DICE "Considering" Mod Tools for Battlefield 3 and Defends 30 Frames-Per-Second on Console

In an interview with AusGamers at this year's GamesCom, DICE's Karl-Magnus Troedsson defended the team's decision to release Battlefield 3 with no mod-support on the PC, but also gave hope to the community by offering a "we are considering it".

He also touched on the 30 frames-per-second versus 60 frames-per-second debate, by reminding us every Battlefield game released on console from there thus far has run at 30 FPS.

"We have heard the community very loud and clear on this topic -- that they want mod tools," he said. "We are considering it, back in the studio. The game won’t ship with mod tools, but we have heard it. I’m not saying that we’re going to do it, I’m saying that we are thinking about it."

[Serjikal_Strike]

It will happen...just a matter of time

[latinalover]

they want to sell all their DLC first

[Serjikal_Strike]

this aint Activision

[Coffin87]

Still, with this Origin-Software they're pulling worse privacy-breaching BS than Activision ever did.
That made them go down on my list a few damn places.

[RedDead]

Yea...but it's EA

[latinalover]

but EA wants money. and it will have twice of DLC than BC2

[Bladesfist]

BC2 only had 2 payed dlc's the rest was free. Vietnam and SA skins. (PC)

[darksied]

I don't know about you, but I would WELCOME more DLC for Battlefield 3. I don't care if EA wants money or if they're there to just cash in. I will look at each DLC separately and see if they are worth it and then decide. It's better than having NO options.

[CaptCalvin]

But this is EA

[lategamer]

They may not be Activision, but there EA. EA, known for milking franchises, closing development studios, etc. Like Activision, there a business, there goal is to make money.

[killcycle]

How did you get 3 disagrees?
People on this site think that Acti & EA's priority's are to please the consumers?

Hell no, they want to milk and they will milk more and more with every new game released.

Dev costs go up every year with the standard of gaming constantly being raised. It's bound

[specialguest]

People forgot that EA was the original "evil empire" of the video game industry.

[Livin_in_a_box]

GIVE US MOD SUPPORT SO WE CAN ADD A JURASSIC HORDE MODE OURSELVES GODDAMMIT

[user858621]

hell yh bring on the mod tools!!!!

[raytraceme]

the people that have a problem with 30fps game should have a problem with halo as well as killzone, as well as crysis 2, and any fps at that. I hate toolbags that complain about a game that is 30fps cause i know 99% of the people that complain about bf3 being 30fps play halo as well ;)

[evrfighter]

it's the cod fanboys last line of defense. the walls are crumbling and they're hoping it will save them.

[Jack_DangerousIy]

Crumbling down with the new Frostbite 2 engine! ;)

[blumatt]

I don't think Call of Duty has any "walls crumbling". There's no damage in those games. hahaha I hope CoD gets damage in the next generation of consoles.

Anyway, Battlefield 3 is going to rock, regardless of its 30fps framerate. I played the hell out of Bad Company 2 and I NEVER had an issue with the framerate. Its multiplayer was amazing.

[lategamer]

Call of Duty is a completely different type of game. Yes, it's a first person shooter. But Battlefield is more of a Sandbox, Team Shooter. Call of Duty goes for a quick, arcade type of shooter.

Battlefield vs CoD is stupid, because they are completely different types of FPS.

[theonlylolking]

BF3 is BF2 with pretty graphics. Just like how MW3 is MW2 with tweaked perks.

[NatureOfLogic]

FPS means a lot, after I finish playing a game of COD then go play BF, It feels like Im moving in slow mo. Im guessing FPS has something to do with it.

I would love to play BF3 on a PC one day and see if there's a difference with playing BF3 at 60fps rather than 30.

[ZombieNinjaPanda]

>feels like I'm playing in Slow Mo

Or maybe it has something to do with the fact that you can't run around like a marathon sprinter in Battlefield.

[Lazy_Sunday]

...people will have no qualms with it. It's games with lots of framerate drops at 30FPS people have issues with--games like Crysis 2. And that's the problem many people fear with Battlefield 3--not that it won't be a quality game, just that it might operate at the 'visceral' 30FPS like Crysis 2 (which is really 15-25FPS, and that's just visually unappealing). It's completely natural to experience doubt in a product, especially in this economy where games have become investments of time for gamers. I hope we see more console footage soon. Smooth, constant framerate is a big part of keeping a quality gameplay experience.

