Bethesda Doesn't Respect PC Gamers

Bethesda doesn’t respect PC players, but they aren’t the only ones to blame.

[kevnb]

They arent above screwing any group of gamers only, just look at bethesda games on ps3. Or even more recently, fallout 4 runs like garbage on current gen consoles.

[Allsystemgamer]

Their engine just sucks. It's extremely outdated. They won't spend the money to make a new one because people buy their games anyway.

Fallout 4 ran sub 30fps on my PC yet I run bf1 well over 60 with no dips.

[generic-user-name]

I was about to say it's PS gamers that they don't respect. Between terrible PS ports (especially the shocking state of Skyrim), publicly attacking Sony and giving Skyrim SE to PC gamers as a free update...

In Bethesda's mind it's PC>MS>Sony and I'm sure Sony will be bumped down to 4th place once they start making games on the Switch.

Bethesda make amazing worlds, great characters and tell fantastic stories but on a technical level, they are garbage, so many other games put them to shame, I couldn't believe in FO4 I still can't climb a ladder without a loading screen.

[ONESHOTV2]

The reason we got skyrim free is because we didn't really need the update unlike console only gamers

[generic-user-name]

@ONESHOTV2

Free on PC
$60 on consoles

This isn't fair no matter how you justify it. I mean, if you didn't need it on PC then why did they even bother giving it to you in the first place?

[Dasteru]

@generic-user-name:

Becuase it doesn't really provide anything the PC version didn't already have. It is essentially just a 64bit patch. The console versions are a full port to the current gen.

[UltraNova]

Totaly agree. Bethesda has been taking advantage of their hugely popular IPs for along time now. Its time they replaced their ancient engine and start doing some real QC before they release their damn games.

[game4funz]

Well there are perks to being a pc gamer. But SE isn't anything special on pc. There are mods that are superior already. Pc gamers would probably not buy it since for many it may even be a downgrade.
Blame lack of backwards compatibility for remaster bullcrap

[Lunanella]

@generic-user-name

The "free game" on PC was only actually FREE if you owned all DLC prior to the release of SSE, which means lots of people bought Dawnguard, Hearthfire and Dragonborn then (they even became top-sellers on Steam for some time, which means the "free game" wasn't indeed free for every PC gamer out there).

I see SSE as more of an update to an outdated game (for those of us who play on PC). I could only play and enjoy Skyrim when mods were installed, but the 32bit engine made the game way too unstable and, eventually, unplayable (how ironic). The 64bit engine is the only real reason why PC gamers would want SSE, and Bethesda knows that. It's the major difference from the original game and the only one that actually matters, since SSE is still filled with the same bugs as Skyrim. Hence the free "upgrade", for a short time.

Since Skyrim ran pretty crappily on PS3, it is to be expected that they would release a remastered version and charge for it, under "next gen" terms.

Bethesda doesn't love PC gamers more and most. In fact, it's as though it secretly despises all of us gamers alike, no matter what platform you choose as your own.

[generic-user-name]

You say that like tonnes of PS360 gamers didn't own all the DLC too.

"I could only play and enjoy Skyrim when mods were installed, but the 32bit engine made the game way too unstable and, eventually, unplayable (how ironic)."

Man, there was no talk before Skyrim SE about Skyrim being unplayable on PC with mods.

[Lunanella]

@generic-user-name

Hum, yes, there was. Obviously not in your circles or maybe not even here, but on Nexus Mods there were thousands of people who could barely keep the game running with or without mods. If it ran, the crashes to desktop were frequent and, most of the times, save games got corrupted beyond repair. I'm a modder, I know my way around the Creation Kit etc., AND I still had issues with Skyrim eventually becoming unplayable. Yet, some very gifted and generous people created tools and assets that would allow us PC gamers to have a nearly issue-free experience in the 32bit version of the game... Something Bethesda should have done from the very beginning. Not only did the port to 64bit fixed those issues, but it allowed me to say, now, that I'm running around Skyrim with over 70 mods installed and NO crashes, NO corrupt saves, NO lag, even with 2k-4k textures. In my experience/opinion, that was unheard of before SSE. But that's it... That's pretty much the only change between the games. The visuals, the textures, the colors and even the bug fixes... Those were not news for those who played a modded game. The only major reason why I and many others even thought about SSE is the 64bit deal, and that alone. Bethesda knows that.

