thing happened with splinter cell. The gameplay mechanics were so incredibly close to perfect in Chaos Theory, there was absolutely no good reason to go the route they did with Conviction. Throwing out heritage for the sake of "innovation" aka a bunch of new developers with no knowledge of what makes games great, only a cockiness and confidence in their own shitty ideas.

[maniacmayhem]

Gotta love these types of stories. Here's a game series that redefined itself with the new gen and set up key staples that set it apart from others like it in its genre.

"We were getting feedback from the overseas offices to tone down the sexuality -- to tone down the sexiness of the game, and of the characters,"

Something tells me that the feedback they were getting was from marketing and stiff suits and not the actual fans of the series. Serves them right, too many times have we seen a series go downhill when a producer/creator leaves. Which is probably why Capcom hasn’t touched Mega Man.

[SageHonor]

Agreed

[Magic_Spatula]

Oh, but Capcom is making another Mega Man game. Just not the one fans want. It's called Rockman Xover I believe. For now it's an iOS exclusive game.

http://www.destructoid.com/...

Also heard that it has an auto-play function. Whereas the game plays itself.

[WheatBread]

If the original creator of a game series isn't involved in the sequel then it will most likely suck.

[Der_Kommandant]

My reaction was vomit all over my controller

[mynameisEvil]

Did you at least end up washing the controller?

[TheMutator]

Ninja Gaiden Razor Edge im comiiiiiiiing!!!

[CYBERHATER]

Yeah I was shocked too!

[Gamer-Z]

I just don't understand what possessed Team Ninja to make the game the way that they did? Maybe Yosuke Hayashi wanted to take the series in a whole new direction, if so he failed miserably.

[NovusTerminus]

I think everyone is over reacting here...

Yes, it fell short in allot of area's, but the biggest thing is Team Ninja is listening to their fans, and seem to be turning the franchise closer to what it was in 2 with Razor's Edge. I just hope the story stays closer to NGIII, Because it was nice having a story in the game.

So long as the fix it back, and listen to the fanbase, they will do fine in restoring it to former glory.

I think the fanservice of the game is fine were it is in DoA5. They seem to have found a good middle ground for the fans.

[DARK WITNESS]

Over reacting....

If they had listened to the fans in the first place it could have saved them having to learn it this way.

We all sait it when they first showed trailers and when people first got hands on the demo.

It was mostly the noobs how never played the first game who thought it looked ok etc.. Now they wonder why it didn't sell and they want to know why the rest of the fans didn't buy it....

They didn't make the game for us, they made it for noobs and they got the sales they deserved.

[nihonlight]

Here's a DOA5 fan that would like HD remixes of stages from DOA3!!!!
I know he thinks "dlc isn't fair" but it ADDS to games ESPECIALLY fighting games!

[WheatBread]

I'd like to see HD remakes of DOA2 and DOA3

[nihonlight]

I know! Even if Hayashi thinks "dlc is unfair"
Make it free! DO IT FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAME!
(I also miss the Top down jump camera angle
when you knock an opponent off a ledge)
it was more immersive and gave me butterflys.

[wastedcells]

Any word on the wii u version? Is it possible to save it from being as bad as the original.

[wishingW3L]

NG3 Wii U version is basically NG2 repackaged from a gameplay perspective. Multiple weapons, weapon upgrades, dismembering, multiple Jutsus (NG3 only had 1, can you believe it!), they removed all the idiotic QTEs that happened mid combos, obliteration techniques are making a return, etc.

NG3 has so many bad design choices is crazy... I mean, who in their right mind would add QTEs to a combo? It makes no sense!

[wastedcells]

I get why Nintendo published it, they needed a good variety at launch but this game was so poorly received by critics and fans that you would think a major redo was in order.

[Max-Zorin]

Never played it but from what I heard, it was terrible.

[Godmars290]

So shocked that the WiiU version sounds like its a wholly different title? The one they should have made in the first place?

[ssbains]

I am done with the series, I see no fun in it. Sales probably were lack luster. Start a new IP

[Ares84HU]

The game was so bad, I couldn't even finish it. It's not that I'm bad at it or anything. I just wasn't interested in it. It bored me to death.

[Mkai28]

The problem with gaiden 3
The choppy frame rate makes it have an unclean look.
Bland textures from stages and enemies .
Having one weapon can be repetitive, gaiden one and 2 had over 5/6 weapons fully upgradable.
Fighting fiends was better then fighting military solders throughout the whole game. The Older gaidens had a better mixture of enemies.
Story was terrible.

[josephayal]

this is very SAD

[Saturne3]

At least their worried on fixing it.