[CloseSecond]

Agreed. 30fps is just fine but if it drops below that, especially when there is lots going on then I'll be disappointed.

I have to say that I'm still disappointed that trees, grass, etc don't react from a shockeave.

[AKS]

There are lots of sacrifices a developer would have to make to get 60 fps. People act like the only factors are resolution and frame rate. I've found the Battlefield games to be extremely impressive considering the visual quality, scale, and especially physics. You can bring down an entire building with people and vehicles moving around inside of it. Do you think that's a simple thing to do while maintaining detail and fairly large maps on a 6-year old console? I'm amazed it runs so well considering everything it does.

[SJPFTW]

lol its funny because 60 fps means jack shit if you lag all the time or someone is lag switching. COD latency is inconsistent and sometimes a total lag fest. I have enjoyed much more smoother experiences on BFBC2 and halo

[Jocosta]

Strange that you just threw that statistic out there on how "99% of the people that complain about bf3 being 30fps play halo as well". What kind of research or case study did you perform to come up with that number? Or shall I translate? It should read: "I hate Halo and it's fans so much that I just had to come up with some remote way to take a jab at them". Does that sum it up? I play Halo, in fact it's my favorite FPS. Don't get me wrong, I am not offended or pissed off, because I give fuck-all about your opinion, I am just curious.

[Fez]

He wasn't taking a jab at Halo fans... he was pointing out the hypocrisy of bashing one game for being 30fps but not another. You must be a little offended or at least very defensive to take the time to misinterpret someones statement and post a comment?

[Heartnet]

erm why mention fps? Oh yeh Mod tools obv equals start trolling ...

So what if they play Halo? they might be sad thats not 60 fps... just cuz they play a 30 fps game does not mean they wudnt have it at 60..

[raytraceme]

When was the last time black ops ran a fluid 60fps on consoles anyways??? On the ps3 it's more like 45 and on the xbox its more like 55. Though mw2 was better optimized than black ops and ran at an avg. 58+ on both consoles.

Bad Company 2 ran a fluid 30 fps. And from the ps3 gameplay it looked pretty fluid to me ;)

[theEx1Le]

I'm sorry but thats not true, I play BC2 a bit and it defo does not stay above 30fps all the time. On heavy metal especially the frame rate spirals in high intense battles. But to be fair thats to be expected, the size and scale of most of the maps in bc is unreal, especially for consoles.

[BubbleSniper]

no problem. give the consoles as much as they can handle I say. I am not going to play this day 1 unfortunately. I just abhor Origin and wont cave in for it. long LIVE STEAM.

[Quagmire]

Sure when DICE defend 30fps, everyone's ok, but when its Ninja Theory or Slightly Mad Studios, it ends up in a shitstorm.

[3GenGames]

Everyone's okay except the people who try to name stuff COD is better at. FPS may be that, but with the crap engine, it doesn't mean anything for the gameplay loss from having it run at 60FPS. :)

[Lazy_Sunday]

Ninja Theory set their standards with 60FPS on their games. It's what grabbed the appeal. It's almost imperative when the action you're used to is so smooth and fast.

Slightly Mad Studios gets crap because racing games don't tend to require a lot of power on the processing end. When you add in destruction, open world environments and realistic effects, we can understand. But in a racing game, based on going around a track a couple of times, the graphics are expected to be great and fast paced. I don't see the shit they are getting, since nobody's playing their games anyway. The last good NFS game I played was NFSU 1&2, and after they decided to milk the franchise even further to yearly releases, making the madden of open world racing, I stopped playing them. Then I guess they decided to take a step backward, and the game's just taken a turn for a worse. I mean, NFS: The Runs--I mean Run?

[Quagmire]

Lmfao, Shift 2 is imo better than Gt5 and Forza. Maybe thats why no one is playing it, they're ignorant.

As for the run, its shaping up to be great, but obviously the general public dont think so due to the mentality that "OMG its teh another NFS GaEm, its soooo gay, lulz"

[Lazy_Sunday]

But better than GT5 and Forza? That's a little much.
In my opinion, I feel as if NFS is just trying to clone every other racing game today, instead of doing what it did best and what made me and so many others enjoy the series. I don't want any more futuristic street racing bullshit. I don't want another lap driven track racer. I want a game that follows the simplicity of the title: "Need for SPEED." I want something fast, dangerous, and a game I want to play. I don't want a heavily story driven, linear based racing game, but I think it's going in a better direction. I still think it's a huge step back from an open world street racing game. And a lot of others agree with me.

