XBox 360 Investigation

WCC and SKWC have filed a lawsuit in the United States District Court Western District of Washington at Seattle on behalf of a nationwide class of consumers who have suffered scratched game disks while using their X-Box 360 Console. The lawsuit seeks: reimbursement for consumers for the cost of games damaged by the Console, reimbursement for consumers who have paid a $20 fee to Microsoft Corporation under a limited disk replacement program offered on ten Microsoft games, repair, free of charge, the Consoles to prevent disks from being scratched, and/or reimbursement for consumers who have paid for an aftermarket repair solution.

[MK_Red]

X-Box!? WCC is suing Microsoft and they don't even know how to spell the Xbox.

[Lord Anubis]

they spelled it correctly. X-box ||Xbox||X360

@below

http://whatis.techtarget.co...

because the word is box and the prefix is X it is ok to spell it X-Box in the same way people spelled Play Station in the old days.

[eLiNeS]

No they didn't, see picture.

[Rattles]

LOL

[zantetsuken]

It's about time. I'm on #3 and just want a box that will not die. To hell with the 3 year warranty deal, it's just a band-aid on a gushing wound. I want a 360 that will last years.

[cookiemonster]

I don't get this comment.

On one hand you're complaining about a 3 year warranty as if warranties don't improve consumer confidence. but then you demand reform when they're clearly putting in heatsinks, smaller chips, and extending warranties.

[zantetsuken]

I've been told they're "improving" and "fixing it" over and over again. Yet, I'm on my third unit. I'm still on my first PS One, PS2, PS3, and Wii. Hell, even my NES and SNES still work and they're ages old.

Once I can understand. These are electronics, things happen. But twice? Even an Elite which was supposed to be improved.

I want one that will work, not crap out on me within three years. Sorry, band-aid warranty isn't cutting it for me. Actions speak louder than words and MS has done nothing to make me happy with these situations.

[candystop]

I see where he's coming from and yes there taking steps to correct the issues but what I want myself is for MS to come out and say that they have fixed the problem! The 3 year is great but I just want to know the problems were resolved or will be soon! 360 is really a great console that is years ahead of PS3 minus bluray with this one issue to be resolved to make it unstoppable!

[Xwow]

then buy a ps3 and you will not regret it.

[zantetsuken]

Already have one, 0 issues thus far. I hope it stays that way, and I trust Sony. No issues with the PS One or PS2, keeping my fingers crossed it stays that way with PS3.

[Rockstar]

Lol @ Candystop

[eLiNeS]

I don't believe you have or ever had a 360 based on your past comments. Why don't you go roam in your own PofS3 section, TROLL.

Stay on topic people, this lawsuit is not talking about the 3 year warranty, it's talking about the Xbox 360 Console scratching game disks while they are being played. This isn't even news, this is ridiculous. Only morons that move there console for who know what reason while it's running probable scratched there disc. This is absurd.

[tehcellownu]

@3.1- As of right now Microsoft isn't doing anything about the all 360s dying out on people..Just having a 3 year warranty is not enough and it ONLY cover the red lights of death... if you have any other issues you are on your own and get ready to open ya wallet to give more money out..ALL i heard about is the revision that we will be getting soon but still no action have been taken right now..Also it will not still make up the 11 million defective 360 out there..Microsoft already admited there was a designed flaw within the system.

A sytemn that cost up to 500 dollars sholdnt break that easily..its call gettting ripped off by microsoft since they sell you that piece of junk..

[cookiemonster]

in response the comments,

in case you haven't been keeping up with the news, they've been putting in heatsinks and 65nm chips. your elite may not have them.

we all want a reliable product. but microsoft can't retroactively fix every console on shelves and livings rooms, without doing the biggest recall in history. even though the product hasn't hurt anyone.

so they've taken steps to revamp the product. not just the warranty. but the warranty is part of it to help cover some of those who have already bought it. remember they're putting heatsinks in the repaired ones too.

[Rockstar]

"Only morons that move there console for who know what reason while it's running probable scratched there disc"

Why?