[MasterReviewer]

This made me LOL like I never LOL'D before.-------

"We actually got a lot of feedback from people who were playing it, saying, 'We want bigger breasts. Make the characters more like that.' That was kind of surprising."

[Plagasx]

Ninja Gaiden 3 is EASILY the most disappointing game so far this year!

I almost cried because of what they did to that game..

[GamersXTREME]

Resident Evil: Operation Raccoon CIty says "hi" :)

[Baka-akaB]

Except it wasnt dissapointing , Raccoon was made by a mediocre studio and looked mediocre from the very beginning

[SegataShanshiro]

Well at least RE ORC has real zombies in it, not like everything after 4....I hate that game for ruining my favourite series in the world and making it a CoD wanna be

[ChunkyLover53]

The games have gotten progressively worse, the first one on the original Xbox is still the best in my opinion. They tried to bring in a new audience for the series, and that never works out well. The original audience turned its back on the series and they failed to capture a new audience, which left them with nothing.

Although I did see the NG3 Collectors Edition for $39 over the past weekend, they'd have to pay me $39 to take that crap.

[Th3 Chr0nic]

WOW so many people really have no idea what really happened. Do a f***ing google search, click first link, read! you worms!!! http://bit.ly/N5D3Ft

[Arcanine]

well at least i saved $60 lol on one game

[Arcanine]

well at least i saved $60 and hours of depressing gameplay.

[h311rais3r]

Ng3 made me cry it was so bad compared to the others.

[Warj]

Translation: We didn't make any money trying to cater to the casual market, so you fans mind taking us back?

[PersonMan]

It must suck being a game developer.

Change the game: Fan backlash! Why'd they change it? There was nothing wrong with it before! The previous games were way better! It doesn't feel like the classic game I've grown to love!

If they don't change the game: Fan backlash! COPY AND PASTE! NO EFFORT! RESKIN OF PREVIOUS ONE!!!

You can't make anyone happy these days. They try their hardest to hit on what people might like, but it's really a crapshoot unless your game is titled "Call of Duty: Something"

[Baka-akaB]

enouh with that weak argument already .

making gameplay worse with actual bugs and input lags and a game easier , while adding more cutscene without even trying to improving the plot and storytelling ≠ changes

You wanna focus on story ? Then why was it so painful and badly done ?

It was no "damned if you do , damned if you dont" kind of scenarios ... just a string of bad choices all around .

There were other ways to do such a game while retaining its core essence and they didnt even try to .

They did the same thing , only worse and less playable

[Legend]

So Team Ninja is surprised that their core fan base rejected their newest entry into an established hardcore franchise because Team Ninja themselves ignored and removed the elements that garnered said fan base to begin with?

Hey Japanese developers! Are you OK?

[DaGR8JIBRALTAR]

I finished it but was smh the entire time.They knew the game was ass when they shipped it!Got it for twenty bucks at best buy .

[mechlord]

"There are existing fans out there, and you have to think about the people who have supported the series for so long, and you want to make sure that the game that you make appeals to them first, and satisfies those fans first"

Riiiight... like they didnt know this......

Am baffled.

[DG90]

When they released this with no gore it was ridiculous.. it's like playing Mortal Kombat with no blood.

[RockmanII7]

"There are existing fans out there, and you have to think about the people who have supported the series for so long, and you want to make sure that the game that you make appeals to them first, and satisfies those fans first"

I really wish the lead developers of Splinter Cell: Blacklist would read that and take it to heart.

[Psycho_Mantis]

What have they done to NG3 anyways?

[StreetsofRage]

I expected this. Without the Itagaki, it was sure to be doomed. When I heard this game had multiplayer I already knew it was going to suck.

[MehmetAlperTR]

How about that; " I was shocked when i played Ninja Gaiden 3, because of they ruin the franchise!!"

[Tontus]

NG3 failed because they changed what their fans loved to try and appeal to God of War fans since God of War dominates the genre like Gran Turismo to racing and Call of Duty to FPS's, so they thought they could grow the the franchise by appealing to a much bigger fan-base.

The problem is nothing else in the genre comes close to the quality of a God of War game and after hearing how bad NG3 is and playing the awful demo GoW fans didn't buy it, also the old NG fans were so disappointed that they didn't buy it either. NG3 sold so badly that unless NG3 on the Wii U is a MASSIVE hit (which is highly unlikely), Ninja Gaiden is dead. The new DmC has changed to appeal to God of War fans too but it actually looks decent, however if that fails then both NG & DmC, both once kings of the genre will be dead.