[vyke3]

dude you have got to be kidding me. 60 FPS is necessary in fighting and racing games like GT5 or DmC, but 30 FPS is the standard in shooters.

[beavis4play]

you are 100% correct. 60 fps isn't necessary in shooters.

[Voxelman]

@ beavis4play well console shooters anyway, old school PC shooters benefit a lot from 60fps when you are moving (and spinning 180 degrees in under a second) as fast as you do in some of those games.

[vyke3]

@Voxelman
yes you are right. any pc FPS game needs to have 60 FPS because of using a mouse. im really worried that in CS:GO pc gamers would have an advantage over ps3 gamers because of the frame rate differences. (even if ps3 gamers use mouse/keyboards)

[nickjkl]

you dont need 60 fps to do well in an fps on pc

whos telling you people this

[Heartnet]

So true.. i remember when NT mentioned 30 fps the amount of hate that flowed through the comments was unbelievable...

[Theo1130]

Am I the only pc gamer who doesn't know how to mod?

[fossilfern]

I dont really know how to do it either, but i respect the people who do know. Seems very time consuming. Just happy they do it :D

[Tony P]

Making mods can be complicated and require a pretty hefty amount of effort, especially if you want to make a good one.

But you usually don't need to know more than how to find the readme to install them.

[AKS]

Create them or use them? Using is usually not difficult, but if you're creating something substantial, no, I don't have the skills to do that.

[Theo1130]

creating, like you said using them isn't difficult but I have no idea what it takes to create something.

[3GenGames]

Yeah, creating them especially for modern games would be crazy, as you'd have to figure out their compression, data format, and a ton of junk. If they release that info it'd be 1000x easier, which I'm sure they will. But it's still not a walk in the park. People who make the tools are pretty skilled programming wise. :)

[Mr_Lu_Kim]

Visual C++ experience is a good start and being able to wright in script.

[eclectified]

When Half-Life 2 had come out, I remember playing with the source mod tools. I couldn't program to save my life, but the draw for me was the ability to create maps from scratch. I started to create a map based on the design of the school campus I was attending, but I never even got close to completion. I'd love to give it another go with a BF3 tool set now that I'm done with school.

[Undeadwolfy]

Can anyone kindly link me to a video of a BF game which its mod tools allowed for some great mods?

[Mr_Lu_Kim]

Battlefield 2 mod. FREE lol.

http://www.moddb.com/mods/p...

[Tachyon_Nova]

But I thought it was impossible for a home PC to run Frostbite 2 DICE?

[annus]

...What?

Seriously, what was that meant to mean? Battlefield 3 is coming to PC so I'm slightly confused, or are we all going to NASA to play BF3?

[Tachyon_Nova]

Did they not at one point say that the engine generated too much info for a home PC to handle during the creation of a scene?

[annus]

...I don't believe so. I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure BF3 was planned to be on the PC the entire time. Maybe you read one of the many articles on N4G that take a few words and make a new sentence out of it that does not resemble what was said at all.

[Tachyon_Nova]

Im not talking about a game running in Frostbite 2, im talking about a game being made in Frostbite 2, during development, Im sure they said something along the lines of because of the way it handles lighting etc it generates too much info for a PC to handle. I am fully aware that a completed game using Frostbite 2 can run on PC, I am not living under a mountain sized rock.

[eclectified]

Way back when Bad Company was released, I think there was a rumor or possibly some random statement made about Frostbite only working on consoles. I think this is where he's getting the idea from. Bad Company 2 is on the PC though so, that comment was a little late.

[Heartnet]

Probably cant Lol not any normal PC anyhow ^^ However there not giving u the frostbite engine lol ud have to pay some serious cash for that :L

[emk2004]

Just want people 2 know as a veteran BF guy myself, no bf game launched with mod tools, yet mods were made. I hope that Dice does launch with them tho so people like me can still play with it, and no have to be a computer smarty pants to make them.

[CaptCalvin]

Pretty sure BF1942 launched with Battlecraft... Or am I remembering it wrong?

[emk2004]

Nope battlecraft was made by the community, dice actually hired the guy who made it and then officially released it.

BTW who disagreed with my first post? It is a fact.

[CaptCalvin]

Lol wasn't me dude

[eridc3301]

Hes right its a trade off. You can can 60 fps on the console like cod, but you get a lower resolution, no destruction, less player, smaller maps, no vehicles. I was very satisfied with the 30 fps on bc2 it worked. Dont get me wrong i also enjoy cod. We got to remember they are different games.