So, giving us a free upgrade to the improved version of Skyrim - ONLY IF WE OWNED ALL DLC prior to the release of the game - was, in my opinion, just a way to make more money while disguising it as a good gesture for their fans.

Sorry if this is huge and/or makes no sense to you. We can't all agree on everything. But it's pretty obvious that Bethesda doesn't respect any of its fans, no matter the plaftorm.

[Bigpappy]

I play their games on Xbox, including Fallout4. I have had no issues except for Morrowind crashing. Morrowind was and is my favorite game of all times... even with all the glitches.

[opinionated]

Sounds like a case of "returning the favor". Do PC gamers respect anyone?

[Hellforged_Savant]

A few. Not enough admittedly, but some do. Speaking personally, I don't enjoy consoles as much as I used to, but I can understand and respect why others favour it over gaming PC.

[Princess_Pilfer]

Uh, yeah. Companies that treat us well instead of chaining our performance down with crappy ports or forced parity with consoles (when our machines can handle significantly more than they can) and people who don't make stupid claims (like implying that PC gamers don't respect anyone or claiming that PC gaming is more expensive without bothering to factor in the cost of online over a console lifecycle that adds a good 400 USD to the consoles 400 USD price tag over an 8 year span, or trying to factor in the price of a moniter when PCs hook up to TVs just as well as consoles hook up to moniters)

[opinionated]

Don't get mad.. It's not a stupid claim, Hellforged is a PC gamer and he can admit that his brethren are punks sometimes.

There are exceptions to every rule but it doesn't change the generalization that the PC enthusiast crowd are some of the most self-centered, snotty consumers in the business.

I said nothing about it being too expensive. I'd argue the opposite actually, PC gaming is dirt cheap after the initial investment. It's dirt cheap because that's the only way it works. The "pay what you want" models where gamers pay 3 dollars for 200 dollars worth of software. That's what I mean by respect. PC gamers (generally) don't care about anything but themselves. Don't be surprised when the favor is returned.

[Princess_Pilfer]

Did I say Pc gamers could be jerks? No, I didn't, literally everyone is capable of being an elietist jackwagon.

Put up stastics to verify that claim.

Uh, no? Specific humble bundle packages (which are often sponsored by the publisher BTW, just as the flash sales on PSN are) are not a lack of respect. Wanting to get a good deal well after the company has made 90%+ of the profit they're ever going to make is not a lack of respect. If you want to call that a lack of respect I would direct you to the sales of used games where nobody but gamestop makes any money, and then I would call you an idiot because you're allowed to buy literally everything else in a way that doesn't profit the company that made it (ie used) so why should games be different?

[Mr-Writer]

"console lifecycle that adds a good 400 USD to the consoles 400 USD price tag over an 8 year span,"

Which also includes 192 games which when you divide $480 by 192 equates to $2.5 per game.

And that's only if you own a PS4.

Own a X1 and that's 384 games with that online sub.

A few years ago your comparison would of been valid, but now it's not as both Sony and MS include games.

[opinionated]

I don't need statistics, you said it yourself. You get half assed ports and forced parity with consoles when a PC gamers machine can be at least twice as powerful. Why is this? Devs are lazy, right? They have no respect for you, right? They do this just to piss you off? That's the typical answer of a self-centered PC fanboy who can't see the bigger picture. That's all I'm saying. I see them more often than I see reasonable people like hellforged.

Yeah most wait until "90% of the profits have been made" before they pick up the game. I wasn't talking about publishers when I said lacking respect. I don't blame them for drastically dropping prices on PC as soon as possible. That's the PC gamers mindset, why pay full price for anything? That's why it's dirt cheap and that's why you get cheap ports and console parity. If you were worth the effort it wouldn't be like that, it's that simple. No stats needed. You treat them like an afterthought and they return the favor. Psn users pay for those discounts through a service.

I agree about used games, I don't partake in that myself but it's obviously not a huge deal. Developers still focus on console sales. If it's not something I buy full retail I wait for a price drop. I'm buying new regardless.

[Princess_Pilfer]

@ Mr

-WriterYeah, PC has way, way more completely free games than PS+ is capable of providing simply because literally anyone can get a game up on PC and with the age of the games you're likely to see on PS+ you could likely get those same games (and many more besides) at a similar price on PC, also that's a misleading premise. How many of those games do you actually play? If the answer isn't "all of them" then you've paid that 2.5 dollars per game for nothing.