I understand that the 360 instructions state that you shouldn't move the unit while it is in operation but I also understand that I can move my Wii while it's going and have zero scratching issues, likely my PS3 as well (not that I've tried).
I also recognize that the Wii and PS3 have different loading mechanisms but how about a PC?
I can move that while it's in operation and have no worries about ruining my discs.
Why? Because all of my drives have the pads to stop the lens from touching the disc.
Why? Because there was no need to cut corners to save money on manufacturing costs so M$ could save a buck.

I'm sure some of the 360 owners out there have moved their console while in operation causing damage to their games, but I'm also quite sure that more than a few others have never moved their console while in operation an still had damage to their games nonetheless.

So in closing, I'd say that at most, 360 owners that have moved their systems while in operation can't follow instructions [or have never bothered to read them (I know I wouldn't)] but they are far from morons.

Common sense would dictate that a disc drive wouldn't scratch a disc if it were manufactured properly. The blame rests solely on M$'s shoulders for being so cheap.

[zantetsuken]

The only troll here is you.

http://i131.photobucket.com...

Got anything else to say?

Didn't think so.

[Rockstar]

What's that on the bottom shelf?
I can't make it out.

EDIT: Final Fantasy VII?

[xhi4]

@zantetsuken you got owned haha, xbots...so deppresing

[trueltie5]

Looks like MS may want to set aside more than $1billion for repair costs...They're going to have a fun time explaining these lawsuits and repair costs to investors who have been weary about the xbox division. Enjoy your final xbox machine....Peter Moore you knew something we didn't....i seen this coming...it's funny cause Peter Moores new replacement is Don Mattrick who is a SOFTWARE guy...Sega got smart and stuck to software...MS is obviously not a hardware but a hardware co. Blu ray is obviously the next gen format choice...i'll be happy to debate with anyone on this...but im sure i'll get the typical denial xbox gamer...please don't get defensive...im not trying to put down the xbox...I, like many investors feel xbox gaming in hardware is not going to succeed...you can sense the life of the xbox all but done...Peter Moore departure, xbox failure rate, lawsuits, banking so much this holiday (which the xbox has hit its peak in sales), maybe not software (i.e halo, bioshock, gta4, etc)...however i hate to be bad news bear...i think MS do care about their gamers...but they also care about making $$$ and so do their investors.

[candystop]

Well It's good to know that there are other investors on this site! Honestly though I do believe that there will be a 3rd Xbox and if not then thats just part of life!

[Lacarious]

here's to another $500 million for scratched discs.... M$ needs to get their act together!

on my 6th.

[Lacarious]

too disagree with that comment.... I take it you enjoy the consistent headaches M$ gives to the end users of the next gen world?

say it aint so kid...

[trueltie5]

i'll somewhat agree with you just cause i know MS can make another run because well it's M$$$$....However, they're realizing that Sony isn't only their competitor they have to deal with Nintendo...Theres just no way they'll win or succeed in the gaming industry (unless sticking to software of course). Lets face it they've lost a reliable image after the red ring and failure rate issue...Even when they have the new 'falcon' model consumers aren't sure about the system...they won't be so sure about the "next xbox system neither"...and MS knows that...I can assure Bill Gates or Steve Ballmers dream of MS in the gaming industry didn't think it was going to be this bad...neither did the investors...Truth is it is just awful and has been a disaster. Either way gaming is GREAT and there are a lot of games out there to enjoy...I just think we may have to come to reality that it's only going to be Nintendo and Sony in the hardware....I hope MS decides to continue making software for both the Nintendo and Playstation in the future...
I can promise you that im not this "fanboy"...matter of fact im far from being a "gamer"...just madden football...yes i only play on my playstation...I have it out for MS because it really has been a failure and not starting up rumors...If you want do the research like most do in wall street about how investors know that MS gaming division has been and will be a failure...just to give you an example...type in "roger ehrenberg xbox" in google and you'll find a classic article even before the Red Ring announcment Green...I"ll tell you what frustrates me the most...Is the xbox consumers in denial and always justifying a really bad faulty system...I'm not here to play that game that the Playstation is better than the xbox...im here to point out that MS has screwed over consumers before (i.e xbox)...but oh yeah let me guess...Since you stick up for Xbox so much im sure MS and their shareholders will be happy to keep losing money in the industry just to keep "xbox gamers" happy right ? I mean cmon my friend.....