[Pro_TactX]

They are considering mod tools? But I thought the Frostbite 2 engine was beyond the comprehension of us mere mortals.

[yamzilla]

Call of duty should run at 120 frames per second on console, it uses id tech 3 from 1999.....lol.....

"Game engines

Main article: IW engine

All of Infinity Ward's Call of Duty games utilize the id Tech 3 (Quake III Arena) engine.[10] The first two games used a proprietary license of the engine with the sequel featuring more powerful visuals and DirectX 9 support. Infinity Ward's Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare runs on a proprietary game engine (from a version of id Tech 3) with features that include true world-dynamic lighting, HDR lighting effects, dynamic shadows and depth of field.[11] Call of Duty: World at War, Call of Duty: Black Ops and the James Bond video game Quantum of Solace were developed by Treyarch using modified versions of Infinity Ward's engine.[12]"

-wikipedia

[Heartnet]

Dude its a heavily modified version of that engine which over the years probz only slightly resembles its former coutnerpart lol

Also shudnt u be praising IW and Treyarch for getting such nice visuals out of such an old engine?

[MGRogue2017]

""60 FPS is not a technical problem, it’s very easy to do," he concludes on the topic. "If you turn off all the things I just mentioned, we can also get it to run at 60."

Precisely.

Call of Duty titles run at 60fps purely because hardly anything technically demanding is happening at any given point when playing in those games.

Whereas with Battlefield, You've got large open environments; tonnes of vehicles; more players on screen, all-out destruction in the environment. sh*t is blowing up all around you constantly, incredible sense of immersion of being in a war.. etc etc..

Having said that, titles from both series are excellent in their own unique ways & Modern Warfare 3 & Battlefield 3 will, no doubt, continue this tradition.

[Alcohog]

No MODS for BF3 would be a travesty.

[EverydayGuy]

Played it at Pax, it was amazing. For a 30fps game it went pretty smooth. I was amaze on how much they have accomplish using the PS3. BF3 is worth getting excited about, and you guys will be in for a great ride.

[Jocosta]

It will only be noticeable if it dips below 24 frames, which is the true max on what the human eye can detect. It's not quite so simple but it's a good indicator of when the game noticeably falls apart. Here is a good source in case anyone cares: http://www.100fps.com/how_m...

[annus]

Your 'source' doesn't mention anywhere that 24 frames is the MAX the human eye can detect. Anything UNDER 24 frames is easily detected by the eye and doesn't give a smooth look. The eye can detect up to about 80 FPS before the framerate starts to look the same.

Look at the bellow link, the eye can easily detect the difference between 30 and 60 FPS, however 30 isn't BAD so BF3 being 30FPS on consoles will not matter at all.

http://www.boallen.com/fps-...

[capcock]

Still pissed that they won't release the game on Steam >:(
+ it better have Mod support since it's a sequal to BF2.

[aman84r]

Ofcourse they will say that.What else do you expect from them this is one of the main advanteges COD has?Although i did find the storyline in COD better than BC2 and MOH but im sure people wouldnt understand that.

[MrSent]

I'd love to see a World War II mod with authentic sounding planes. Mmmmmm P51 mustang and ME 109's yummy!

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

[thespaz]

"every Battlefield game released on console from there thus far has run at 30 FPS."

And people make fun of Call of Duty for never changing from the past? Call of Duty has always run at 60fps thus far.

[Bladesfist]

on my pc it runs at 120fps. Its still looks like crap. Id rather have half the framerate and a more realistic looking game with bigger maps, Higher player counts, vehicles and destruction

[thespaz]

We're not talking about your PC, so I don't care what your PC does.

[Bladesfist]

Yer so call of duty has always run at 60fps like you said right? Plus that was not my point. My point is id rather sacrifice fps than gameplay.

[death2smoochie]

MW3 can run at 60fps because its using a dated game engine and there is absolutely no real time effects or lighting happening in that game. Not to mention no destructible environment.
If MW3 did not run at 60fps then the games developers should be shot because the game is not CPU/GPU demanding at all.

[zero_cool]

Well as long as dice is honestly pushing both consoles to the best of their abilities then gamers should be happy with the results!

[KontryBoy706]

Long as the game is locked at 30fps it doesn't matter if it's not 60fps