[Princess_Pilfer]

@Opinionated

You're an idiot. There is no other excuse for making a claim to a stastical fact and also claiming you don't need stastics to prove your claim.

The bigger picture is that they don't want console players to feel like they got the inferior version. Well guess ****ing what, even *with* forced parity and crappy ports they *still* get the inferior version most of the time, because we can unlock framerates, fix bugs and run the game with better textures. There is no legitimate excuse for things like forced parity. You buy a console, you are buying inferior hardware and get inferior visuals compared to what a more powerful machine could do, and you (and everyone else) need to deal with it just like I have to deal with the fact that people running dual 1080s get better visuals and framerates than I do.

PSN users pay SONY, not the publisher, for discounts, and do you not see the hilarious contradiction in paying for a discount?

In fact, we don't treat them like an afterthought anymore than console players do. If console players were oh so concerned about maximising profits for publishers then Gamestop would have died out a very long time ago (seeing as used games, which are almost pure profit for them, are their primary advantage over other retailers and their entire busniess model revolves around them.) The reason prices for PC games drop so fast is because there are like 6 different online distributors all competing for the same market so they can take a cut (steam, gog, gmg, ect) and the only way they're going to make themselves stand out as the place to buy games is with better prices. (Kinda like how gamestop gets people to come in now isn't it?)

[opinionated]

@pirate

You're a cunty PC gamer that proves my claim. Only an asshole in denial would demand statistics when someone asks if PC gamers respect anyone. Like the first response said, very few. It's a general known fact how you are. What kind of statistics do you need to accept it moron? "86.3% of PC enthusiasts are cheap with insufferable personalities: here's the scientific link" lol.

LMAO typical blame shifting response. "It's the consoles fault boohoo"lol. Get over yourself and stop crying if you have the superior version. What are you bitching about exactly? What is the purpose of articles like these? Kinda voids it out, right?

Sony pays the publisher for plus games. We pay Sony for plus, there is no contradiction stupid. Regular flash sales don't see a 2000% increase like PC does. That's what PC gamers wait for regularly, they expect it.

GameStop wouldn't have any used games to sell if people didn't buy games dummy. GameStop is used to trade in mostly. A pawn shop for suckers. "Here's 5 games so I can get this new one.". They also sell new games though so it's not like it's all they do.

Bullshit lmao. Six different markets my ass, you're so full of it. Steam = PC gaming. The only reason you would go to origin is for an EA exclusive, likewise for the Microsoft store. That's not competition.... as much as I love gog there is no contest, to suggest so is laughable. They go low fast to get in the PC gamers level. It's really that simple, like your asshole excuses.

[Princess_Pilfer]

@ Opinionated

No you make a claim to a stastical fact, you post stastical evidence, If you don't you're just making crap up. I could make exactly the same claim that you did but replace PC with Console and then cite tons of examples and it would still be a BS claim.

We have the superior version but quite often because modders go out of their ways to fix it and not because the devs decided to actually take advantage of our more powerful hardware.

I didn't compare steam sales to PS+ games, I compared them PSN to flash sales. Sony does not pay to make up the difference between the sale price and the full price. And console gamers regularly wait for used sales and buy the game in a way that sees the publisher/dev get absolutely 0 profit. We still have to buy the thing from them because used games aren't really a thing on PC.

So? That makes literally 0 difference. Tons and tons of people buy the game in a way that doesn't see the publisher/dev prifit at all. Waiting for a sale the company still makes money from is bad buy buying used when they'll make 0 money off it is not?

Also, games that have sales increases of 2000% have long since stopped being sold almost entirely. That's not people waiting for a deal, that's people seeing a deal on an old game and jumping on it. Just as with consoles, most of a PC games sales are typically in the first few months and sales die after that because everyone interested enough to pay more than a couple bucks for it has already done so. It's the same principle the flash sales use, they've already made their money so if they put up an enormous discount on a time they can both make buying the game low risk (encouraging people who might not have tried it to do so,) and make a bunch of money they wouldn't have otherwise from those people.

People who sell valid keys for PC games (that aren't publisher specific) :
GoG.com. Steam. Green Man Gaming. Gamestop. Humble Bundle, Amazon.