[beans]

Cool it already and don't start spreading crap around trying to make up another rumor! MS isn't out of the game yet and after this holiday season all of the red ring problems will have been resolved and people will forget this ever happened! I love how you try and say that it's going to happen guaranteed and write them off like that lol! Talk about fanboys in disguise!

[zantetsuken]

"all of the red ring problems will have been resolved and people will forget this ever happened!" Been hearing that time after time over and over. Still on unit #3. Was told thise after the first died, and after the second died. I'm done believing bs rumors.

[Charlie2688]

I agree 110% with you trueltie5 on this one

sorry beans you cant do damage control to that one even if your blind love for the 360 pushes you to do it, he managed to present it extremely well with out falling into fanboy attacks like you did

zantetsuken @ I understand you I am in my second and it look like soon ill be in my third

[eLiNeS]

You know what you are if you disagree. Just admit it and continue on, I am out of here.

[LeShin]

.

[xhi4]

Um, wait i know this one, um, um, you?

[power of Green]

Agreed seems like that kid is a Sony fanboy i'll check his post history some time tomorrow to see if he needs to be on my ignor list.

Heres the status of the guy that post this thread:

Xbox 360 Tag: - NONE
PS3 Tag: - Demon1980
Mii Tag (Wii): - NONE

Just to let people know who to avoid, I still think fanboys of one console should not be posting news about consoles were you can prove there has been malice in past post of news and comments.

zantetsuken: has been known to be a Sony fanboy.

Charlie2688: Although owns the 360 and is telling others "blind love for the 360" his constant bi*ching and seemingly hate for MS and the xbox is just as bad and this dude should get rid of the dam thing and stop getting new 360's so we all can be at peace and not have to hear his ass talk about how he thinks MS sucks(like an abused wife).

[xhi4]

Okay, so he has a picture of his ps3, xbox 360 ELITE, nes n other consoles. I dunno bout you but i think thats a well rounded gamer.

[Bathyj]

Green with Envy cant accept that people that own a 360 could voice problems with it. We all must be Sony Fanboys if we have anything bad to say about Xbox or M$ and the way they do business.

I say that line of thinking makes him an Xbox fanboy.

Hey Pog...(oh I know you cant hear me, I like PS3 and therefore am someone who "needs to be on your ignore lists") but this is more for others to read away.
How many X360's have you had? Knowing what an Xbot you are no doubt the answer is "Only one, had it since launch, never a minutes problem."
Well I've owned 3, so if anything, I've got more right to post in an Xbox thread than you.

Do other people who have had Xboxes break on them feel they have the right to post in box threads?

And this is classic..
"Just to let people know who to avoid, I still think fanboys of one console should not be posting news about consoles were you can prove there has been malice in past post of news and comments."
I take it by that, we'll never see you in a PS3 thread again since you've never had one, never wanted one and will never get one.

[CRIMS0N_W0LF]

Lol power of Geen is #1 xbot fanboy yet he complains about fanboys when he is one?

[AllroundGamer]

lol Power of Green is ignored by only 34 users, nuff said... he needs some bubble reducing medicine :D

[LeShin]

@eLiNes and power of green.

You two are real funny. Tell me, how do you two define what a fanboy is? I've just seen the picture that zantetsuken put up and it shows his systems which INCLUDE a Xbox360 Elite!!!

So do I take it that anyone that disagrees with you who even HAS a XBox 360 is STILL a Sony fanboy?

lol!

[Agriel]

A fanboy to most fanboys, is anyone that don't agree with them and/or puts down the X console that is their console of fonboism.Seems if you have an opinion on something that someone doesn't agree then you must be a fanboy

[Lord Anubis]

fanboy

1. A person who is completely loyal to a game or company reguardless of if they suck or not.
2. A pathetic insult often used by fanboys themselves to try and put down people who don't like whatever it is they like.
3. See fool or SEGA.

"If you don't worship SEGA and send them all your money and pay $500 for the copy of Panzer Dragon I'm selling on ebay then your obviously a Sony fanboy even though I've never heard you mention a single thing about Sony the entire five minutes I've known you." Said the SEGA Fanboy.