It's amazing how God of War's massive critical and commercial success has influenced developers so much that they ruined their own games just to appeal to God of War fans and in doing so have actually made God of War even more popular due to the comparisons being made by everyone when ever another hack n' slash game releases that's obviously 'inspired' by God of War. I hope God of War lives for ever, truly amazing series.

[spawn_of_stumpy]

never played any of the Ninja Gaiden series but i agree about gaming studio`s milking franchises to death. Ive been a gamer since original ps1 launch & have always bought PS & Xbox consoles at launch..
- Resi evil used to be fantastic, since about 25% into RE 4 ive not touched it or any other FF game.
- Final Fantasy went down hill at FFX & is sitting only 35% completed.
- Uncharted 3 has the most horrendous aiming & difficulty settings of any game ive ever experienced. great graphics but medium difficulty level should mean medium, NOT impossible. even on easiest setting i`m now stuck with endless hordes of indestructible baddies flocking towards me around level 20 i think).
- Halo was excellent in Halo CE, went downhill from there & Halo unsc or whatever it was called is still sitting only 20% completed. Hoping halo 4 will be worth it.

From now on i`l try a mates copy of a capcom game, but Naughty dog will never get my money again (i am that annoyed/disapointed) in uncharted 3.

Gaming in general has changed for the worse & in this state i`l not be rushing to buy the next PS4/xbox (expecially if theyre upwards of £400).

I now spend more time on my iphone 5/ipad playing simple easy to pick up games where i dont end up wanting to throw my PS controller through the TV in utter rage !!

just my twopence worth. :)

[Roccetarius]

I have a hard time believing what he says, because there are only so few devs that you can trust nowadays.

And yes, the ''Resident Evil'' games this year are dissapointing. Thing is, that didn't come as a surprise.

[andron]

Really??

[yokokoroma]

"There are existing fans out there, and you have to think about the people who have supported the series for so long, and you want to make sure that the game that you make appeals to them first, and satisfies those fans first.”

It's only right, as said series, wouldn't have been around as long, and or kept said developers employed. A perfect example of a developer turning it's back on loyal fans (i.e. PlayStation) is Capcom and Resident Evil. There wouldn't be a Resident Evil series, if it wasn't for the original fanbase for the game. The same applies to Team Ninja, and Ninja Gaiden, the original fanbase, should always be priority, as they are more likely to buy said game, if future games are presented in a similar manner, as what they originally played. Of course, with some "minor" improvements, over said games, last iteration, but don't completely change the game's structure. It's familiarity that keeps a fanbase in place, when things become unfamiliar, that fanbase will disappear.

[MilkMan]

Game was awesome. Just a bunch of cry babies that's all. Next article.
and YES, I've played them all and bought them all. Not at bin prices but day one purchases. Things need to change otherwise they stink.
End of story.

[Tzuno]

yeah team-ninja press X to finish ninja gaiden 3.

[edwoods]

This must be some dickhead way of apologizing for making a shitty game. How about less talk and more fan service techmo u incompetent pricks

[edwoods]

My opinion on the Wii U:

Well ok,... here's the issue:

Generation, first and foremost, is a useless and subjective term that can either refer to the numbered iteration in a companies console history, or it can mean the time frame of consoles competing against one another. If you choose the former, then microsoft is currently in the 2nd generation, otherwise they are in the 5th is the latter is chosen.

Now I personally go by the latter as well. Generation usually is referring what year frame that specific consoles are competing against one another. Ok im sure most of you already know this but many fools don;t think logically about it as I am doing right now.

Therefore, to understand what defines a next generation game, based on my above mentioned notion and opinon on the matter,we have to look at the technical specs. Why you ask? Why am I being a graphics whore you ask? Well, I'm not. But to rationalize buying a new console, one must have good reason to replace the old one. Well, that is always a factor of specs, whether you like it or not. In fact, if the nintendo fanboys think they are so polarized from bing graphic whores themselves, why dont they simply stick with the first wii? Why are they wanting the Wii U. Surely Nintendo could have made this new screen controller gimmick an add-on for the first Wii. So what is the true reason to justify buy this new wii U console? Because it has better graphics. Thats the only reason. The Wii U is to next gen what Wii was to current gen. A useless money making gimmicky scheme feeding off fanboy loyalty and grandmothers.

[Robotronfiend]

I know what to do with this dev team and franchise.

1) Quit making AAA games and get into mobile development.
2) Make "Ninja Garden"
3) Profit!

[Braid]

I don't mean to sound rude but who did they think they were there to satisfy first, homeless cats and dogs? :/