And that's just the big ones. Many of those outlets sell steam keys, but Valve only gets a cut if the transaction happens on their platform so all of these places are in direct competition. Unlike physical retailers, none of these places is more than 2 clicks away which means that price is basically the only place they can compete, which drives prices down.

[TheFirstClassic]

Please remember that those who game on pc aren't necessarily pc elitists. The vocal minority just happens to be the loudest. Some of those master race people act like they are in a cult.

[opinionated]

Absolutely.

[game4funz]

The master race sentence is mainly just funny to use.
Console gamers brag about graphics, resolution and fps... And thats where the pc is capable of much better results... And this gave rise to the term master race. Because what console gamers care about or play is already on pc but better.... In some cases no.

I only see the master race come out when talking about performance and such. They're technically not wrong.

[NohansenBoy]

I crap on consoles all the time, but I never crap on the gamer themselves. Insulting a machine isn't as bad as insulting a human being.

[opinionated]

Totally fair, nothing personal. The PC is an open platform, it's not the machines fault that this kind of stuff happens. You would think that an open platform with a massive user base would be dominate but in most cases it's not. There is enough lack of respect to spread around. It's not all on the developers is all, they are business first and foremost.

[TheOptimist]

I would instead say, I shit on the conporates, because they are the ones making the exclusive deals, making customers pay for online play and also making some 'divide and rule among gamers' decisions. But at some point of time, gaming is going to become like movie or any other established industry. Just like there are no 'Theatre exclusive' movies, or studio exclusive songs, platforms are going to disappear if the game developers want to get the most out of their game.

[NohansenBoy]

The companies really should mostly be blamed, I can agree on that. I do like my consoles jailbroken or hacked so maybe I should give the consoles a break, but as always, the gamer is #1.

[game4funz]

Any fanboy of any device doesn't respect the gamers on the other side.

Not just pc gamers.

[opinionated]

That's true. PC fanboys tend to be the worst though. At least Sony fanboys respect each other. PC fanboys are cannibals, the only time they get together is to trash consoles. Then they go back to not respecting anyone.

[Razputin]

They can go suck a long dead dog's dick with that comment. I've had every game they've published in the past 10+ years.

Won't buy shit from them, and will tell many of my friends not to either. Fuck Dishonored 2 and any future title they release. But I do respect they gave me Skyrim Special Edition free. I like that.

[JohnnyPremo]

Okay. Sure. You will keep buying their games. But if saying you wont helps you sleep at night so be it.Oh and if you want to prove it link a pic of your gamer tag/steam name with my user name so I can check to make sure you dont have the game or any future game for that matter hahahahahaha

[Razputin]

Razputin45,

1800 Steam games, all Bethesda published titles up to Skyrim Special Edition, but Doom was the last paid for game.

[Tzuno]

And yet people buy their games as they are and still complain, want to step up? vote with your wallet simple as that but i see the drug it's stronger than you :)

[UCForce]

Always broken at launch, Bethesda ?

[dragonaught007]

Welp its just as bad on consoles look at skyrim limited on ps4 version but thats a bit on sony part rather than bethesda and skyrim is free on pc the remastered thats if you bought the legendary edition that is

[_LarZen_]

I'm gonna get downvoted for this. But here goes. PC is less important for many publishers/developers. Cash is king and more of it is earned elsewhere.

[xPhearR3dx]

In some cases I would agree, but not for Bethesda games. TES and Fallout are amazing games on their own, but the reason people still play and buy them 3-5 years later is because of mods. There's many console players who re-bought Skyrim for mods alone. Mod are totally worth it (at least on Xbox, not so much PS4 right now with no external assets) and extend the life of your game by hundreds and hundreds of hours.

The problem I have with this article is, not once was the actual developer mentioned. Bethesda didn't make Dishonored 2. And the author complains about their new review policy screwing gamers over due to broken or bad games, yet the press still highly praised the game and it sits at a 90 on Metacritic. So really, he's just upset that the game isn't running 100% at launch. Which is 100% understandable, as it should be and not be having such problems. There was people who had some issues with Skyrim and Fallout 4, but the majority of users didn't. If Bethesda didn't respect PC gamers, they wouldn't have given them all Skyrim re-mastered for free. You can argue that with mods it's not that much of an upgrade, but that's the fanboy speaking. The 64bit upgrade was worth it alone, especially for free. It's actually the most stable release I've ever had with a Bethesda Game Studios project. I've already put over 120 hours into it. They also gave many modders (including myself) early access to the game along with the CK. The press didn't even get early access. So I think it's a bit unfair to say they don't respect PC gamers. Could they have made better choices, of course. But saying they don't respect PC gamers is a bit far fetched.