"Yeah but the SNES didn't have Blast Processing" Said the Sega fanboy.

"FF7 sucks" Said the [SEGA Saturn fanboy.

"
Fanboys are attributed with a sycophantic devotion to the creators and principles behind a work with which they are currently enthralled. Fanboys are noted for a very emotional attachment to their chosen subject, often taking negative remarks about it as a personal attack. They will readily engage in debates, but will fall back on emotional responses when challenged on facts. For example, a fanboy may go out of his way to point out negative and often untrue statements about their obsession's rivals. Fanboys are often hostile towards critical review of their chosen subject. The stereotypical image of the fanboy is as an unkempt, socially awkward, young man who may be perceived as a loud mouthed pseudo-intellectual. Fanboys are also typically aggressive and hateful towards the opposing brand or competition of their obsession regardless of its merits or achievements."

so there you have it. Who knows what's going on through those two narrowed minded heads.

[ShiftyLookingCow]

hey who gives a fcuk about 360 problems when a broken 360(to be precise one with broken fans that sound like a blowdrier) can calm a baby in 15 seconds(better than even that stupid Geiko)

[Bazookajoe_83]

Does anyone disagree that those who had there games scratched should get a new one? To me it´s pretty obvious they should get them replaced for free. This is how companies improve them self, it will make them deal with the issue and get more ´people to buy there products..

[DaEnforcer]

Is Sinking

[JokesOnYou]

Did you know that studies have shown that if you are a sony kid, a BS3 fanboy, a pooray fanboy etc your 360 is much more likely to break, in fact everyone who reads the sony protection group forum will automatically catch the anti-micro curse which explains why their 360's break even more than the 99% failure rate, sorry sony kids your fate is sealed just throw away all the fictional 360's that keep breaking and stick with your pooray3 player its not worth the risk, besides you might get caught actually playing Bioshock in a few weeks and we know that wont sit right with sony protection group you will be forced by gunpoint to break your 360 for sure, them put on house arrest and then what are you going to do? play your pooray3 ha ha dont make me laugh sony kids. once again=

JOY

[Bazookajoe_83]

Youre the joke u clown =)

[Rockstar]

But why are you calling the PS3 a pooray3?

Could you not come up with something better?

Even POS3 or BS3 or is better than that.
Hey! You should get a "CluRay3"

See, I can do it too!

[tk]

Listen kid
I am 39. I earn money and decide how to spend it. You on the other hand clearly don't earn and just type your stupid comments on something you clearly don't pay for.

Have you had a look at the BR disks? Have you seen the quality of these things? I own hundreds of DVD's. I am quite familiar with data loss due to scratching, music skipping, DVD videos jumping due to scratched disks. In my life I have never seen such good quality as the Blu-Ray disks. It beats anything out there hands down. It is redefining, revolutionizing the industry. This comment as a consumer.

Since I pay for the stuff in my house, and as a parent to four kids, who can be quite heavy on the budget, I take care not to buy something that breaks often. I don't enjoy trips to the electronic store to replace a toy for the kids. Then they will have to do without it.

I want it to be good quality, and reliable. In short - value for money that entertains them, not frustrate me. The XB360 would be dumped in the garbage if I had to take it to the store as second time. If a second and third disk gets scratched in a short period of time, I would be as mad as hell.

Whatever my loyalties regarding the technology of the two consoles, I would expect them both to be of good quality. The XB360 is not. I always check a new tech out for months before buying. The XB360 in the shops nearly all have a "broken" sign on them. I have taken photos of it if you like. It is shocking that a large corporate does this to the consumer and then try to blame them for it. Take my word on it - you don't get away with it. MS will reap the whirlwind for this. You may be locked in your room, playing with your weenie because your XB360 is in for repairs, waiting for your dad to bring it back from repairs, spewing your fanboyism in other peoples faces on the forums, pretending that the problem does not exist. Well for a fact - the problem is there. MS even lays out a Billion green ones for it for repairs. But that will not do. They will be taught a lesson in respect for the customer. My opinion is that Moore did not move on, he was fired. If I was the person he reported to, he would be charged. He would be personally held reliable for this mess.