[Vegamyster]

If Steamspy's numbers are to be believed the average 3rd party game sells something in between the Xone & PS4 numbers, most games run fine, in terms of Bethesda they've had issues on all platforms.

[Psychotica]

More is earned elsewhere, however that doesn't mean the PC market isn't lucrative.

[Tetsujin]

Here's an easy solution - don't buy games day 1. Wait it out, and when Bethesda starts to lose money they will have to either listen to the fans, or go under. I read the article, and it's another person expressing their hatred regarding the new policy from Bethesda.

I'm on the fence about it because we as a community have yet to hear WHY they're going this route. There's theories, suggestions, and thoughts, however until we hear from them directly that's all they are - possibilities. I remember before review copies existed you had to go by word of mouth, a demo (Which I prefer honestly), or watch someone else play said game. It's the ones who feel entitled are the ones I'm irritated about - stop buying day 1 or pre-ordering, then the message will get across.

I've mentioned multiple times back in the PS3/360 days - a lot of devs have this "release now and patch later" attitude since consoles now come with HDDs. One thing I can give Nintendo credit for, rarely do you hear of them having to release patches for their games. Yes they get announced early, yes they get multiple delays, however, how often do you hear of their games getting day 1 patches? Or Day 1 dlc? Or a patch to fix something broken/unplayable? Not often. People criticize Nintendo for a lot of things, but their QA is spot on. Kojima with some of his earlier work (prior to MGS 5) is another example of having an excellent QA for his offline work (notice I said offline, not online).

As long as people still buy into their BS, broken games will exist.

[Sciurus_vulgaris]

Bethesda sells games to PC gamers and let's the customers fix the product.

[Pathogenic]

I kinda was looking to buy this game because it looked really good. But the word "Good" needs to be taken for a grain of saly when purchasing a game for PC. Battlefield 1 is an example of a great game but the word "Great" is actually a clear indicator that they shoved it out the door forgetting about the PC players. Honestly it plays great with my two GTX 1080's at 4K @ 60 FPS but for some they can barely play the game or get this error below. Just check the link.

https://forums.battlefield....

Over 447.2K people are looking for a solution to this Directx Error. Post Patch has released new errors added to the original problem not fixed. After seeing the reviews and seeing the crippling performance from other PC users livestreams it makes me think that QA testing is being overlooked on PC. Something needs to change.

[bean59]

Yeah I remember how much the fps used to dip as soon as you enter the city in fallout 4. They need to upgrade their engine badly.

[Dan_scruggs]

I think I hear a baby crying. Nope just the internet again.

[PolishWingedHussar]

Bethesda doesn't just dislike PC gamers, they hate the press as well thanks to their new press review policy. Way to piss off not just a huge portion of gamers, but the press who help encourage gamers to buy/support Bethesda games.

[Derceto]

Um, pretty sure Bethesda doesn't respect anyone. Much less PC gamers. This isn't news.

[mastershredder]

Mmmmhhmmm here we go again. Oddly people are still enjoying their own experiences. Wonder why?

[Silber]

The Game totaly running fine with me. I do not get all the fuzz about it.

[Psychotica]

fuzz? It's running perfectly fine for me too.

[JohnnyPremo]

Bethesda only published the game. Why are you guys not blaming the developer?

[KyRo]

Im so glad people are finally waking up to Bethesda. They are average at best developers that get a free pass if the title has Fallout or ES in the title. The games can be subpar and a glitch filled, barely 15 fps mess with awful combat if you not using the Vat system and get GOTY awards... (Fallout 3, disagree all you want).

The companies script and story writters are the only ones who deserve credit tbh but you will still all go out like a zombie and buy the bext bethesda game and you wonder why they keep a broken engine and keep making broken games....

[game4funz]

Haven't had trouble with any of their games. Granted I am waiting till they fix dishonored 2.

Bethesda isn't necessarily the one to blame. It's more the studios that created the games.

[esmittystud101]

Bethesda is the most overrated open world developer there is. They make these massive world's......and everyone drools over them. The downside to all of there maps/games..........they run horrible.

Bethesda players just hand the money over and it doesn't matter to them what they get.