Bottom line kid is, we who pay good money for a company who treats us with this kind of disrespect, will not just sit around. I am not in the boat because I avoid MS products - but for the others - this will not do. MS is not going to get away with a spinning PR game and a 3 year warranty hiding the fact that it is in fact a total recall to save face. They are going to answer for this. They will make right with the consumer.

And the reason why Sony has my money and respect is because of the quality of their products. Since I was a kid, the brand we respected was Sony. "It's a Sony" was their tagline. You know that if you bought a Sony product, it was quality. Their batteries gave less problems than the XB360. They issued a recall. They replaced it. They fessed up and too the accountability. That is admirable. They took the hit, but they kept my respect. In fact, my respect for them doubled. MS messed up, and try to blame the consumer. They try to undercut and use dubious practices to drive others out of an industry that they have no place in. They refuse to publicly acknowledge their mistake, but try and pour billions to drive a respectable company out of the market because they want to monopolize it and push their junk down our throats. They are thugs. You, little peckerwood, have as little insight in their tactics and morals as they have respect for the customer.

[aquaviva71]

HEY LOSERS AND BEATNIKS!!!!!! LOOK AT ALL THE GAMES COMING OUT BEFORE CHRISTMAS FOR THE SONY PLAYSTATION 3 :

Uncharted-Drake's Fortune,

Lair,

Hevenly Sword,

Warhawk,

Heavy Rain,

Hot Shots 5,

Folklore,

Ratchet & Clank,

Unreal Tournament 3,

Time Crisis 4 with Guncon,

Eight Days,

Gran Tourismo HD,

Tekken 6

and then after Christmas(No more than one or two months after)theres:

Infamous,

Burnout Paradise,

Killzone 2,

Metal Gear Solid 4.

AND ofcourse MORE like..... GTA IV

P.S. SUE THE CRAP OUT OF MICROSOFT FOR MAKING CONSUMERS GO THROUGH ALL THE AGGRAVATION.

[CRIMS0N_W0LF]

How can you forget FINAL FANTASY!

[tk]

I don't like MS. I don't like the XB360. But to slag the owners is a bit off color. To do it in CAPS is downright childish. You should sell your PS3 and get yourself a toy that matches your IQ and attitude - something like a LCD Tamagotchi or something similar.

The XB360 owners are hurting. They paid good money, and MS is reaping the rewards. No need to call the owner of a high-tech toy an imbecile or idiot. Get a grip on yourself. You are bringing down the quality of posts on any forum. I shudder to think that I might be playing online against someone like you. Just having a conversation with you i fear could most probably lower my IQ.

[tk]

MS did make a smart move with the 3 year warranty. In effect it is a recall of the XB360. Because every XB360 will most likely die in a 3 year period. Then they fix it with the better heat sink - and hopefully for XB360 owners - the problem will be fixed. And the negative press associated with a recall will be avoided. Smart move on their side. I think any XB360 owner who send back their box now should be getting a replacement that should work better. They will most probably swap out the bad DVD player - and that should take care of the scratching.

On a side not - about the PS3 disks. I am amazed at the resilience of the BR disk coating. All my DVD's on my PS2 had some form of scratching - some of them are a bit - shall we say - challenges in loading on the PS2. OK - that is with heavy usages - but it is a little bit annoying to have to carefully clean the surface every time. Well - the PS3 are reading all of them without any problems, and does not add to the scratches - or what I can see. But the BR disks (up to 4 games now - R:FOM, Pirates of the Carribean, Trasnformers, Motorstorm), they just keep on looking like new. I check them constantly - and not a visible scratch at all. I have never seen anything like it. Play for hours, and I expect that a minor scratch or some evidence of surface wear would show. Nothing. Nada. Ziltch. They look perfect. Sony did an amazing job with the BR. This is how DVD should work.

Maybe you XB360 owners should petition MS to get your disks coated with the same surface coating that is on BR disks. I mean - it is out of this world. Not one of the disks have shown any mark yet. All looks as-if new. I am certain this would solve your disk scratching woes.